PDA

View Full Version : Sorta stood up to MIL


Megan Byrne
October 22nd 03, 02:11 AM
I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
up your house". Nice, huh?


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Rhiann1048
October 22nd 03, 02:45 AM
>Subject: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: (Megan Byrne)
>Date: Tue, Oct 21, 2003 7:11 PM
>Message-id: >
>
>I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
>when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
>that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
>Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
>2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
>up your house". Nice, huh?
>

Did this chick have siblings growing up? Ask her if she had her own bicycle,
or if her parents only bought one expecting her and her siblling(s) to share it
lest it 'crap up the garage'.

See how *that* flies.

Lori

Rhiann1048
October 22nd 03, 02:45 AM
>Subject: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: (Megan Byrne)
>Date: Tue, Oct 21, 2003 7:11 PM
>Message-id: >
>
>I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
>when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
>that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
>Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
>2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
>up your house". Nice, huh?
>

Did this chick have siblings growing up? Ask her if she had her own bicycle,
or if her parents only bought one expecting her and her siblling(s) to share it
lest it 'crap up the garage'.

See how *that* flies.

Lori

Twinzmommie
October 22nd 03, 01:54 PM
<< "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
up your house". Nice, huh? >><BR><BR>

But yet the hits just keep on coming! Too freaking funny!

Sorry I am laughing at your expense Megan, but you know I relate to this whole
thing only too well!
Michelle
Mommy to Riley Claire & James Michael

Twinzmommie
October 22nd 03, 01:54 PM
<< "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
up your house". Nice, huh? >><BR><BR>

But yet the hits just keep on coming! Too freaking funny!

Sorry I am laughing at your expense Megan, but you know I relate to this whole
thing only too well!
Michelle
Mommy to Riley Claire & James Michael

Megan Byrne
October 22nd 03, 02:39 PM
Lori,
My DH is one of 8......can only imagine all the "crap" MIL had.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 22nd 03, 02:39 PM
Lori,
My DH is one of 8......can only imagine all the "crap" MIL had.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 22nd 03, 02:40 PM
Yes, Michelle, MIL's can only say nice things. LOL


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 22nd 03, 02:40 PM
Yes, Michelle, MIL's can only say nice things. LOL


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Chotii
October 22nd 03, 06:08 PM
"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Lori,
> My DH is one of 8......can only imagine all the "crap" MIL had.

Funnily enough, I'm one of 4 kids, and I don't remember having *anything*
like the pile o' toys currently 'crapping' up my house. I think my parents
just didn't give us many, in part because dad hates clutter, and because we
could play with each other. I'm trying to get rid of some of the current
crop of toys. (Free to good homes!)

--angela

Chotii
October 22nd 03, 06:08 PM
"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Lori,
> My DH is one of 8......can only imagine all the "crap" MIL had.

Funnily enough, I'm one of 4 kids, and I don't remember having *anything*
like the pile o' toys currently 'crapping' up my house. I think my parents
just didn't give us many, in part because dad hates clutter, and because we
could play with each other. I'm trying to get rid of some of the current
crop of toys. (Free to good homes!)

--angela

Anita
October 23rd 03, 04:56 PM
You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk of
being flamed off the planet...

My sister and I are not twins, we are about two years apart. As children we
often received shared gifts. Sure we sometimes fought over them but we did
not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope to
raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.

Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
everything will become clutter.

So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
consistent with the message you're sending them. And second, maybe it's not
really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.

Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.

Anita


"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
> when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
> that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
> Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
> 2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
> up your house". Nice, huh?
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 23rd 03, 04:56 PM
You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk of
being flamed off the planet...

My sister and I are not twins, we are about two years apart. As children we
often received shared gifts. Sure we sometimes fought over them but we did
not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope to
raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.

Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
everything will become clutter.

So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
consistent with the message you're sending them. And second, maybe it's not
really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.

Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.

Anita


"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
> when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
> that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
> Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
> 2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
> up your house". Nice, huh?
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Rhiann1048
October 23rd 03, 05:36 PM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: "Anita"
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 9:56 AM
>Message-id: ogers.com>
>
>You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk
>of
>being flamed off the planet...
>
>My sister and I are not twins,


Which makes your experiences largely irrelelvent to the topic at hand.


we are about two years apart. As children
>we
>often received shared gifts.

What are the chances of a one year old and a 3 year old having equal interest
in the same toy to the point of fighting over it? Not to mention that one of
you was older and was able to more grasp the concept of sharing or taking
turns. This is *not* a fair nor realistic expectation for two 1 year olds.


It is certainly not the same thing as expecting an 8 and 10 year old to share a
book, game, or DVD.



Sure we sometimes fought over them but we
>did
>not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
>truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
>what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope
>to
>raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
>
>Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
>everything will become clutter.


Just because someone wants two of a few particular popular toys doesn't mean
they want two of *everything*. This is, in essence, a bicycle. Did you and
your sister share a bicycle and *never* 'whine' about it? I highly doubt it.

We bought our girls ride on toys for their first birthday as well. They liked
riding them around the house *together*. Having only one would have caused so
many fights that it would have ruined the fun for them.



>
>So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
>about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
>consistent with the message you're sending them.

How about the message that they are *individuals* and deserve to be treated as
such? I hope you can understand that this is far more of an issue for twins
than those who are siblings a couple years apart.



And second, maybe it's
>not
>really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.


As she said this was the traditional gift that this aunt gave to all her nieces
and nephews upon turning one. But she made her children share. Even if she
loved this SIL dearly, don't you think she has the right to be upset that her
children are not treated the same as the rest in the family? *That* is the
issue here. How would you feel if these same people giving you and your
sister gifts to share were giving individual gifts (of equal value to your
joint gift) to the rest of your cousins?




>
>Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
>
>Anita


Back to the OP though. I just thought of something. Does this SIL have more
than one child by any chance? This would be the *perfect* way to illustrate
the point you need to make.

Lori

Rhiann1048
October 23rd 03, 05:36 PM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: "Anita"
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 9:56 AM
>Message-id: ogers.com>
>
>You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk
>of
>being flamed off the planet...
>
>My sister and I are not twins,


Which makes your experiences largely irrelelvent to the topic at hand.


we are about two years apart. As children
>we
>often received shared gifts.

What are the chances of a one year old and a 3 year old having equal interest
in the same toy to the point of fighting over it? Not to mention that one of
you was older and was able to more grasp the concept of sharing or taking
turns. This is *not* a fair nor realistic expectation for two 1 year olds.


It is certainly not the same thing as expecting an 8 and 10 year old to share a
book, game, or DVD.



Sure we sometimes fought over them but we
>did
>not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
>truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
>what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope
>to
>raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
>
>Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
>everything will become clutter.


Just because someone wants two of a few particular popular toys doesn't mean
they want two of *everything*. This is, in essence, a bicycle. Did you and
your sister share a bicycle and *never* 'whine' about it? I highly doubt it.

We bought our girls ride on toys for their first birthday as well. They liked
riding them around the house *together*. Having only one would have caused so
many fights that it would have ruined the fun for them.



>
>So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
>about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
>consistent with the message you're sending them.

How about the message that they are *individuals* and deserve to be treated as
such? I hope you can understand that this is far more of an issue for twins
than those who are siblings a couple years apart.



And second, maybe it's
>not
>really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.


As she said this was the traditional gift that this aunt gave to all her nieces
and nephews upon turning one. But she made her children share. Even if she
loved this SIL dearly, don't you think she has the right to be upset that her
children are not treated the same as the rest in the family? *That* is the
issue here. How would you feel if these same people giving you and your
sister gifts to share were giving individual gifts (of equal value to your
joint gift) to the rest of your cousins?




>
>Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
>
>Anita


Back to the OP though. I just thought of something. Does this SIL have more
than one child by any chance? This would be the *perfect* way to illustrate
the point you need to make.

Lori

Anita
October 23rd 03, 06:00 PM
Then let me make it more relevant: when my twin daughters were one they
received a ride-on toy, just like OPs did. Yes, just one. And we wrote a
thank you note, taught them how to get on it together (I have photographic
evidence) and enjoyed it. A gift does not an individual make. Being an
individual is about character, not about possessions.

I think we'd do better to find ways to demonstrate our children's
individuality in how *we* treat them than by being ungracious and
vindictive.

A.


"Rhiann1048" > wrote in message
...
> >Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
> >From: "Anita"
> >Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 9:56 AM
> >Message-id: ogers.com>
> >
> >You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk
> >of
> >being flamed off the planet...
> >
> >My sister and I are not twins,
>
>
> Which makes your experiences largely irrelelvent to the topic at hand.
>
>
> we are about two years apart. As children
> >we
> >often received shared gifts.
>
> What are the chances of a one year old and a 3 year old having equal
interest
> in the same toy to the point of fighting over it? Not to mention that one
of
> you was older and was able to more grasp the concept of sharing or taking
> turns. This is *not* a fair nor realistic expectation for two 1 year
olds.
>
>
> It is certainly not the same thing as expecting an 8 and 10 year old to
share a
> book, game, or DVD.
>
>
>
> Sure we sometimes fought over them but we
> >did
> >not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
> >truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful
for
> >what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope
> >to
> >raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
> >
> >Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
> >everything will become clutter.
>
>
> Just because someone wants two of a few particular popular toys doesn't
mean
> they want two of *everything*. This is, in essence, a bicycle. Did you
and
> your sister share a bicycle and *never* 'whine' about it? I highly doubt
it.
>
> We bought our girls ride on toys for their first birthday as well. They
liked
> riding them around the house *together*. Having only one would have
caused so
> many fights that it would have ruined the fun for them.
>
>
>
> >
> >So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
> >about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
> >consistent with the message you're sending them.
>
> How about the message that they are *individuals* and deserve to be
treated as
> such? I hope you can understand that this is far more of an issue for
twins
> than those who are siblings a couple years apart.
>
>
>
> And second, maybe it's
> >not
> >really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.
>
>
> As she said this was the traditional gift that this aunt gave to all her
nieces
> and nephews upon turning one. But she made her children share. Even if
she
> loved this SIL dearly, don't you think she has the right to be upset that
her
> children are not treated the same as the rest in the family? *That* is
the
> issue here. How would you feel if these same people giving you and your
> sister gifts to share were giving individual gifts (of equal value to your
> joint gift) to the rest of your cousins?
>
>
>
>
> >
> >Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
> >
> >Anita
>
>
> Back to the OP though. I just thought of something. Does this SIL have
more
> than one child by any chance? This would be the *perfect* way to
illustrate
> the point you need to make.
>
> Lori
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 23rd 03, 06:00 PM
Then let me make it more relevant: when my twin daughters were one they
received a ride-on toy, just like OPs did. Yes, just one. And we wrote a
thank you note, taught them how to get on it together (I have photographic
evidence) and enjoyed it. A gift does not an individual make. Being an
individual is about character, not about possessions.

