Fern5827
August 14th 03, 08:07 PM
FWD msg
Subject: Re: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony spanking* Teen sides w Dad
From: "Life Coach Steve"
Date: 8/11/2003 12:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: >
"Brian" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Life Coach Steve wrote:
>
> > "Brian" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Ignore steve, its what most of us do.
> > >
> >
> > Brian,
> >
> > You might not like R. Steve, what he says or what he stands for...
> > but I am hoping you are attempting to argue that beating your child
> > with a belt is an acceptable way to raise a child, even one who sneaks
out
> > at night.
>
> And I'm hoping that you are not saying that beating a child is acceptable.
> I do, of course, differentiate between beating and spanking. Beating is
when mom
> or dad comes home from work angry and takes it out on the kid. Spanking
is,
> you've tried talking and other non-physical methods, and they have not
worked,
> and you believe that the issue is important enough to spank.
No... a word was inadvertantly dropped... pre-coffee thinking... I am NOT
in favor
of beating a child with a belt.
Spanking may, with small children, and with more symbolism than force,
provide some
measure of correction. But hitting an adolescent pretty much never works.
It teaches
that when things in life are really difficult, they can get solved through
physical force.
>
> > While I don't necessarily believe the dad deserved the sentence they
were
> > initially discussing in the court case, to find him not guilty of
anything
> > seems to be sending the message that its just fine to smack our kids
around
> > when
> > the disobey us, and that our children need to fear us, not respect us.
>
> I'm not familiar with the case, beyond what I've heard here.
> But I dont think that they are saying what you claim. As I understand it,
all
> the kid had when the spanking was done was a few welts and a clearer idea
of the
> consequences of his/her actions.
And that when the chips were down, and dad needed to make a point... smack!
> Had there been any injury beyond a few welts and a stinging but, I'd be
first in
> line to lock the father up, and make sure his cell mate bubba knew why he
was
> there.
>
Physical wounds are not the only ones here. The emotional elements may be
far more
scarring than the welts on the backside.
> > Forget about all of that relationship stuff... what a waste of time...
just
> > hit 'em
> > and that will work.
> >
> > While DCFS, especially in the State of Florida (from all I have heard)
is a
> > mess,
>
> Nightmare is more accurate.
> (I lived in fla for several years, and know people who have had to deal
with
> them)
>
> > I would not want their job for all the tea in China. But this is really
not
> > about them, it is about learning how to adequately parent children,
especially
> > teens.
> > Teens can be a real challenge to raise. They challenge authority
constantly,
> > attempt to grab freedom whereever they can, and will push every single
> > boundary we, as parents, establish for them. They are attempting to
become
> > adults. Our
> > job, as parents, is to help them to make better decisions, encourage
their
> > independent thought, all with the aim of growing up to be healthy,
happy,
> > competent adults.
> > Beating them into submitting to us only tells the child they are
incompetent
> > and
> > incapable of making their own decisions.
>
> But a judiciously applied spanking is a good method of teaching those
teens
> (usually when younger) that there are consequences to their actions.
> That doesnt mean you as a parent cant overlook some of the normal teen
> rebelliousness, of course you can. And definately try other methods first.
>
A parent using spanking on their adolescent child is simply saying, "I am
not to
be trusted, dear child, so don't come to me when you have problems, because
it'll be the belt for you." Spanking is almost always more for the spanker
than for
the spankee.
> > Am I saying that a 13 year-old should be sneaking out at night? Nope.
But
> > there has to be some sort of a solution short of hitting her with a belt
to
> > end
> > the nocturnal adventures.
>
> Agree.
> But how many of them had already been tried?
>
If its still happening, not all of them. If a 13 year-old is sneaking out
at night, she is
almost certainly sneaking away from something. What that is I have no
idea -- but
I would almost put money on it.
> >
> >
> > Anyway, Just my two cents.
> >
> > Life Coach Steve
> > www.lifecoachsteve.com
>
> PS, what exactly is a "life coach"
> "Breath two three four, breath two three four...."?
Well, good question -- I work most of the time as a family therapist, and in
my part-time,
I work with people who are in the midst of making major decisions or major
moves, and
need some outside perspective of how to make those moves.
Anyway, Just my two cents.
