Please help on conent/agreement form [Archive]

Paul Fritz

July 20th 03, 04:44 PM

natural_4u

July 20th 03, 10:02 PM

The court has ordered supervised visitation, but I don't know who I can get
to be the supervisor.

"'Kate" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 20 Jul 2003 08:33:08 GMT, "natural_4u" > wasted
> bandwidth once again by posting:
>
> >Subject typo
> >
> >Consent/Agreement form
> >
> >
> >"natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> >> Hello people,
> >>
> >>
> >> I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> >> wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> >> consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> >contact
> >> number, etc..
> >>
> >> You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> >even
> >> let them take her for the day. Well...I'm not sure if I can give a
> >straight
> >> answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say
to
> >> bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> >hours
> >> late
> >>
> >> Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a
long
> >> story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> >evolving
> >> serious legal action.
> >>
> >> So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
> >>
> >> Thanks People!!!
>
> I wonder how you'd feel if every time you wanted to see your daughter,
> you had to check her out like a library book? Isn't there a visitation
> agreement already in force?
>
> 'Kate

Moon Shyne

July 20th 03, 10:33 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > Hello people,
> >
> >
> > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> contact
> > number, etc..
>
> You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the sooner
> you realize that, the better

Jam the other foot in your mouth now, Paul - the order says supervised
visitation, apparently. Once again, your agenda bites you in the ass

>
> >
> > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> even
> > let them take her for the day.
>
> Maybe because the courts have ordered it?

Supervised, apparently - need a crowbar to get that foot out of your mouth?

>
> >Well...I'm not sure if I can give a straight
> > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say to
> > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> hours
> > late
>
> She is not just 'your' daughter.
>
> Let me guess........the other parent gets to see their kid once every two
> weeks for a day, and you are whining about a couple of hours.

Yup - you're needing that crowbar more and more, Paul - don't you get tired of
bashing mothers so much of the time?

>
> >
> > Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a long
> > story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> evolving
> > serious legal action.
> >
> > So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
>
> You should start by growing up.

You could help by STFU

>
> >
> > Thanks People!!!
> >
> >
>
>

natural_4u

July 20th 03, 11:52 PM

7 years ago before court the other parent wanted to spend the weekend with
our daughter.. naturally without any hesitation I agreed . Come Sunday night
my daughter was never returned. I tried calling and going to the place where
my daughter was staying but no answer. Tried calling the police and they
said call back in 24 hours.

Monday morning a sheriff came to my house and served me a restraining order
stating no verbal, physical, or written contact with my daughter or the
other parent. What did I do to deserve this?

Anyways... after 2 month of going back and forth to court I come home from
work one day and find my daughter at my house with my parents. I assumed
that this was a trap to make me go to jail so I went straight to court the
next day with my daughter and spoke to a legal council. They tried
contacting the other parent but without any success. Another court date was
set and when I went, the judge had agreed that the other parent had
abandoned and neglected our daughter thus granting me custody and for the
other parent supervised visitation.

(I found out from a friend of the other parent that the reason my daughter
was droped

So this brings me back to the beginning. Should I fall for the same trick
twice and let my daughter come back anytime they wish OR should I have
something that will guarantee the return at a specific time.

What would you do if you've been burn before??? Start judgeing people??

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > Hello people,
> >
> >
> > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> contact
> > number, etc..
>
> You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the
sooner
> you realize that, the better
>
> >
> > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> even
> > let them take her for the day.
>
> Maybe because the courts have ordered it?
>
> >Well...I'm not sure if I can give a straight
> > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say to
> > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> hours
> > late
>
> She is not just 'your' daughter.
>
> Let me guess........the other parent gets to see their kid once every two
> weeks for a day, and you are whining about a couple of hours.
>
> >
> > Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a
long
> > story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> evolving
> > serious legal action.
> >
> > So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
>
> You should start by growing up.
>
> >
> > Thanks People!!!
> >
> >
>
>