I think we'd do better to find ways to demonstrate our children's
individuality in how *we* treat them than by being ungracious and
vindictive.

A.


"Rhiann1048" > wrote in message
...
> >Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
> >From: "Anita"
> >Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 9:56 AM
> >Message-id: ogers.com>
> >
> >You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk
> >of
> >being flamed off the planet...
> >
> >My sister and I are not twins,
>
>
> Which makes your experiences largely irrelelvent to the topic at hand.
>
>
> we are about two years apart. As children
> >we
> >often received shared gifts.
>
> What are the chances of a one year old and a 3 year old having equal
interest
> in the same toy to the point of fighting over it? Not to mention that one
of
> you was older and was able to more grasp the concept of sharing or taking
> turns. This is *not* a fair nor realistic expectation for two 1 year
olds.
>
>
> It is certainly not the same thing as expecting an 8 and 10 year old to
share a
> book, game, or DVD.
>
>
>
> Sure we sometimes fought over them but we
> >did
> >not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
> >truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful
for
> >what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope
> >to
> >raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
> >
> >Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
> >everything will become clutter.
>
>
> Just because someone wants two of a few particular popular toys doesn't
mean
> they want two of *everything*. This is, in essence, a bicycle. Did you
and
> your sister share a bicycle and *never* 'whine' about it? I highly doubt
it.
>
> We bought our girls ride on toys for their first birthday as well. They
liked
> riding them around the house *together*. Having only one would have
caused so
> many fights that it would have ruined the fun for them.
>
>
>
> >
> >So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
> >about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
> >consistent with the message you're sending them.
>
> How about the message that they are *individuals* and deserve to be
treated as
> such? I hope you can understand that this is far more of an issue for
twins
> than those who are siblings a couple years apart.
>
>
>
> And second, maybe it's
> >not
> >really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.
>
>
> As she said this was the traditional gift that this aunt gave to all her
nieces
> and nephews upon turning one. But she made her children share. Even if
she
> loved this SIL dearly, don't you think she has the right to be upset that
her
> children are not treated the same as the rest in the family? *That* is
the
> issue here. How would you feel if these same people giving you and your
> sister gifts to share were giving individual gifts (of equal value to your
> joint gift) to the rest of your cousins?
>
>
>
>
> >
> >Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
> >
> >Anita
>
>
> Back to the OP though. I just thought of something. Does this SIL have
more
> than one child by any chance? This would be the *perfect* way to
illustrate
> the point you need to make.
>
> Lori
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Nikolette
October 23rd 03, 06:09 PM
I was wondering if maybe there was a financial issue here? Maybe the SIL
didn't have enough money to buy two? Also, perhaps the MIL saying two of
everything would "crap up the house" was her speaking from experience, since
she did have 8 children . . . it's not clear to me from the OP and I guess
I've missed more posts on this topic, but if the gift was from the SIL maybe
the MIL didn't appreciate you saying something to her about her daughter . .
.. I don't know . . . I've just found that in-laws don't change and the only
thing you can do is be gracious and deal with your emotions inside because
seriously, they DON'T change, and until/if they do it's easier to take them
with a grain of salt . . . don't feel like I'm trying to make you feel in
the wrong, Megan, because I'm not. I understand that MIL/SIL didn't do the
right thing; I just also understand that they're probably never going to.
:( And I certainly sympathize with you, so continue venting here when you
need to! And stand up for yourself when you need to, just remember that
your in-laws see it so differently than you so don't let things get to you
too much, if possible. :)

Nik

"Anita" > wrote in message
ble.rogers.com...
> You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk of
> being flamed off the planet...
>
> My sister and I are not twins, we are about two years apart. As children
we
> often received shared gifts. Sure we sometimes fought over them but we
did
> not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
> truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
> what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope
to
> raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
>
> Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
> everything will become clutter.
>
> So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
> about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
> consistent with the message you're sending them. And second, maybe it's
not
> really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.
>
> Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
>
> Anita
>
>
<snip>

Nikolette
October 23rd 03, 06:09 PM
I was wondering if maybe there was a financial issue here? Maybe the SIL
didn't have enough money to buy two? Also, perhaps the MIL saying two of
everything would "crap up the house" was her speaking from experience, since
she did have 8 children . . . it's not clear to me from the OP and I guess
I've missed more posts on this topic, but if the gift was from the SIL maybe
the MIL didn't appreciate you saying something to her about her daughter . .
.. I don't know . . . I've just found that in-laws don't change and the only
thing you can do is be gracious and deal with your emotions inside because
seriously, they DON'T change, and until/if they do it's easier to take them
with a grain of salt . . . don't feel like I'm trying to make you feel in
the wrong, Megan, because I'm not. I understand that MIL/SIL didn't do the
right thing; I just also understand that they're probably never going to.
:( And I certainly sympathize with you, so continue venting here when you
need to! And stand up for yourself when you need to, just remember that
your in-laws see it so differently than you so don't let things get to you
too much, if possible. :)

Nik

"Anita" > wrote in message
ble.rogers.com...
> You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk of
> being flamed off the planet...
>
> My sister and I are not twins, we are about two years apart. As children
we
> often received shared gifts. Sure we sometimes fought over them but we
did
> not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
> truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
> what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope
to
> raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
>
> Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
> everything will become clutter.
>
> So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
> about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
> consistent with the message you're sending them. And second, maybe it's
not
> really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.
>
> Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
>
> Anita
>
>
<snip>

Rhiann1048
October 23rd 03, 06:39 PM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: "Anita"
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 11:00 AM
>Message-id: ogers.com>
>
>Then let me make it more relevant: when my twin daughters were one they
>received a ride-on toy, just like OPs did. Yes, just one. And we wrote
>a
>thank you note, taught them how to get on it together (I have photographic
>evidence) and enjoyed it.

Mine 'fit' on their scooter together as well. But not comfortably and could
not operate it very well pressed together. I wanted a toy they could use the
way it was intended and help their large motor skills along the way. And
although 2 years+ later they are a little big for them at this point, they
still race each other around from time to time. We got our money's worth and
then some from these toys.

A gift does not an individual make. Being an
>individual is about character, not about possessions.

Being expected to share gifts is just another way that twins are sometimes
lumped together. It doesn't define them. No one said it did. But it is one
way of many that people assume that their individual desires don't matter --
that somehow because they are twins one gift is 'good enough' and they won't
mind sharing. IMO that shows a lack of respect. And I don't think that is
fair to them.

I think you are naive if you think this kind of treatment by others isn't going
to matter to them at some point. *Especially* if they have cousins who are
treated differently and they see that.




>
>I think we'd do better to find ways to demonstrate our children's
>individuality in how *we* treat them than by being ungracious and
>vindictive.
>

Ungracious and vindictive? Wow. It is clear that you missed the point.


Of course our treatment of them effects how they will develop their
individuality. But since they interact with people other than us, it is up to
us -- as their parents -- to stand up for them when they are treated unfairly.
That is all Megan is doing and I applaud her for it. Sometimes standing up for
your kids is more important than being polite.

Lori




>A.

Rhiann1048
October 23rd 03, 06:39 PM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: "Anita"
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 11:00 AM
>Message-id: ogers.com>
>
>Then let me make it more relevant: when my twin daughters were one they
>received a ride-on toy, just like OPs did. Yes, just one. And we wrote
>a
>thank you note, taught them how to get on it together (I have photographic
>evidence) and enjoyed it.

Mine 'fit' on their scooter together as well. But not comfortably and could
not operate it very well pressed together. I wanted a toy they could use the
way it was intended and help their large motor skills along the way. And
although 2 years+ later they are a little big for them at this point, they
still race each other around from time to time. We got our money's worth and
then some from these toys.

A gift does not an individual make. Being an
>individual is about character, not about possessions.

Being expected to share gifts is just another way that twins are sometimes
lumped together. It doesn't define them. No one said it did. But it is one
way of many that people assume that their individual desires don't matter --
that somehow because they are twins one gift is 'good enough' and they won't
mind sharing. IMO that shows a lack of respect. And I don't think that is
fair to them.

I think you are naive if you think this kind of treatment by others isn't going
to matter to them at some point. *Especially* if they have cousins who are
treated differently and they see that.




>
>I think we'd do better to find ways to demonstrate our children's
>individuality in how *we* treat them than by being ungracious and
>vindictive.
>

Ungracious and vindictive? Wow. It is clear that you missed the point.


Of course our treatment of them effects how they will develop their
individuality. But since they interact with people other than us, it is up to
us -- as their parents -- to stand up for them when they are treated unfairly.
That is all Megan is doing and I applaud her for it. Sometimes standing up for
your kids is more important than being polite.

