Nursing and crying (confusion??)

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My DS is now 15.5 weeks old. I went back to work when he was 12 weeks old and he started taking
EBM in a bottle during the day. Prior to returning to work, I gave him one bottle of EBM a day
for a couple of weeks. He's not very good at it (or doesn't want to be very good at it) and
only takes around 11 ounces during the day even though I'm gone for about 11 hours.

Over the last couple of weeks, he starts crying whenever I try to nurse him. Usually, he
latches on and then pulls away immediately and starts crying. Sometimes, he'll go back and suck
a couple times more and then scream again. Other times, as soon as I recline him into a nursing
position, he starts crying. To get him to eat, I have to rock him nearly to sleep and then
latch him on - he'll eat like a champ when I do this. It also works sometimes to move him in to
the cradle hold and rock and speak to him quietly for a few minutes while he sucks his thumb
and relaxes. Then, I can slip the thumb out and move the nipple in and he'll eat. It's really
worrying me because I know he needs to eat quite a bit during the couple of hours in the
evening that we spend together. Once he settles down to business, he eats ALOT, but it's
causing a lot of stress to get to that point.

Is this nipple confusion or something else? Is there anyway to combat this? It makes it very
awkward to NIP (especially in front of family) because it looks like I'm trying to force an
evil boobie on the poor, innocent baby.

Manda
Working and pumping for a baby who doesn't seem to appreciate it...

[HollyLewis]

>only takes around 11 ounces during the day even though I'm gone for about 11
>hours.

That's actually pretty normal. Plenty of babies do take more, but 1 ounce per
hour you're gone is the low end of the normal range.

>Over the last couple of weeks, he starts crying whenever I try to nurse him.
>Usually, he
>latches on and then pulls away immediately and starts crying. Sometimes,
>he'll go back and suck
>a couple times more and then scream again. Other times, as soon as I recline
>him into a nursing
>position, he starts crying.

This could be bottle preference. That means he's gotten used to the faster,
easier flow from the bottle and doesn't want to have to work as hard as he must
in order to feed from the breast. The only real cure is to stop offering
bottles, which I presume isn't possible in your situation, but definitely do
not give him a bottle, ever, when you are not at work.

It could also just be one of those things. A lot of babies have a phase of
this kind of behavior somewhere between 3 and 5 months, and when it happened to
me I suddenly understood why so many moms think there is something wrong with
their milk! (And I had not yet gone back to work; DS had had only a few
bottles at the time.) I haven't a clue why babies do this, and I've never
heard a plausible explanation, but it is a temporary phase. Really the only
thing you can do is try to relax and not let it get to you, because stress can
inhibit letdown, and continue doing whatever seems to work to calm him down and
get him to latch. You might have to stop NIP for a short while. Most likely
this behavior will disappear within a week or so.

Holly
Mom to Camden, 2.5 yrs
EDD #2 6/8/04

[[email protected]]

HollyLewis > wrote:
>>only takes around 11 ounces during the day even though I'm gone for about 11
>>hours.

> That's actually pretty normal. Plenty of babies do take more, but 1 ounce per
> hour you're gone is the low end of the normal range.

I know he's not starving, but it still concerns me. All the calculators say he needs something
like 40 oz a day! Since he sleeps all night, it's hard to imagine that he's getting that much.

>>Over the last couple of weeks, he starts crying whenever I try to nurse him.
>>Usually, he
>>latches on and then pulls away immediately and starts crying. Sometimes,
>>he'll go back and suck
>>a couple times more and then scream again. Other times, as soon as I recline
>>him into a nursing
>>position, he starts crying.

> This could be bottle preference. That means he's gotten used to the faster,
> easier flow from the bottle and doesn't want to have to work as hard as he must
> in order to feed from the breast. The only real cure is to stop offering
> bottles, which I presume isn't possible in your situation, but definitely do
> not give him a bottle, ever, when you are not at work.

I really have a hard time believing that it's bottle preference. He really hates the bottle.
His daycare teachers have to coax him to take every bottle. He's also very inefficient at it
and it takes him about 30 minutes to eat 4 ounces. By the time he's done, he's exhausted and
sleeps for a couple of hours.