Tiffany

July 20th 03, 11:56 PM

Moon Shyne > wrote in message
...
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > Hello people,
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> > contact
> > > number, etc..
> >
> > You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> > control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the
sooner
> > you realize that, the better
>
> Jam the other foot in your mouth now, Paul - the order says supervised
> visitation, apparently. Once again, your agenda bites you in the ass
>
>
> >
> > >
> > > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> > even
> > > let them take her for the day.
> >
> > Maybe because the courts have ordered it?
>
> Supervised, apparently - need a crowbar to get that foot out of your
mouth?
>
> >
> > >Well...I'm not sure if I can give a straight
> > > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say
to
> > > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> > hours
> > > late
> >
> > She is not just 'your' daughter.
> >
> > Let me guess........the other parent gets to see their kid once every
two
> > weeks for a day, and you are whining about a couple of hours.
>
> Yup - you're needing that crowbar more and more, Paul - don't you get
tired of
> bashing mothers so much of the time?

Who said this post is from a mother anyways? No where does it state the
gender of this sex, unless I misread.

Paul Fritz

July 21st 03, 01:15 AM

"Tiffany" > wrote in message
...
>
> Moon Shyne > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > > . ca...
> > > > Hello people,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was
just
> > > > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > > > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> > > contact
> > > > number, etc..
> > >
> > > You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> > > control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the
> sooner
> > > you realize that, the better
> >
> > Jam the other foot in your mouth now, Paul - the order says supervised
> > visitation, apparently. Once again, your agenda bites you in the ass

the only thing bitten in the ass is amy lynn, since as usual she is wrong,
which is not surprising for somewone as dumb as a tree stump/, cripes you'd
think she'd have learned already that the kids are ward of the court, and it
is the court that controls the who what when where and how.

> >
> >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent
why
> > > even
> > > > let them take her for the day.
> > >
> > > Maybe because the courts have ordered it?
> >
> > Supervised, apparently - need a crowbar to get that foot out of your
> mouth?

Stumpy still doesn't get it.

> >
> > >
> > > >Well...I'm not sure if I can give a straight
> > > > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I
say
> to
> > > > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always
3-4
> > > hours
> > > > late
> > >
> > > She is not just 'your' daughter.
> > >
> > > Let me guess........the other parent gets to see their kid once every
> two
> > > weeks for a day, and you are whining about a couple of hours.
> >
> > Yup - you're needing that crowbar more and more, Paul - don't you get
> tired of
> > bashing mothers so much of the time?
>
> Who said this post is from a mother anyways? No where does it state the
> gender of this sex, unless I misread.

One of many reasons why the major league liar amy lynn, aka stumpy, aka
ironwood, aka nasty aka moonshyne resides in the same place in my computer
as looney lorain......they are two peas in a pod.

>
>
>
>
>

Paul Fritz

July 21st 03, 01:25 AM

Why this smells to high heaven.....................

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> 7 years ago before court the other parent wanted to spend the weekend with
> our daughter.. naturally without any hesitation I agreed . Come Sunday
night
> my daughter was never returned.

With no court order WRT parenting time......the other parent has just as
much right to the child as you.

>I tried calling and going to the place where
> my daughter was staying but no answer.

No one is required to answer a phone

>Tried calling the police and they
> said call back in 24 hours.

Standard procedure

>
> Monday morning a sheriff came to my house and served me a restraining
order
> stating no verbal, physical, or written contact with my daughter or the
> other parent. What did I do to deserve this?

This is where your story falls apart. The only type of order this could be
is an ex-parte order. It would only b calid until you both appeared in
court, typically within 14 days..................either you are full of crap
or there is something you are not disclosing

>
> Anyways... after 2 month of going back and forth to court I come home from
> work one day and find my daughter at my house with my parents. I assumed
> that this was a trap to make me go to jail so I went straight to court the
> next day with my daughter and spoke to a legal council.