Lori




>A.

Anita
October 23rd 03, 07:08 PM
But Meagan is not standing up for them. She's criticizing her s-i-l to her
m-i-l. This is just going to give her more in-law problems than she already
has (you don't want to get me started on insensitive in-law stories because
we could be here all day and then my blood pressure would rise and my head
would blow off the top of my neck and then my children would be motherless
and in their evil clutches. Also they're coming over this evening, damn
them, so I have to be in the best possible frame of mind. And now I am
praying to God they never find this post! Anyhow...).

Where I got the idea of vindictiveness is from your post saying "Does this
SIL have more than one child by any chance? This would be the *perfect* way
to illustrate the point you need to make." If receiving a single gift for
two children is disrespectful then repeating the deed is also disrespectful.
Why punish the children for their parents' insensitivity?

To me, it makes more sense to demonstrate things by my own actions. For
example, my in-laws are just as insensitive (oops, I think I just felt my bp
rise a notch) but what I do is make sure there are two cakes and I insist
that we sing Happy Birthday once to each child, I make sure I call them each
by name...stuff like that. I've got enough problems without making (worse)
enemies of my in-laws.

OT but does anyone know of a site about in-law rants along the lines of
www.etiquettehell.com? That'd be a fun way to waste some time.

A.

"Rhiann1048" > wrote in message
...
> >Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
> >From: "Anita"
> >Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 11:00 AM
> >Message-id: ogers.com>
> >
> >Then let me make it more relevant: when my twin daughters were one they
> >received a ride-on toy, just like OPs did. Yes, just one. And we wrote
> >a
> >thank you note, taught them how to get on it together (I have
photographic
> >evidence) and enjoyed it.
>
> Mine 'fit' on their scooter together as well. But not comfortably and
could
> not operate it very well pressed together. I wanted a toy they could use
the
> way it was intended and help their large motor skills along the way. And
> although 2 years+ later they are a little big for them at this point, they
> still race each other around from time to time. We got our money's worth
and
> then some from these toys.
>
> A gift does not an individual make. Being an
> >individual is about character, not about possessions.
>
> Being expected to share gifts is just another way that twins are sometimes
> lumped together. It doesn't define them. No one said it did. But it is
one
> way of many that people assume that their individual desires don't
matter --
> that somehow because they are twins one gift is 'good enough' and they
won't
> mind sharing. IMO that shows a lack of respect. And I don't think that
is
> fair to them.
>
> I think you are naive if you think this kind of treatment by others isn't
going
> to matter to them at some point. *Especially* if they have cousins who are
> treated differently and they see that.
>
>
>
>
> >
> >I think we'd do better to find ways to demonstrate our children's
> >individuality in how *we* treat them than by being ungracious and
> >vindictive.
> >
>
> Ungracious and vindictive? Wow. It is clear that you missed the point.
>
>
> Of course our treatment of them effects how they will develop their
> individuality. But since they interact with people other than us, it is
up to
> us -- as their parents -- to stand up for them when they are treated
unfairly.
> That is all Megan is doing and I applaud her for it. Sometimes standing
up for
> your kids is more important than being polite.
>
> Lori
>
>
>
>
> >A.
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 23rd 03, 07:08 PM
But Meagan is not standing up for them. She's criticizing her s-i-l to her
m-i-l. This is just going to give her more in-law problems than she already
has (you don't want to get me started on insensitive in-law stories because
we could be here all day and then my blood pressure would rise and my head
would blow off the top of my neck and then my children would be motherless
and in their evil clutches. Also they're coming over this evening, damn
them, so I have to be in the best possible frame of mind. And now I am
praying to God they never find this post! Anyhow...).

Where I got the idea of vindictiveness is from your post saying "Does this
SIL have more than one child by any chance? This would be the *perfect* way
to illustrate the point you need to make." If receiving a single gift for
two children is disrespectful then repeating the deed is also disrespectful.
Why punish the children for their parents' insensitivity?

To me, it makes more sense to demonstrate things by my own actions. For
example, my in-laws are just as insensitive (oops, I think I just felt my bp
rise a notch) but what I do is make sure there are two cakes and I insist
that we sing Happy Birthday once to each child, I make sure I call them each
by name...stuff like that. I've got enough problems without making (worse)
enemies of my in-laws.

OT but does anyone know of a site about in-law rants along the lines of
www.etiquettehell.com? That'd be a fun way to waste some time.

A.

"Rhiann1048" > wrote in message
...
> >Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
> >From: "Anita"
> >Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 11:00 AM
> >Message-id: ogers.com>
> >
> >Then let me make it more relevant: when my twin daughters were one they
> >received a ride-on toy, just like OPs did. Yes, just one. And we wrote
> >a
> >thank you note, taught them how to get on it together (I have
photographic
> >evidence) and enjoyed it.
>
> Mine 'fit' on their scooter together as well. But not comfortably and
could
> not operate it very well pressed together. I wanted a toy they could use
the
> way it was intended and help their large motor skills along the way. And
> although 2 years+ later they are a little big for them at this point, they
> still race each other around from time to time. We got our money's worth
and
> then some from these toys.
>
> A gift does not an individual make. Being an
> >individual is about character, not about possessions.
>
> Being expected to share gifts is just another way that twins are sometimes
> lumped together. It doesn't define them. No one said it did. But it is
one
> way of many that people assume that their individual desires don't
matter --
> that somehow because they are twins one gift is 'good enough' and they
won't
> mind sharing. IMO that shows a lack of respect. And I don't think that
is
> fair to them.
>
> I think you are naive if you think this kind of treatment by others isn't
going
> to matter to them at some point. *Especially* if they have cousins who are
> treated differently and they see that.
>
>
>
>
> >
> >I think we'd do better to find ways to demonstrate our children's
> >individuality in how *we* treat them than by being ungracious and
> >vindictive.
> >
>
> Ungracious and vindictive? Wow. It is clear that you missed the point.
>
>
> Of course our treatment of them effects how they will develop their
> individuality. But since they interact with people other than us, it is
up to
> us -- as their parents -- to stand up for them when they are treated
unfairly.
> That is all Megan is doing and I applaud her for it. Sometimes standing
up for
> your kids is more important than being polite.
>
> Lori
>
>
>
>
> >A.
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

H Schinske
October 23rd 03, 09:07 PM
wrote:

>Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
>everything will become clutter.

I had that philosophy too, about many things. We had only one swing, only one
bouncy chair, etc. For a long time only one crib. But some toys are just NOT
MEANT to be shared.

--Helen

H Schinske
October 23rd 03, 09:07 PM
wrote:

>Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
>everything will become clutter.

I had that philosophy too, about many things. We had only one swing, only one
bouncy chair, etc. For a long time only one crib. But some toys are just NOT
MEANT to be shared.

--Helen

Julie Seely
October 24th 03, 01:59 AM
Anita --

You had the guts to say what I've been thinking for days, namely "where
is the gratitude?" I simply cannot believe that full-grown adults are
comparing what *their* kids got to what other kids got, when their kids
are far too young to have any awareness. Give me a break.

As for the issue of treating twins as one, these are ONE-YEAR-OLDS!!!!
They have no clue!!! They are not offended!!! Fine, so get them
another ride-on toy so that they each have one, but do you want your
kids to whine every time they think an injustice has been done on a
gift-giving occasion? That's surely not the behavior I want to model to
my kids. Fine, so ideally the in-laws will start buying them individual
gifts at some point, and if it's that important to you, you or
preferably dh can tactfully help them figure it out. But if they
don't? Is it the end of the world? Or do you want your children to
learn how to deal with things graciously? My kids had a joint birthday
party this year (their choice), with four boys and four girls (and five
siblings) attending. Some kids gave C&E each a present, some gave a
shared present, and one gave a present to only one of the kids. Both of
my kids dealt with every gift and every guest graciously. Isn't that
what it's all about???

Their entire lives, different people are going to treat them in
different ways. Part of growing up is learning how to deal with it.
Frankly, I think this is even easier for the b/g pairs, who are
inherently much more different than the same-gender pairs, as ultimately
their interests are more likely to diverge. But now that my kids are 6,
if a relative gave the kids a bike to share for their birthday, I might
think it a bit odd, and yes, we would soon be shopping for a second
bike, but first and foremost, we would be grateful for the gift.
Period.

Oh -- and Anita, can I borrow your flameproof suit?

Julie
Mom to Chris & Erica, 07/97
Anita wrote:
>
> You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk of
> being flamed off the planet...
>
> My sister and I are not twins, we are about two years apart. As children we
> often received shared gifts. Sure we sometimes fought over them but we did
> not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
> truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
> what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope to
> raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
>
> Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
> everything will become clutter.
>
> So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
> about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
> consistent with the message you're sending them. And second, maybe it's not
> really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.
>
> Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
>
> Anita
>
> "Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
> > when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
> > that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
> > Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
> > 2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
> > up your house". Nice, huh?
> >
> >
> > ~Megan~
> > Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> > Born September 28, 2002
> >
> > www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
> >
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Julie Seely
October 24th 03, 01:59 AM
Anita --

You had the guts to say what I've been thinking for days, namely "where
is the gratitude?" I simply cannot believe that full-grown adults are
comparing what *their* kids got to what other kids got, when their kids
are far too young to have any awareness. Give me a break.

As for the issue of treating twins as one, these are ONE-YEAR-OLDS!!!!
They have no clue!!! They are not offended!!! Fine, so get them
another ride-on toy so that they each have one, but do you want your
kids to whine every time they think an injustice has been done on a
gift-giving occasion? That's surely not the behavior I want to model to
my kids. Fine, so ideally the in-laws will start buying them individual
gifts at some point, and if it's that important to you, you or
preferably dh can tactfully help them figure it out. But if they
don't? Is it the end of the world? Or do you want your children to
learn how to deal with things graciously? My kids had a joint birthday
party this year (their choice), with four boys and four girls (and five
siblings) attending. Some kids gave C&E each a present, some gave a
shared present, and one gave a present to only one of the kids. Both of
my kids dealt with every gift and every guest graciously. Isn't that
what it's all about???