> It could also just be one of those things. A lot of babies have a phase of
> this kind of behavior somewhere between 3 and 5 months, and when it happened to
> me I suddenly understood why so many moms think there is something wrong with
> their milk! (And I had not yet gone back to work; DS had had only a few
> bottles at the time.) I haven't a clue why babies do this, and I've never
> heard a plausible explanation, but it is a temporary phase. Really the only
> thing you can do is try to relax and not let it get to you, because stress can
> inhibit letdown, and continue doing whatever seems to work to calm him down and
> get him to latch. You might have to stop NIP for a short while. Most likely
> this behavior will disappear within a week or so.

I sure hope it disappears soon. It's so frustrating. I had visions of returning home from
work to my happy little nursling who would latch on with glee - instead he acts like I'm trying
to abuse him! Thank you for trying to reassure me!

> Holly
> Mom to Camden, 2.5 yrs
> EDD #2 6/8/04

[Larry McMahan]

Manda,

You are seeing the beginnings of bottle preference.

I have two suggestions:

1. If you are not co-sleeping now, you need to start. This will give him
more nursing time during the night and will become more accustomed to
nursing. The way it is now, he has more bottle time during the (24hr)
day than breast time. This is not a good prospect for the future.

2. For the same reasons, on the days that your are off, you need to
nurse exclusively and not bottle feed at all.

Good luck,
Larry

writes:
: My DS is now 15.5 weeks old. I went back to work when he was 12 weeks old and he started taking
: EBM in a bottle during the day. Prior to returning to work, I gave him one bottle of EBM a day
: for a couple of weeks. He's not very good at it (or doesn't want to be very good at it) and
: only takes around 11 ounces during the day even though I'm gone for about 11 hours.

: Over the last couple of weeks, he starts crying whenever I try to nurse him. Usually, he
: latches on and then pulls away immediately and starts crying. Sometimes, he'll go back and suck
: a couple times more and then scream again. Other times, as soon as I recline him into a nursing
: position, he starts crying. To get him to eat, I have to rock him nearly to sleep and then
: latch him on - he'll eat like a champ when I do this. It also works sometimes to move him in to
: the cradle hold and rock and speak to him quietly for a few minutes while he sucks his thumb
: and relaxes. Then, I can slip the thumb out and move the nipple in and he'll eat. It's really
: worrying me because I know he needs to eat quite a bit during the couple of hours in the
: evening that we spend together. Once he settles down to business, he eats ALOT, but it's
: causing a lot of stress to get to that point.

: Is this nipple confusion or something else? Is there anyway to combat this? It makes it very
: awkward to NIP (especially in front of family) because it looks like I'm trying to force an
: evil boobie on the poor, innocent baby.

: Manda
: Working and pumping for a baby who doesn't seem to appreciate it...

[Phoebe & Allyson]

wrote:

> HollyLewis > wrote:
>
>>Plenty of babies do take more, but 1 ounce per
>>hour you're gone is the low end of the normal range.
>>
>
> All the calculators say he needs something
> like 40 oz a day!

What calculators are you looking at?
http://www.kellymom.com/bf/pumping/milkcalc.html#howmuch
says 19-30 ounces is normal for a 1 to 6 month old baby. (I
found one that said a 16 pound baby needs 43 ounces of milk
a day, which I don't believe for one instant. If you figure
8 "meals" a day, that's more than 5 ounces each - and I
can't imagine that Caterpillar can suck down 5 ounces in the
5 minutes she nurses.)

Phoebe :)
--
yahoo address is unread - substitute mailbolt

[Tine Andersen]

"Phoebe & Allyson" > wrote in message
...
> wrote:
>
> > HollyLewis > wrote:
> >
> >>Plenty of babies do take more, but 1 ounce per
> >>hour you're gone is the low end of the normal range.
> >>
> >
> > All the calculators say he needs something
> > like 40 oz a day!
>
> What calculators are you looking at?
> http://www.kellymom.com/bf/pumping/milkcalc.html#howmuch
> says 19-30 ounces is normal for a 1 to 6 month old baby. (I
> found one that said a 16 pound baby needs 43 ounces of milk
> a day, which I don't believe for one instant. If you figure
> 8 "meals" a day, that's more than 5 ounces each - and I
> can't imagine that Caterpillar can suck down 5 ounces in the
> 5 minutes she nurses.)
>

Another rule of thumb here says that a baby should have 1/7 of its weight
each day. 7 kg => 1000 ml of BM/whatever. 40 oz is aprox 1120 ml. Depending
on the weight of the baby it could be right.

Tine, Denmark