Again, there is evidently more to the story.

> They tried
> contacting the other parent but without any success. Another court date
was
> set and when I went, the judge had agreed that the other parent had
> abandoned and neglected our daughter thus granting me custody and for the
> other parent supervised visitation.

So all of a sudden, after you being denied any contact for months, they turn
around and give you custody? Denmark is not smelling to good right now.

>
> (I found out from a friend of the other parent that the reason my daughter
> was droped

??????

>
> So this brings me back to the beginning. Should I fall for the same trick
> twice and let my daughter come back anytime they wish OR should I have
> something that will guarantee the return at a specific time.

If there is supervised visitation/parenting time, the terms would be spelled
out in the court order.....if not either you or you attorney is an
idiot.........or there is far more to the story.

>
> What would you do if you've been burn before??? Start judgeing people??

Don't even go there.

>
>
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > Hello people,
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> > contact
> > > number, etc..
> >
> > You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> > control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the
> sooner
> > you realize that, the better
> >
> > >
> > > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> > even
> > > let them take her for the day.
> >
> > Maybe because the courts have ordered it?
> >
> > >Well...I'm not sure if I can give a straight
> > > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say
to
> > > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> > hours
> > > late
> >
> > She is not just 'your' daughter.
> >
> > Let me guess........the other parent gets to see their kid once every
two
> > weeks for a day, and you are whining about a couple of hours.
> >
> > >
> > > Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a
> long
> > > story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> > evolving
> > > serious legal action.
> > >
> > > So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
> >
> > You should start by growing up.
> >
> > >
> > > Thanks People!!!
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

natural_4u

July 21st 03, 02:56 AM

OK detective Paul... I don't know what an ex-parte order is but... the other
parent NEVER appeared in court once. That looked good for me in court.

I guess it doesn't hurt to tell you exactly what happened. The other parent
did not like the fact that my daughter had my last name and that MY parents
are still together and not alcoholics. The other parent, I guess was
jealous. The other parent had told the legal aid lawyer they were scared of
me... that why legal aid had denied me. I had to pay for my lawyer. My
lawyer said to the judge, "My client has appeared at every court date and
the other parents has not appeared once now the other parent has left my
client with the child"

That cheap ass legal aid lawyer was put to shame. The judge did not hesitate
to reverse the restraining order and added a supervised visitation.

Hey dumb-ass I almost forgot one last thing, if the other parents legal aid
lawyer can't get a hold of their own client and left the child to me... the
judge called it neglect and abandonment. My parents don't drink or do drugs.
The court usually will look at each parents family background for help on
decision making on who the child should stay with.

I think you are just in a different part of the world with different rules.

">
> This is where your story falls apart. The only type of order this could
be
> is an ex-parte order. It would only b calid until you both appeared in
> court, typically within 14 days..................either you are full of
crap
> or there is something you are not disclosing
>

natural_4u

July 21st 03, 03:14 AM

I know I had the right to know where my daughter was but the other parent
WANTED me to freak out.(Vindictive)

No I didn't have any contact but I kinda knew where they were staying.

I know what my daughter WANTS but does she really want that???

My saying is"you are either in our daughter's life or you're out" no part
time bullsh*t

Dolores you are the only one who say I should have something on paper... I
really feel the same way. The other parent already had a chance. This is not
a 3 strikes you're out thing ... this is my daughter we're talking about,
right?

You only get one chance , and after a stunt like that , that really blew it
for the other parent!