Their entire lives, different people are going to treat them in
different ways. Part of growing up is learning how to deal with it.
Frankly, I think this is even easier for the b/g pairs, who are
inherently much more different than the same-gender pairs, as ultimately
their interests are more likely to diverge. But now that my kids are 6,
if a relative gave the kids a bike to share for their birthday, I might
think it a bit odd, and yes, we would soon be shopping for a second
bike, but first and foremost, we would be grateful for the gift.
Period.

Oh -- and Anita, can I borrow your flameproof suit?

Julie
Mom to Chris & Erica, 07/97
Anita wrote:
>
> You seem to have a lot of support here so I am writing this at the risk of
> being flamed off the planet...
>
> My sister and I are not twins, we are about two years apart. As children we
> often received shared gifts. Sure we sometimes fought over them but we did
> not whine about it because we did not have a sense of entitlement. The
> truth is that nobody owed us a gift, or two gifts, so we were grateful for
> what we got. We said thank you and enjoyed what was given to us. I hope to
> raise my kids --twins and singletons-- to do the same.
>
> Maybe your m-i-l didn't express it eloquently but she's right. Two of
> everything will become clutter.
>
> So...what am I really trying to say? Well, first, maybe you should think
> about the values you'd like to pass on to your children and whether it is
> consistent with the message you're sending them. And second, maybe it's not
> really about the kids but about how you feel about your in-laws.
>
> Must dash...I've got a flame-proof suit I need to put on.
>
> Anita
>
> "Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I asked my MIL to drop off some Dimetap today for Lexi's runny nose, so
> > when she came over I pointed out the new ride-on Hippo. I then told her
> > that yes, they love their fire truck, but they fight over it constantly.
> > Charlene (SIL) of all people should know that you cannot give one toy to
> > 2 toddlers. MIL's response was "If you had 2 of everything it would crap
> > up your house". Nice, huh?
> >
> >
> > ~Megan~
> > Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> > Born September 28, 2002
> >
> > www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
> >
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:24 AM
Lori,
Thank you for taking care of that, LOL. I can always count on you to
"stick up" for me! :)

This SIL, who I really don't care for, is pg with her 1st child, due in
April.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:24 AM
Lori,
Thank you for taking care of that, LOL. I can always count on you to
"stick up" for me! :)

This SIL, who I really don't care for, is pg with her 1st child, due in
April.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:27 AM
Anita,
I was in no way ungracious. We thanked SIL on the spot AND sent a Thank
You note, as I did with everyone. My kids loved this toy so much, that
they fought over it. I think they have the right to have their own. They
also ride the toys together. I think that you shouldn't make negative
assumptions. I am not going to turn around and treat my new neice or
nephew badly, b/c I didn't agree with the present his/her mother gave my
kids. THAT would be vindictive.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:27 AM
Anita,
I was in no way ungracious. We thanked SIL on the spot AND sent a Thank
You note, as I did with everyone. My kids loved this toy so much, that
they fought over it. I think they have the right to have their own. They
also ride the toys together. I think that you shouldn't make negative
assumptions. I am not going to turn around and treat my new neice or
nephew badly, b/c I didn't agree with the present his/her mother gave my
kids. THAT would be vindictive.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:29 AM
Nik,
Thanks for your post. I am sure ML didn't like me talking about her
daughter. MIL and I do not mix well. Not a positive thing to say about
MIL. As for SIL, she is quite well off, but very "tight".


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:29 AM
Nik,
Thanks for your post. I am sure ML didn't like me talking about her
daughter. MIL and I do not mix well. Not a positive thing to say about
MIL. As for SIL, she is quite well off, but very "tight".


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:32 AM
Anita,
Your trying to make a jole of things does not help the fact that you
have no idea what you are talking about. Why start if you know it wall
cause a "flame war"? If you just responded to stir up something, then
just stop! My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:32 AM
Anita,
Your trying to make a jole of things does not help the fact that you
have no idea what you are talking about. Why start if you know it wall
cause a "flame war"? If you just responded to stir up something, then
just stop! My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:33 AM
Helen, I have the same idea, too. If anyone dosen't like clutter, it's
an OCD neatfreak like me. No, I really don't need a firetruck and pink
hippo in my living room, but comes with the territory! :)


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:33 AM
Helen, I have the same idea, too. If anyone dosen't like clutter, it's
an OCD neatfreak like me. No, I really don't need a firetruck and pink
hippo in my living room, but comes with the territory! :)


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:37 AM
Julie,
The whole onepresent thing just put the 'icing on the cake' as to how my
IL's treat my kids compared to the other nephew's. My kids are treated
like **** time and time again. You tell me, why is it fair that all the
other nephews be given their OWN ride-on toy for their first b-day, but
my kids don't. Is that fair? No, my kids don't know what "fair" is, but
when is the way they are treated going to stop? They are innocent. Alkl
the gratitude in the world is there. I thanked SIL for the gift and I
meant it. I was hoping she would get them a ride-on toy.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 03:37 AM
Julie,
The whole onepresent thing just put the 'icing on the cake' as to how my
IL's treat my kids compared to the other nephew's. My kids are treated
like **** time and time again. You tell me, why is it fair that all the
other nephews be given their OWN ride-on toy for their first b-day, but
my kids don't. Is that fair? No, my kids don't know what "fair" is, but
when is the way they are treated going to stop? They are innocent. Alkl
the gratitude in the world is there. I thanked SIL for the gift and I
meant it. I was hoping she would get them a ride-on toy.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Rhiann1048
October 24th 03, 04:22 AM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: Julie Seely
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 6:59 PM
>Message-id: >
>
>Anita --
>
>You had the guts to say what I've been thinking for days, namely "where
>is the gratitude?" I simply cannot believe that full-grown adults are
>comparing what *their* kids got to what other kids got, when their kids
>are far too young to have any awareness. Give me a break.

And *I* simply cannot believe that a parent would sit quietly by and smile when
their children are deliberately slighted in this way. If you do not nip this is
the bud *now*, it will not change.

What happens when they are 10 and they are talking to their cousins about the
great DVD Aunt whatever bought them and they find that their cousins each got
one and they had to share. You don't think that will hurt their feelings?
This isn't about being rude but about protecting your kids from being hurt by
thoughtless relatives. They will be hurt plenty by others in their lives. It
isn't too much to expect some courtesy from *family*.

I want to be clear about one thing. I am not saying that it is never
appropriate to give a joint gift. Not at all. My girls have been given
several joint gifts from various relatives and friends -- things like blocks,
videos, a Little People house, and sidewalk chalk. But these are all things
they can play with alone or *together*. And those kinds of gifts are
wonderful.

What makes Megan's situation different is the choice of gift and the way she
shortchanged her kids compared to other cousins -- IMO that warrants something
more than merely being grateful.




>
>As for the issue of treating twins as one, these are ONE-YEAR-OLDS!!!!
>They have no clue!!! They are not offended!!!

Not yet anyway. So you would rather just sit by quietly and not say anything
until they *do* understand? How about nipping this in the bud *now* so
feelings aren't hurt later on.


Lori

Rhiann1048
October 24th 03, 04:22 AM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: Julie Seely
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 6:59 PM
>Message-id: >
>
>Anita --
>
>You had the guts to say what I've been thinking for days, namely "where
>is the gratitude?" I simply cannot believe that full-grown adults are
>comparing what *their* kids got to what other kids got, when their kids
>are far too young to have any awareness. Give me a break.

And *I* simply cannot believe that a parent would sit quietly by and smile when
their children are deliberately slighted in this way. If you do not nip this is
the bud *now*, it will not change.

What happens when they are 10 and they are talking to their cousins about the
great DVD Aunt whatever bought them and they find that their cousins each got
one and they had to share. You don't think that will hurt their feelings?
This isn't about being rude but about protecting your kids from being hurt by
thoughtless relatives. They will be hurt plenty by others in their lives. It
isn't too much to expect some courtesy from *family*.

I want to be clear about one thing. I am not saying that it is never
appropriate to give a joint gift. Not at all. My girls have been given
several joint gifts from various relatives and friends -- things like blocks,
videos, a Little People house, and sidewalk chalk. But these are all things
they can play with alone or *together*. And those kinds of gifts are
wonderful.

What makes Megan's situation different is the choice of gift and the way she
shortchanged her kids compared to other cousins -- IMO that warrants something
more than merely being grateful.




>
>As for the issue of treating twins as one, these are ONE-YEAR-OLDS!!!!
>They have no clue!!! They are not offended!!!

Not yet anyway. So you would rather just sit by quietly and not say anything
until they *do* understand? How about nipping this in the bud *now* so
feelings aren't hurt later on.


Lori

Anita
October 24th 03, 04:48 AM
I didn't "just respond to stir something up" but you had so much support
that I suspected a different opinion wouldn't be welcome. And so far
nothing that's been said has changed my opinion about that or about your
situation. It still sounds ungrateful with a misplaced sense of entitlement
to me and I don't know if you realize it or if that's what you want to model
for your kids.

In what way do I do not know what I am talking about? I have twins, I have
in-laws that treat me badly and are insensitive to my kids' needs (I was
trying to present that with humour, I admit, but that doesn't make it less
true or painful), we receive gifts, and life is sometimes unfair here too.
My twins are older than yours and I have two singletons too so I have, in
fact, a fair bit of experience parenting, and parenting twins. I know what
I'm talking about. But obviously we respond to things differently.
I get your point. I don't think you get mine.