Life Coach Steve
www.lifecoachsteve.com
Subject: Re: FL jury acquits Dad in *felony spanking* Teen sides w Dad
From: "Life Coach Steve"
Date: 8/11/2003 12:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: >
"Brian" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Life Coach Steve wrote:
>
> > "Brian" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Ignore steve, its what most of us do.
> > >
> >
> > Brian,
> >
> > You might not like R. Steve, what he says or what he stands for...
> > but I am hoping you are attempting to argue that beating your child
> > with a belt is an acceptable way to raise a child, even one who sneaks
out
> > at night.
>
> And I'm hoping that you are not saying that beating a child is acceptable.
> I do, of course, differentiate between beating and spanking. Beating is
when mom
> or dad comes home from work angry and takes it out on the kid. Spanking
is,
> you've tried talking and other non-physical methods, and they have not
worked,
> and you believe that the issue is important enough to spank.
No... a word was inadvertantly dropped... pre-coffee thinking... I am NOT
in favor
of beating a child with a belt.
Spanking may, with small children, and with more symbolism than force,
provide some
measure of correction. But hitting an adolescent pretty much never works.
It teaches
that when things in life are really difficult, they can get solved through
physical force.
>
> > While I don't necessarily believe the dad deserved the sentence they
were
> > initially discussing in the court case, to find him not guilty of
anything
> > seems to be sending the message that its just fine to smack our kids
around
> > when
> > the disobey us, and that our children need to fear us, not respect us.
>
> I'm not familiar with the case, beyond what I've heard here.
> But I dont think that they are saying what you claim. As I understand it,
all
> the kid had when the spanking was done was a few welts and a clearer idea
of the
> consequences of his/her actions.
And that when the chips were down, and dad needed to make a point... smack!
> Had there been any injury beyond a few welts and a stinging but, I'd be
first in
> line to lock the father up, and make sure his cell mate bubba knew why he
was
> there.
>
Physical wounds are not the only ones here. The emotional elements may be
far more
scarring than the welts on the backside.
> > Forget about all of that relationship stuff... what a waste of time...
just
> > hit 'em
> > and that will work.
> >
> > While DCFS, especially in the State of Florida (from all I have heard)
is a
> > mess,
>
> Nightmare is more accurate.
> (I lived in fla for several years, and know people who have had to deal
with
> them)
>
> > I would not want their job for all the tea in China. But this is really
not
> > about them, it is about learning how to adequately parent children,
especially
> > teens.
> > Teens can be a real challenge to raise. They challenge authority
constantly,
> > attempt to grab freedom whereever they can, and will push every single
> > boundary we, as parents, establish for them. They are attempting to
become
> > adults. Our
> > job, as parents, is to help them to make better decisions, encourage
their
> > independent thought, all with the aim of growing up to be healthy,
happy,
> > competent adults.
> > Beating them into submitting to us only tells the child they are
incompetent
> > and
> > incapable of making their own decisions.
>
> But a judiciously applied spanking is a good method of teaching those
teens
> (usually when younger) that there are consequences to their actions.
> That doesnt mean you as a parent cant overlook some of the normal teen
> rebelliousness, of course you can. And definately try other methods first.
>
A parent using spanking on their adolescent child is simply saying, "I am
not to
be trusted, dear child, so don't come to me when you have problems, because
it'll be the belt for you." Spanking is almost always more for the spanker
than for
the spankee.
> > Am I saying that a 13 year-old should be sneaking out at night? Nope.
But
> > there has to be some sort of a solution short of hitting her with a belt
to
> > end
> > the nocturnal adventures.
>
> Agree.
> But how many of them had already been tried?
>
If its still happening, not all of them. If a 13 year-old is sneaking out
at night, she is
almost certainly sneaking away from something. What that is I have no
idea -- but
I would almost put money on it.
> >
> >
> > Anyway, Just my two cents.
> >
> > Life Coach Steve
> > www.lifecoachsteve.com
>
> PS, what exactly is a "life coach"
> "Breath two three four, breath two three four...."?
Well, good question -- I work most of the time as a family therapist, and in
my part-time,
I work with people who are in the midst of making major decisions or major
moves, and
need some outside perspective of how to make those moves.
Anyway, Just my two cents.
Life Coach Steve
www.lifecoachsteve.com