"dolores" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > 7 years ago before court the other parent wanted to spend the weekend
with
> > our daughter.. naturally without any hesitation I agreed . Come Sunday
> night
> > my daughter was never returned. I tried calling and going to the place
> where
> > my daughter was staying but no answer. Tried calling the police and they
> > said call back in 24 hours.
>
> You had the right to at least expect a phone call to let you know she was
> ok. If you are the custodial parent, be you father or mother, then the
other
> has a duty not to just you, but the child to let you know what's going on.
> Jesus, I would have been out of my mind with worry, if put in this
> situation.
> >
> > Monday morning a sheriff came to my house and served me a restraining
> order
> > stating no verbal, physical, or written contact with my daughter or the
> > other parent. What did I do to deserve this?
> >
> > Anyways... after 2 month of going back and forth to court I come home
from
> > work one day and find my daughter at my house with my parents.
>
> Did you have any contact at all with y our daughter in this time, did you
> know where she was etc?
>
> I assumed
> > that this was a trap to make me go to jail so I went straight to court
the
> > next day with my daughter and spoke to a legal council. They tried
> > contacting the other parent but without any success. Another court date
> was
> > set and when I went, the judge had agreed that the other parent had
> > abandoned and neglected our daughter thus granting me custody and for
the
> > other parent supervised visitation.
> >
> > (I found out from a friend of the other parent that the reason my
daughter
> > was droped
> >
> > So this brings me back to the beginning. Should I fall for the same
trick
> > twice and let my daughter come back anytime they wish
>
> No, I dont think you should, I reckon you should have something on paper.
> But then again it depends on how old your daughter is. It could be a case
> that your daughter may *want* to spend more time with the other parent and
> you dont really have the right to stop her.
>
> Has either of you asked *her* (your daughter) what she wants?
>
> Dolores
>
>
>
>

natural_4u

July 21st 03, 07:11 AM

Legal aid denied me..

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
> <snicker> you call me a 'dumbass' yet you don't have a clue what an
> 'ex-parte' order is...........better look in the mirror
>
> BTW...nice snip job of the various points you didn't want to answer.
>
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > OK detective Paul... I don't know what an ex-parte order is but... the
> other
> > parent NEVER appeared in court once. That looked good for me in court.
> >
> >
> > I guess it doesn't hurt to tell you exactly what happened. The other
> parent
> > did not like the fact that my daughter had my last name and that MY
> parents
> > are still together and not alcoholics. The other parent, I guess was
> > jealous.
>
> You picked the other parent..........dumbass....................and we all
> know what ASSuming does.
>
> >The other parent had told the legal aid lawyer they were scared of
> > me... that why legal aid had denied me.
>
> A 'legal-aid' can't have you denied....only a judge can.........dumbass
>
> > I had to pay for my lawyer.
>
> So.
>
> >My
> > lawyer said to the judge, "My client has appeared at every court date
and
> > the other parents has not appeared once now the other parent has left my
> > client with the child"
> >
> > That cheap ass legal aid lawyer was put to shame. The judge did not
> hesitate
> > to reverse the restraining order and added a supervised visitation.
>
> "after 2 month of going back and forth to court I come home from work one
> day and find my daughter at my house with my parents. I assumed that this
> was a trap to make me go to jail so I went straight to court the next day
> with my daughter and spoke to a legal council."
>
> doesn't sound like 'not hesitating' to me............dumbass
>
> >
> > Hey dumb-ass I almost forgot one last thing, if the other parents legal
> aid
> > lawyer can't get a hold of their own client and left the child to me...
> the
> > judge called it neglect and abandonment.
>
> Are you asking a question or making a statement.......dumbass
>
> >My parents don't drink or do drugs.
> > The court usually will look at each parents family background for help
on
> > decision making on who the child should stay with.
>
> No they don't, they look at the parents.......dumbass
>
> >
> > I think you are just in a different part of the world with different
> rules.
>
> <snicker> you have already admitted you don't even know what the rules
> are.........dumbass
>
> >
> >
> >
> > ">
> > > This is where your story falls apart. The only type of order this
> could
> > be
> > > is an ex-parte order. It would only b calid until you both appeared
in
> > > court, typically within 14 days..................either you are full
of
> > crap
> > > or there is something you are not disclosing
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

natural_4u

July 21st 03, 07:33 AM

ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view

I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before calling
you a dumb-ass and stuff.

Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom want
to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too.. right?!

You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another road
block. I just don't want to take any chances.

The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it. She rather not see her own
daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see her
daughter. I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
decleared it.

I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.

Paul Fritz

July 21st 03, 12:56 PM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
>
> I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before calling
> you a dumb-ass and stuff.
>
> Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom want
> to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
right?!

Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.

(On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps right
about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker> )

>
> You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another
road
> block. I just don't want to take any chances.

Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to start
dealing with that fact.

>
> The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.

Then that is her decision.

>She rather not see her own
> daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see her
> daughter.

Then that is her decision

> I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> decleared it.

Based on the additional information you posted, this is not necessarily a
bad thing in the short term........she needs to reestaclish trust with the
courts.

>
> I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.

More so than you could ever imagine.

I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look up and
join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need it.....you are one
of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got custody of your child. The
reason to join is that you will have access to a lot of legal information,
many times lawyers attend......you need to learn how the system works, and
to make it work effectively for you and your daughter....parental kidnapping
laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it effectively.

Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of your
daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be a shared
parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not saying that this
will happen overnight, it will take time for her to regain yours, and the
courts trust. Children need both a mother and a father, it takes that to
create them, it certainly takes that to raise them properly.

Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why you need
to know 'the system'

Finally, learn to be protective, not controling

>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Tiffany

July 21st 03, 01:45 PM

natural_4u > wrote in message
. ca...
> ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
>
> I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before calling
> you a dumb-ass and stuff.
>
> Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom want
> to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
right?!
>
> You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another
road
> block. I just don't want to take any chances.
>
> The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it. She rather not see her
own
> daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see her
> daughter. I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> decleared it.
>
> I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

If you don't let your daughter mom see her, one day your daughter is going
to ask why? Do you want to get into that with her? You should be bad
mouthing aboutyour ex with your daughter or anything. We all have been
burned but we all swallow our pride when it comes to the ex. Its about the
kid, not you. :)

July 21st 03, 04:38 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message >...
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
>>
> You should start by growing up.
>
> >
> > Thanks People!!!
> >
> >

Paul, in case you didnt see the newsgroup name, its support single
parents, there is nothing supportive in your posting whatsoever. All I
can see is nitpicking, hair splitting and semantics from you Paul, I
dont know why you are coming from where you are coming from and I dont
want to know. But if what that lady is saying is true and I have no
reason whatsoever not to believe her, she was seeking help from people
who may have been there already.
If you have nothing constructive to say, say nowt. Telling someone to
grow up because they are scared their ex-partner will take their child
away, is somewhat ironic, cos I can spot the immature poster here and
its not natural4u. I hope everything works out for you
natural...Althought I cant see how a written agreement will make your
ex bring your child back on time.

turtledove

July 21st 03, 04:48 PM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> Hello people,
>
>
> I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
contact
> number, etc..
>
> You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
even
> let them take her for the day. Well...I'm not sure if I can give a
straight
> answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say to
> bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
hours
> late
>
> Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a long
> story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
evolving
> serious legal action.
>
> So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
>
> Thanks People!!!
>

At the beginning of the divorce, my ex couldn't be trusted to bring our son
home on time. He'd deliberately bring him late or early in the attempt to
screw with my schedule. As in, if I had to work until 5pm he'd show up at
4pm and say that I was irresponsible and the like....

so, I started having him sign a paper everytime he picked up our son that
said what time he was bringing him home. The same type paper you use at a
child care place. This was all at the suggestion of my lawyer mind you. It
soon worked, because every time he would say "You never told me what time to
bring him home" I'd whip out the paper.