A.


"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Anita,
> Your trying to make a jole of things does not help the fact that you
> have no idea what you are talking about. Why start if you know it wall
> cause a "flame war"? If you just responded to stir up something, then
> just stop! My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 24th 03, 04:48 AM
I didn't "just respond to stir something up" but you had so much support
that I suspected a different opinion wouldn't be welcome. And so far
nothing that's been said has changed my opinion about that or about your
situation. It still sounds ungrateful with a misplaced sense of entitlement
to me and I don't know if you realize it or if that's what you want to model
for your kids.

In what way do I do not know what I am talking about? I have twins, I have
in-laws that treat me badly and are insensitive to my kids' needs (I was
trying to present that with humour, I admit, but that doesn't make it less
true or painful), we receive gifts, and life is sometimes unfair here too.
My twins are older than yours and I have two singletons too so I have, in
fact, a fair bit of experience parenting, and parenting twins. I know what
I'm talking about. But obviously we respond to things differently.
I get your point. I don't think you get mine.

A.


"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Anita,
> Your trying to make a jole of things does not help the fact that you
> have no idea what you are talking about. Why start if you know it wall
> cause a "flame war"? If you just responded to stir up something, then
> just stop! My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 24th 03, 04:51 AM
Yep, sure can...one size fits all!

A.

"Julie Seely" > wrote in message
...
>
> Oh -- and Anita, can I borrow your flameproof suit?
>
> Julie
> Mom to Chris & Erica, 07/97



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 24th 03, 04:51 AM
Yep, sure can...one size fits all!

A.

"Julie Seely" > wrote in message
...
>
> Oh -- and Anita, can I borrow your flameproof suit?
>
> Julie
> Mom to Chris & Erica, 07/97



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Rhiann1048
October 24th 03, 05:08 AM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: (Megan Byrne)
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 8:24 PM
>Message-id: >
>
>Lori,
>Thank you for taking care of that, LOL. I can always count on you to
>"stick up" for me! :)
>
>This SIL, who I really don't care for, is pg with her 1st child, due in
>April.
>

Any chance she might be having twins? ;)

Lori

Rhiann1048
October 24th 03, 05:08 AM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: (Megan Byrne)
>Date: Thu, Oct 23, 2003 8:24 PM
>Message-id: >
>
>Lori,
>Thank you for taking care of that, LOL. I can always count on you to
>"stick up" for me! :)
>
>This SIL, who I really don't care for, is pg with her 1st child, due in
>April.
>

Any chance she might be having twins? ;)

Lori

Anita
October 24th 03, 05:17 AM
Megan, how does your dh feel about all of this? If you and your children
are being treated badly by your in-laws (gift issue aside) I think he should
talk to them about it, don't you?

A.

"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Nik,
> Thanks for your post. I am sure ML didn't like me talking about her
> daughter. MIL and I do not mix well. Not a positive thing to say about
> MIL. As for SIL, she is quite well off, but very "tight".
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 17/10/2003

Anita
October 24th 03, 05:17 AM
Megan, how does your dh feel about all of this? If you and your children
are being treated badly by your in-laws (gift issue aside) I think he should
talk to them about it, don't you?

A.

"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Nik,
> Thanks for your post. I am sure ML didn't like me talking about her
> daughter. MIL and I do not mix well. Not a positive thing to say about
> MIL. As for SIL, she is quite well off, but very "tight".
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 17/10/2003

Julie Seely
October 24th 03, 01:11 PM
Megan --

Pardon me for being confused by your signature line. They look like
one-year-olds to me.

Julie

Megan Byrne wrote:
>
> Anita,
> Your trying to make a jole of things does not help the fact that you
> have no idea what you are talking about. Why start if you know it wall
> cause a "flame war"? If you just responded to stir up something, then
> just stop! My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Julie Seely
October 24th 03, 01:11 PM
Megan --

Pardon me for being confused by your signature line. They look like
one-year-olds to me.

Julie

Megan Byrne wrote:
>
> Anita,
> Your trying to make a jole of things does not help the fact that you
> have no idea what you are talking about. Why start if you know it wall
> cause a "flame war"? If you just responded to stir up something, then
> just stop! My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

KimandJuan
October 24th 03, 02:25 PM
I am with Julie on almost everything she said here. Very well put. I think
Megan's case is an exception though. There happens to be a lot of other issues
tied into it.
Since we have an older daughter we have a ton of toys for the babies that are
hand me downs for the babies. Specifically, ONE fire truck ride on toy. They
have so much fun on it, they LOVE it! One will push while the other rides.
With this in mind, if I were invited to a party for twins of the same age I
might think to buy them one of the same. It would be an honest sincere gesture
and would have never occurred to me that they would need two. I think if this
were the situation Megan would have been most appreciative.
The fact is that these IL's have a history of not individualizing the Aidan and
Alexis. this was just another example of how they have done it again. So, I
think that in this specific post Megan was more looking for sympathy for
uncompassioniate, insensitive in-laws versus lectures on how to make sure that
her kids don't grow up to be ungrateful.



~Kimberly
Mommy to Alexis Iliana 07/17/99 and
Emma Elidia & Aislyn Gabriela 10/01/02
come see us...
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aislynemma/

KimandJuan
October 24th 03, 02:25 PM
I am with Julie on almost everything she said here. Very well put. I think
Megan's case is an exception though. There happens to be a lot of other issues
tied into it.
Since we have an older daughter we have a ton of toys for the babies that are
hand me downs for the babies. Specifically, ONE fire truck ride on toy. They
have so much fun on it, they LOVE it! One will push while the other rides.
With this in mind, if I were invited to a party for twins of the same age I
might think to buy them one of the same. It would be an honest sincere gesture
and would have never occurred to me that they would need two. I think if this
were the situation Megan would have been most appreciative.
The fact is that these IL's have a history of not individualizing the Aidan and
Alexis. this was just another example of how they have done it again. So, I
think that in this specific post Megan was more looking for sympathy for
uncompassioniate, insensitive in-laws versus lectures on how to make sure that
her kids don't grow up to be ungrateful.



~Kimberly
Mommy to Alexis Iliana 07/17/99 and
Emma Elidia & Aislyn Gabriela 10/01/02
come see us...
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aislynemma/

KimandJuan
October 24th 03, 03:28 PM
>My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.

I think she meant they are two individuals not two years old.


~Kimberly
Mommy to Alexis Iliana 07/17/99 and
Emma Elidia & Aislyn Gabriela 10/01/02
come see us...
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aislynemma/

KimandJuan
October 24th 03, 03:28 PM
>My kids are 2, not 1. That is the whole point.

I think she meant they are two individuals not two years old.


~Kimberly
Mommy to Alexis Iliana 07/17/99 and
Emma Elidia & Aislyn Gabriela 10/01/02
come see us...
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aislynemma/

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:32 PM
Nope, not lucky enough to be having twins!! :)


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:32 PM
Nope, not lucky enough to be having twins!! :)


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:35 PM
Anita,
My IL's are the number one argument in my house. I am not proud to say
that, but I feel that they are such a strain on my marriage. It is
horrible. My DH hates when I say anything negative about them, but there
is just so much to say.

He, finally, did go down and talk to his mother and father, b/c one of
his sisters was heard saying that my son had "learning disabilities",
due to the fact he is in PT. You can only imagine how upset I was over
that.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:35 PM
Anita,
My IL's are the number one argument in my house. I am not proud to say
that, but I feel that they are such a strain on my marriage. It is
horrible. My DH hates when I say anything negative about them, but there
is just so much to say.

He, finally, did go down and talk to his mother and father, b/c one of
his sisters was heard saying that my son had "learning disabilities",
due to the fact he is in PT. You can only imagine how upset I was over
that.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:35 PM
My kids are TWO people, not ONE.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:35 PM
My kids are TWO people, not ONE.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:38 PM
Thank you Kim. If there is anyone "grateful" out there, it is me. I was
brought up well. I am very big on "thank you's" Be it a written letter,
phone call or a gift. And believe me, I was very happy that they got the
firetruck. I guess, it just stems back to the way my kids are treated
vs. the way the other nephews are treated.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 05:38 PM
Thank you Kim. If there is anyone "grateful" out there, it is me. I was
brought up well. I am very big on "thank you's" Be it a written letter,
phone call or a gift. And believe me, I was very happy that they got the
firetruck. I guess, it just stems back to the way my kids are treated
vs. the way the other nephews are treated.


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Missy in Indiana
October 24th 03, 06:20 PM
This op was case-specific as was the followed post that was discussed. In
general, I think we all choose to parent our children with a sense of gratitude
for gifts that are not necessary, but appreciated if offered. I thought it was
clear that this was the intent for frustrations by the posters. I understand
sometimes people read things differently, but reading the posters posts several
years, I felt confidant of what they meant.

Many people have differing opinions, which had been discussed respectfully,
regarding one vs. two toys per child. Like many, my kids *did* have only one
ride on toy. They currently have one bike they share even. That will change
as they get older depending on the toy and circumstance, not to do with money
or room but other factors.

With that said, I think these posts were case-specific and dealt with more than
the money spent on a gift or how many gifts given! There were deeper issues
that completely made sense to me. In their shoes, I would have been deeply
hurt and offended. They clearly had valid points. I also believe the posts
weren't titled as "give me advice". They were "vents". I know some of you
will say, "but this is a ng, we can volley topics all day". True, and I do get
benefit from seeing other points of view. But, it got a little beyond that and
probably made the posters feel worse than before they came here to vent about
their problem. So, if turning this into a "I'm trying to teach my child
differently than you behave"...it may be okay to do, but I guess it isn't a
"nice" trait a child should have either IMO.

I guess I'll need that flame suit, too now. Chalk it up to lack of sleep and
sitting on my hands for a few days.




Missy in Indiana http://hometown.aol.com/mhrust/overviewforng.html
Morgan Olivia & Julia Lucille 4/28/01 (YAY!)

Missy in Indiana
October 24th 03, 06:20 PM
This op was case-specific as was the followed post that was discussed. In
general, I think we all choose to parent our children with a sense of gratitude
for gifts that are not necessary, but appreciated if offered. I thought it was
clear that this was the intent for frustrations by the posters. I understand
sometimes people read things differently, but reading the posters posts several
years, I felt confidant of what they meant.

Many people have differing opinions, which had been discussed respectfully,
regarding one vs. two toys per child. Like many, my kids *did* have only one
ride on toy. They currently have one bike they share even. That will change
as they get older depending on the toy and circumstance, not to do with money
or room but other factors.

With that said, I think these posts were case-specific and dealt with more than
the money spent on a gift or how many gifts given! There were deeper issues
that completely made sense to me. In their shoes, I would have been deeply
hurt and offended. They clearly had valid points. I also believe the posts
weren't titled as "give me advice". They were "vents". I know some of you
will say, "but this is a ng, we can volley topics all day". True, and I do get
benefit from seeing other points of view. But, it got a little beyond that and
probably made the posters feel worse than before they came here to vent about
their problem. So, if turning this into a "I'm trying to teach my child
differently than you behave"...it may be okay to do, but I guess it isn't a
"nice" trait a child should have either IMO.

I guess I'll need that flame suit, too now. Chalk it up to lack of sleep and
sitting on my hands for a few days.




Missy in Indiana http://hometown.aol.com/mhrust/overviewforng.html
Morgan Olivia & Julia Lucille 4/28/01 (YAY!)

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 06:42 PM
Ugh, all this is exactly why I didn't post about this in the first
place. My "event" happened weeks before Brigitte's twins b-day, but when
she posted about the one card thing, it just got me more angry, so I
felt the need to vent also. Sorry that this blew up into such silliness
and took away from Brigitte's OP.

Believe me, there is much more than toys that gave me negative feelings
from my IL's, but it would take years to type it all!


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 24th 03, 06:42 PM
Ugh, all this is exactly why I didn't post about this in the first
place. My "event" happened weeks before Brigitte's twins b-day, but when
she posted about the one card thing, it just got me more angry, so I
felt the need to vent also. Sorry that this blew up into such silliness
and took away from Brigitte's OP.

Believe me, there is much more than toys that gave me negative feelings
from my IL's, but it would take years to type it all!


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Anita
October 24th 03, 07:18 PM
I had a whole reply to this all typed up but I think I am going to send it
to you privately because this is where we have more in common than not and I
don't care to post about it publicly. Hope you will read it and see that I
do understand but maybe have chosen a different path. Hopefully it will be
helpful to you...or maybe your thoughts will be helpful to me.

A.


"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Anita,
> My IL's are the number one argument in my house. I am not proud to say
> that, but I feel that they are such a strain on my marriage. It is
> horrible. My DH hates when I say anything negative about them, but there
> is just so much to say.
>
> He, finally, did go down and talk to his mother and father, b/c one of
> his sisters was heard saying that my son had "learning disabilities",
> due to the fact he is in PT. You can only imagine how upset I was over
> that.
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Anita
October 24th 03, 07:18 PM
I had a whole reply to this all typed up but I think I am going to send it
to you privately because this is where we have more in common than not and I
don't care to post about it publicly. Hope you will read it and see that I
do understand but maybe have chosen a different path. Hopefully it will be
helpful to you...or maybe your thoughts will be helpful to me.

A.


"Megan Byrne" > wrote in message
...
> Anita,
> My IL's are the number one argument in my house. I am not proud to say
> that, but I feel that they are such a strain on my marriage. It is
> horrible. My DH hates when I say anything negative about them, but there
> is just so much to say.
>
> He, finally, did go down and talk to his mother and father, b/c one of
> his sisters was heard saying that my son had "learning disabilities",
> due to the fact he is in PT. You can only imagine how upset I was over
> that.
>
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.528 / Virus Database: 324 - Release Date: 16/10/2003

Julie Seely
October 25th 03, 12:13 AM
Megan --

Sorry. Yes, I misunderstood.

Julie



Megan Byrne wrote:
>
> My kids are TWO people, not ONE.
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Julie Seely
October 25th 03, 12:13 AM
Megan --

Sorry. Yes, I misunderstood.

Julie



Megan Byrne wrote:
>
> My kids are TWO people, not ONE.
>
> ~Megan~
> Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
> Born September 28, 2002
>
> www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Julie Seely
October 25th 03, 12:50 AM
Rhiann1048 wrote:
>
> And *I* simply cannot believe that a parent would sit quietly by and smile when
> their children are deliberately slighted in this way. If you do not nip this is
> the bud *now*, it will not change.
>
> What happens when they are 10 and they are talking to their cousins about the
> great DVD Aunt whatever bought them and they find that their cousins each got
> one and they had to share. You don't think that will hurt their feelings?
> This isn't about being rude but about protecting your kids from being hurt by
> thoughtless relatives. They will be hurt plenty by others in their lives. It
> isn't too much to expect some courtesy from *family*.
>
> I want to be clear about one thing. I am not saying that it is never
> appropriate to give a joint gift. Not at all. My girls have been given
> several joint gifts from various relatives and friends -- things like blocks,
> videos, a Little People house, and sidewalk chalk. But these are all things
> they can play with alone or *together*. And those kinds of gifts are
> wonderful.
>
> What makes Megan's situation different is the choice of gift and the way she
> shortchanged her kids compared to other cousins -- IMO that warrants something
> more than merely being grateful.
>
> >
> >As for the issue of treating twins as one, these are ONE-YEAR-OLDS!!!!
> >They have no clue!!! They are not offended!!!
>
> Not yet anyway. So you would rather just sit by quietly and not say anything
> until they *do* understand? How about nipping this in the bud *now* so
> feelings aren't hurt later on.
>
> Lori

Lori --

Okay, call me a lousy mother, but I have actually never paid attention
to who gives what to whom on holidays, so I have no clue whether my
siblings and my siblings-in-law and my parents (my parents-in-law have
both passed away) give more or less to my kids in comparison to other
cousins. We don't measure how much our relatives love our kids by what
they give them on holidays, nor would I want to imply to my kids to
think that Grandma and Grandpa love them less because they were given a
toy to share, when their cousin got one of his very own. Honestly, it
wouldn't ever occur to them to think that way, so why should I introduce
the concept? Gifts are NOT a barometer of love.

NOW -- if a relative were being outwardly rude to our kids -- e.g.
inviting other nieces/nephews onto their lap but not allowing ours to
cuddle; or ignoring them or being unnecessarily short or rude while
being warm with other children; or otherwise treating them in a way that
would make them feel less loved than their cousins, then surely I would
say something, because that is simply unacceptable. But compare gifts?
Never. And my kids don't do it either. It's pretty clear from what
Megan describes that her relationship with her in-laws is, for whatever
reason, dysfunctional enough that she shouldn't touch the subject with a
ten foot pole. They would likely hold it against her. Her dh
definitely needs to go to bat for her. If he doesn't see it, bring the
video camera to the next family event and document it for him. Then
tell him that he either needs to deal with it, or avoid family
get-togethers where the other cousins are there and the kids might feel
inferior.

Like Nik said, it is not likely that the in-laws are going to change.
And as someone else suggested, I'm not entirely sure that it was a
deliberate slight. It is entirely possible that this was simply someone
incorrectly thinking that two would be overkill. Believe it or not,
when our kids turned one, they got a ride-on toy for their birthday.
Just one. From my SIL! (no, I'm really not making that up). We loved
the one she gave us, and got another one to make an even pair.

Julie
Mom to Erica & Chris, 07/97

Julie Seely
October 25th 03, 12:50 AM
Rhiann1048 wrote:
>
> And *I* simply cannot believe that a parent would sit quietly by and smile when
> their children are deliberately slighted in this way. If you do not nip this is
> the bud *now*, it will not change.
>
> What happens when they are 10 and they are talking to their cousins about the
> great DVD Aunt whatever bought them and they find that their cousins each got
> one and they had to share. You don't think that will hurt their feelings?
> This isn't about being rude but about protecting your kids from being hurt by
> thoughtless relatives. They will be hurt plenty by others in their lives. It
> isn't too much to expect some courtesy from *family*.
>
> I want to be clear about one thing. I am not saying that it is never
> appropriate to give a joint gift. Not at all. My girls have been given
> several joint gifts from various relatives and friends -- things like blocks,
> videos, a Little People house, and sidewalk chalk. But these are all things
> they can play with alone or *together*. And those kinds of gifts are
> wonderful.
>
> What makes Megan's situation different is the choice of gift and the way she
> shortchanged her kids compared to other cousins -- IMO that warrants something
> more than merely being grateful.
>
> >
> >As for the issue of treating twins as one, these are ONE-YEAR-OLDS!!!!
> >They have no clue!!! They are not offended!!!
>
> Not yet anyway. So you would rather just sit by quietly and not say anything
> until they *do* understand? How about nipping this in the bud *now* so
> feelings aren't hurt later on.
>
> Lori

Lori --

Okay, call me a lousy mother, but I have actually never paid attention
to who gives what to whom on holidays, so I have no clue whether my
siblings and my siblings-in-law and my parents (my parents-in-law have
both passed away) give more or less to my kids in comparison to other
cousins. We don't measure how much our relatives love our kids by what
they give them on holidays, nor would I want to imply to my kids to
think that Grandma and Grandpa love them less because they were given a
toy to share, when their cousin got one of his very own. Honestly, it
wouldn't ever occur to them to think that way, so why should I introduce
the concept? Gifts are NOT a barometer of love.

NOW -- if a relative were being outwardly rude to our kids -- e.g.
inviting other nieces/nephews onto their lap but not allowing ours to
cuddle; or ignoring them or being unnecessarily short or rude while
being warm with other children; or otherwise treating them in a way that
would make them feel less loved than their cousins, then surely I would
say something, because that is simply unacceptable. But compare gifts?
Never. And my kids don't do it either. It's pretty clear from what
Megan describes that her relationship with her in-laws is, for whatever
reason, dysfunctional enough that she shouldn't touch the subject with a
ten foot pole. They would likely hold it against her. Her dh
definitely needs to go to bat for her. If he doesn't see it, bring the
video camera to the next family event and document it for him. Then
tell him that he either needs to deal with it, or avoid family
get-togethers where the other cousins are there and the kids might feel
inferior.

Like Nik said, it is not likely that the in-laws are going to change.
And as someone else suggested, I'm not entirely sure that it was a
deliberate slight. It is entirely possible that this was simply someone
incorrectly thinking that two would be overkill. Believe it or not,
when our kids turned one, they got a ride-on toy for their birthday.
Just one. From my SIL! (no, I'm really not making that up). We loved
the one she gave us, and got another one to make an even pair.

Julie
Mom to Erica & Chris, 07/97

Megan Byrne
October 25th 03, 04:37 AM
Julie,
Every scenario you mentioned, pluse some, has happened! It's not that I
won't 'touch it with a 10 foot pole', it's just something I can't sit
here and type about. It's more something that would be easier telling in
person. Do you understand? My IL's have not been nice and welcoming
since the moment they found out about me. It is fine that they don't
like me, but now that I have innocent children, it's different.
Hopefully, DH will see it now with the kids. I hate the thought of the
holidays coming up. Yuck!


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Megan Byrne
October 25th 03, 04:37 AM
Julie,
Every scenario you mentioned, pluse some, has happened! It's not that I
won't 'touch it with a 10 foot pole', it's just something I can't sit
here and type about. It's more something that would be easier telling in
person. Do you understand? My IL's have not been nice and welcoming
since the moment they found out about me. It is fine that they don't
like me, but now that I have innocent children, it's different.
Hopefully, DH will see it now with the kids. I hate the thought of the
holidays coming up. Yuck!


~Megan~
Aidan Matthew & Alexis Valerie
Born September 28, 2002

www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/aidannalexis

Rhiann1048
October 25th 03, 05:34 AM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: Julie Seely
>Date: Fri, Oct 24, 2003 5:50 PM
>Message-id: >
>>
<snip>
>
>Okay, call me a lousy mother, but I have actually never paid attention
>to who gives what to whom on holidays, so I have no clue whether my
>siblings and my siblings-in-law and my parents (my parents-in-law have
>both passed away) give more or less to my kids in comparison to other
>cousins.

Honestly, neither do I. My childrens' cousins are scattered all over the
country and we have only spent Christmas once with two of them since they've
been born. And I certainly wasn't there with a pen keeping track of the gifts
my nephews got vs. my kids. I should also add that I don't have any inlaw
'issues'. I'm lucky that I have great inlaws and I get along with them just
fine.

But if it were traditional and for one person in the family to give all
children a particular gift at a particular milstone birthday and I saw my kids
get one when everyone else got their own? I'd be upset. As others have pointed
out this isn't something that is relevent to all gift giving situations. But
in *this* one it was a slight and the animonsity between Megan and her inlaws
proves that.


We don't measure how much our relatives love our kids by what
>they give them on holidays, nor would I want to imply to my kids to
>think that Grandma and Grandpa love them less because they were given a
>toy to share, when their cousin got one of his very own. Honestly, it
>wouldn't ever occur to them to think that way, so why should I introduce
>the concept? Gifts are NOT a barometer of love.

Hmmm. So you put as much thought and money into gifts for your mother and
children as you do the mail carrier or a neighbor? If giving a gift says
nothing about your feelings towards the recipient, then I guess you must.

Would you ever *dream* of giving Chris a PS2, a new skateboard, and his own TV
in his room for his birthday and giving Erica some underwear and socks for the
same occasion?? Of *course* you wouldn't. You love them the same so you
threat them with equal respect on their birthday. Why should it be any
different with a grandparent and their grandkids or an aunt and her
neices/nephews?

Lori

Rhiann1048
October 25th 03, 05:34 AM
>Subject: Re: Sorta stood up to MIL
>From: Julie Seely
>Date: Fri, Oct 24, 2003 5:50 PM
>Message-id: >
>>
<snip>
>
>Okay, call me a lousy mother, but I have actually never paid attention
>to who gives what to whom on holidays, so I have no clue whether my
>siblings and my siblings-in-law and my parents (my parents-in-law have
>both passed away) give more or less to my kids in comparison to other
>cousins.

Honestly, neither do I. My childrens' cousins are scattered all over the
country and we have only spent Christmas once with two of them since they've
been born. And I certainly wasn't there with a pen keeping track of the gifts
my nephews got vs. my kids. I should also add that I don't have any inlaw
'issues'. I'm lucky that I have great inlaws and I get along with them just
fine.

But if it were traditional and for one person in the family to give all
children a particular gift at a particular milstone birthday and I saw my kids
get one when everyone else got their own? I'd be upset. As others have pointed
out this isn't something that is relevent to all gift giving situations. But
in *this* one it was a slight and the animonsity between Megan and her inlaws
proves that.


We don't measure how much our relatives love our kids by what
>they give them on holidays, nor would I want to imply to my kids to
>think that Grandma and Grandpa love them less because they were given a
>toy to share, when their cousin got one of his very own. Honestly, it
>wouldn't ever occur to them to think that way, so why should I introduce
>the concept? Gifts are NOT a barometer of love.

Hmmm. So you put as much thought and money into gifts for your mother and
children as you do the mail carrier or a neighbor? If giving a gift says
nothing about your feelings towards the recipient, then I guess you must.

Would you ever *dream* of giving Chris a PS2, a new skateboard, and his own TV
in his room for his birthday and giving Erica some underwear and socks for the
same occasion?? Of *course* you wouldn't. You love them the same so you
threat them with equal respect on their birthday. Why should it be any
different with a grandparent and their grandkids or an aunt and her
neices/nephews?

Lori

Julie Seely
October 25th 03, 02:35 PM
Sorry, this is LONG!

Rhiann1048 wrote:
>
> Honestly, neither do I. My childrens' cousins are scattered all over the
> country and we have only spent Christmas once with two of them since they've
> been born. And I certainly wasn't there with a pen keeping track of the gifts
> my nephews got vs. my kids. I should also add that I don't have any inlaw
> 'issues'. I'm lucky that I have great inlaws and I get along with them just
> fine.
>
> But if it were traditional and for one person in the family to give all
> children a particular gift at a particular milstone birthday and I saw my kids
> get one when everyone else got their own? I'd be upset. As others have pointed
> out this isn't something that is relevent to all gift giving situations. But
> in *this* one it was a slight and the animonsity between Megan and her inlaws
> proves that.
>

I will confess that I didn't get as strong a sense of "tradition" from
Megan's description as you did. I surely didn't picture the red carpet
rolling out and the SIL descending with the gift. :-) Even so, though,
I can honestly say that if she walked down the red carpet toward my
one-year-olds with one box with one ride on toy in it, no, it would not
bother me at all. Not one bit. Like Helen, we got one of pretty much
everything and got a second later if it proved to be a must-have item
(two swings, two bouncy seats, one johnnie-jump-up, one exersaucer).
One car seat would be a very strange gift for one-year-olds to share,
but I still don't see it as being rude or strange for a relative to give
them one ride on toy. BTDT and it never struck me as odd.

But my point here, and I guess I'm not expressing it very well, is that
it seemed to me from Megan's earliest posts -- and does seem different
from subsequent posts -- that Megan was most upset about the shared gift
aspect of her kids' treatment, instead of the general "second class
citizen" treatment -- i.e. less affection from the in-laws, etc. I
can't help but wonder whether, if, all other things were hunky dory --
A&A were treated lovingly and respectfully and affectionately by the
IL's, with the one annoyance that they were given a shared gift --
whether this would be such a big issue. If not, then maybe, especially
given the friction between the families, it might be best to deal with
the issue of how A&A are being treated without delving into the gift
issue. As I said before, at this age, and probably for another
year-and-a-half or even two, they are unaware and thus completely
unaffected by the gift-giving imbalance. But the lack of
affection/respect/warmth is affecting them here and now, and *that* is
what I would nip in the bud. If the family is confronted about "not
giving A&A enough gifts", ESPECIALLY if Megan chooses to deal with it
instead of DH, then it will probably seem to them just as it seemed to
me at the outset: materialistic and grabby and ungrateful. BUT, if the
family is asked to treat A&A as warmly and lovingly as they treat the
other children in the family, without making any mention of gifts, there
should be no way for the family to hold that against Megan or her DH.
As I said before, given the apparent hostility between Megan and the IL
family, I don't personally think that this is something that Megan
*should* deal with, as it is likely that anything that comes from her
mouth is discounted, ignored, and even mocked. It needs to come from
DH. And if that requires Megan to become the official family
videographer for a while (and maybe the family's behavior will improve
if they're always on camera!), then so be it. Like it or not, I think
Megan's role at this juncture has to be observing the inequities,
drawing her dh's attention to them, and getting him to deal with them.
All while maintaining and oh-so-gracious demeanor and being charming.
Yeah, easier said than done, but anything else is a lose-lose situation
for her.

> Hmmm. So you put as much thought and money into gifts for your mother and
> children as you do the mail carrier or a neighbor? If giving a gift says
> nothing about your feelings towards the recipient, then I guess you must.
>
> Would you ever *dream* of giving Chris a PS2, a new skateboard, and his own TV
> in his room for his birthday and giving Erica some underwear and socks for the
> same occasion?? Of *course* you wouldn't. You love them the same so you
> threat them with equal respect on their birthday. Why should it be any
> different with a grandparent and their grandkids or an aunt and her
> neices/nephews?
>

Okay, easy question first: we do very little holiday gift-giving. We
have a P.O. Box, so no mail carrier. We do not have a cleaning lady or
anyone else we give gifts to. The ONLY people we buy holiday gifts for
are C&E, 3 nephews and a niece; we draw names among the adults, and dh
and I exchange gifts (usually). We do not exchange gifts among the
adults in John's family, only the kids. I put a lot of thought into
every gift I buy. Doesn't matter who it's for. Our kids exchange gifts
with a few of their closest friends. They choose, I pay.

In my own dealings with my kids, I do my best to treat them equally in
everything -- whether it be "you can each choose two books and we'll
read stories on the couch", "you can each choose a flavor of cereal",
general affection, or in gift-giving. I don't let one choose three
books and the other choose one, if we already have nearly enough cereal
I tell them to agree on one box, not let just one child choose, and I do
my best to buy them each at least a few things from their respective
wish lists on gift-giving occasions. NOT that who I allow to choose the
cereal -- or what gifts we give them -- is any indicator of who is a
favorite, but more for my *own* comfort level, I treat them equally. If
Erica's wish list contained only underwear and socks, and I knew that
was all she wanted? I'd probably take her to have her head examined.

Megan mentions two previous nephews, not brothers, who have been given
ride-on toys. I don't know whether there are any other cousins, but if
not, there may be a bit of an attitude from the ILs of treating each
*family* equally. In my own family, I have two older sisters. One has
a son who is two years older than C&E; his mom, my sister, is a single
mom and on a tighter budget than we are on. My other sister is a
childless MD. If I had 10 kids and my other sister had one, what would
my oldest sister do about gifts, if she gives it any thought? Would she
buy us 10 ride on toys? Would she feel right spending 10 times as much
on my family as she spent on her other sister's family? Maybe she might
buy my other sister's son a bit more. As I said, we're not a family
that keeps track of who gets what, but if we were, I wouldn't think that
inappropriate at all. So why is it inapproppriate if there are two
children vs. one child? Can she spend a bit more on my other sister's
son, especially since C&E get the benefit of sharing many of their
toys? Whatever she does is fine by me. I'm just grateful that she's
crazy about all three kids, loves to spend time with them, and they're
all crazy about her. That's all that matters.

Julie

Julie Seely
October 25th 03, 02:35 PM
Sorry, this is LONG!

Rhiann1048 wrote:
>
> Honestly, neither do I. My childrens' cousins are scattered all over the
> country and we have only spent Christmas once with two of them since they've
> been born. And I certainly wasn't there with a pen keeping track of the gifts
> my nephews got vs. my kids. I should also add that I don't have any inlaw
> 'issues'. I'm lucky that I have great inlaws and I get along with them just
> fine.
>
> But if it were traditional and for one person in the family to give all
> children a particular gift at a particular milstone birthday and I saw my kids
> get one when everyone else got their own? I'd be upset. As others have pointed
> out this isn't something that is relevent to all gift giving situations. But
> in *this* one it was a slight and the animonsity between Megan and her inlaws
> proves that.
>

I will confess that I didn't get as strong a sense of "tradition" from
Megan's description as you did. I surely didn't picture the red carpet
rolling out and the SIL descending with the gift. :-) Even so, though,
I can honestly say that if she walked down the red carpet toward my
one-year-olds with one box with one ride on toy in it, no, it would not
bother me at all. Not one bit. Like Helen, we got one of pretty much
everything and got a second later if it proved to be a must-have item
(two swings, two bouncy seats, one johnnie-jump-up, one exersaucer).
One car seat would be a very strange gift for one-year-olds to share,
but I still don't see it as being rude or strange for a relative to give
them one ride on toy. BTDT and it never struck me as odd.

But my point here, and I guess I'm not expressing it very well, is that
it seemed to me from Megan's earliest posts -- and does seem different
from subsequent posts -- that Megan was most upset about the shared gift
aspect of her kids' treatment, instead of the general "second class
citizen" treatment -- i.e. less affection from the in-laws, etc. I
can't help but wonder whether, if, all other things were hunky dory --
A&A were treated lovingly and respectfully and affectionately by the
IL's, with the one annoyance that they were given a shared gift --
whether this would be such a big issue. If not, then maybe, especially
given the friction between the families, it might be best to deal with
the issue of how A&A are being treated without delving into the gift
issue. As I said before, at this age, and probably for another
year-and-a-half or even two, they are unaware and thus completely
unaffected by the gift-giving imbalance. But the lack of
affection/respect/warmth is affecting them here and now, and *that* is
what I would nip in the bud. If the family is confronted about "not
giving A&A enough gifts", ESPECIALLY if Megan chooses to deal with it
instead of DH, then it will probably seem to them just as it seemed to
me at the outset: materialistic and grabby and ungrateful. BUT, if the
family is asked to treat A&A as warmly and lovingly as they treat the
other children in the family, without making any mention of gifts, there
should be no way for the family to hold that against Megan or her DH.
As I said before, given the apparent hostility between Megan and the IL
family, I don't personally think that this is something that Megan
*should* deal with, as it is likely that anything that comes from her
mouth is discounted, ignored, and even mocked. It needs to come from
DH. And if that requires Megan to become the official family
videographer for a while (and maybe the family's behavior will improve
if they're always on camera!), then so be it. Like it or not, I think
Megan's role at this juncture has to be observing the inequities,
drawing her dh's attention to them, and getting him to deal with them.
All while maintaining and oh-so-gracious demeanor and being charming.
Yeah, easier said than done, but anything else is a lose-lose situation
for her.

> Hmmm. So you put as much thought and money into gifts for your mother and
> children as you do the mail carrier or a neighbor? If giving a gift says
> nothing about your feelings towards the recipient, then I guess you must.
>
> Would you ever *dream* of giving Chris a PS2, a new skateboard, and his own TV
> in his room for his birthday and giving Erica some underwear and socks for the
> same occasion?? Of *course* you wouldn't. You love them the same so you
> threat them with equal respect on their birthday. Why should it be any
> different with a grandparent and their grandkids or an aunt and her
> neices/nephews?
>

Okay, easy question first: we do very little holiday gift-giving. We
have a P.O. Box, so no mail carrier. We do not have a cleaning lady or
anyone else we give gifts to. The ONLY people we buy holiday gifts for
are C&E, 3 nephews and a niece; we draw names among the adults, and dh
and I exchange gifts (usually). We do not exchange gifts among the
adults in John's family, only the kids. I put a lot of thought into
every gift I buy. Doesn't matter who it's for. Our kids exchange gifts
with a few of their closest friends. They choose, I pay.

In my own dealings with my kids, I do my best to treat them equally in
everything -- whether it be "you can each choose two books and we'll
read stories on the couch", "you can each choose a flavor of cereal",
general affection, or in gift-giving. I don't let one choose three
books and the other choose one, if we already have nearly enough cereal
I tell them to agree on one box, not let just one child choose, and I do
my best to buy them each at least a few things from their respective
wish lists on gift-giving occasions. NOT that who I allow to choose the
cereal -- or what gifts we give them -- is any indicator of who is a
favorite, but more for my *own* comfort level, I treat them equally. If
Erica's wish list contained only underwear and socks, and I knew that
was all she wanted? I'd probably take her to have her head examined.

Megan mentions two previous nephews, not brothers, who have been given
ride-on toys. I don't know whether there are any other cousins, but if
not, there may be a bit of an attitude from the ILs of treating each
*family* equally. In my own family, I have two older sisters. One has
a son who is two years older than C&E; his mom, my sister, is a single
mom and on a tighter budget than we are on. My other sister is a
childless MD. If I had 10 kids and my other sister had one, what would
my oldest sister do about gifts, if she gives it any thought? Would she
buy us 10 ride on toys? Would she feel right spending 10 times as much
on my family as she spent on her other sister's family? Maybe she might
buy my other sister's son a bit more. As I said, we're not a family
that keeps track of who gets what, but if we were, I wouldn't think that
inappropriate at all. So why is it inapproppriate if there are two
children vs. one child? Can she spend a bit more on my other sister's
son, especially since C&E get the benefit of sharing many of their
toys? Whatever she does is fine by me. I'm just grateful that she's
crazy about all three kids, loves to spend time with them, and they're
all crazy about her. That's all that matters.

Julie

GandSBrock
October 25th 03, 07:08 PM
>Funnily enough, I'm one of 4 kids, and I don't remember having *anything*
>like the pile o' toys currently 'crapping' up my house.

Me neither!! But then again, kid's meals weren't available back then...

>I think my parents
>just didn't give us many, in part because dad hates clutter, and because we
>could play with each other.

Mine are just "frugal".

> I'm trying to get rid of some of the current
>crop of toys. (Free to good homes!)

I got some to get rid of too!!

Stephanie
Jake and Ryan 9/3/99

GandSBrock
October 25th 03, 07:08 PM
>Funnily enough, I'm one of 4 kids, and I don't remember having *anything*
>like the pile o' toys currently 'crapping' up my house.

Me neither!! But then again, kid's meals weren't available back then...

>I think my parents
>just didn't give us many, in part because dad hates clutter, and because we
>could play with each other.

Mine are just "frugal".

> I'm trying to get rid of some of the current
>crop of toys. (Free to good homes!)

I got some to get rid of too!!

Stephanie
Jake and Ryan 9/3/99