Eventually the pettiness went away and we were better able to work with each
other with visitation (of course this was when DS was a toddler)

If you are going to do it. Be sure to not make the wording condescending.
Don't antagonize the situation. Always be mindful that your child needs
both parents.

with respect,
*bri (who isn't really proud of how me and my ex handled things early on,
but grew up and changed that quickly)

Paul Fritz

July 21st 03, 07:57 PM

Free hint to the clueless......getting your facts straight may stop you from
looking like such an ass the next time you post.

"SA" > wrote in message
om...
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
>...
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> >>
> > You should start by growing up.
> >
> > >
> > > Thanks People!!!
> > >
> > >
>
> Paul, in case you didnt see the newsgroup name, its support single
> parents, there is nothing supportive in your posting whatsoever. All I
> can see is nitpicking, hair splitting and semantics from you Paul, I
> dont know why you are coming from where you are coming from and I dont
> want to know. But if what that lady is saying is true and I have no
> reason whatsoever not to believe her, she was seeking help from people
> who may have been there already.
> If you have nothing constructive to say, say nowt. Telling someone to
> grow up because they are scared their ex-partner will take their child
> away, is somewhat ironic, cos I can spot the immature poster here and
> its not natural4u. I hope everything works out for you
> natural...Althought I cant see how a written agreement will make your
> ex bring your child back on time.

©kat©

July 21st 03, 08:19 PM

"natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> Legal aid denied me..

I said before, legal aid cannot deny you unless you make a higher income
than x amount. That's what legal aid is for. Lower income persons who
cannot afford a lawyer straight out of the book.

Moon Shyne

July 21st 03, 11:40 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
> >
> > I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before calling
> > you a dumb-ass and stuff.
> >
> > Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom want
> > to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
> right?!
>
> Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.
>
> (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps right
> about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker> )

For calling you out on how you slam women? Nah......... you wouldn't do such a
thing, would you!

>
> >
> > You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another
> road
> > block. I just don't want to take any chances.
>
> Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
> daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to start
> dealing with that fact.
>
> >
> > The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> > visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
>
> Then that is her decision.
>
> >She rather not see her own
> > daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see her
> > daughter.
>
> Then that is her decision
>
> > I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> > decleared it.
>
> Based on the additional information you posted, this is not necessarily a
> bad thing in the short term........she needs to reestaclish trust with the
> courts.
>
> >
> > I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
>
> More so than you could ever imagine.
>
>
> I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look up and
> join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need it.....you are one
> of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got custody of your child. The
> reason to join is that you will have access to a lot of legal information,
> many times lawyers attend......you need to learn how the system works, and
> to make it work effectively for you and your daughter....parental kidnapping
> laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it effectively.
>
> Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of your
> daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be a shared
> parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not saying that this
> will happen overnight, it will take time for her to regain yours, and the
> courts trust. Children need both a mother and a father, it takes that to
> create them, it certainly takes that to raise them properly.
>
> Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
> courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
> child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why you need
> to know 'the system'
>
> Finally, learn to be protective, not controling
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

Betsy

July 22nd 03, 12:15 AM

In ,
Paul Fritz > typed:
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
>> ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
>>
>> I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
>> calling you a dumb-ass and stuff.
>>
>> Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's
>> mom want to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her
>> daughter too.. right?!
>
> Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.
>
> (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps
> right about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker>
> )
>
>>
>> You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need
>> another road block. I just don't want to take any chances.
>
> Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
> daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to
> start dealing with that fact.
>
>>
>> The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
>> visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
>
> Then that is her decision.
>
>> She rather not see her own
>> daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to
>> see her daughter.
>
> Then that is her decision
>
>> I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
>> decleared it.
>
> Based on the additional information you posted, this is not
> necessarily a bad thing in the short term........she needs to
> reestaclish trust with the courts.
>
>>
>> I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
>
> More so than you could ever imagine.
>
>
> I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look
> up and join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need
> it.....you are one of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got
> custody of your child. The reason to join is that you will have
> access to a lot of legal information, many times lawyers
> attend......you need to learn how the system works, and to make it
> work effectively for you and your daughter....parental kidnapping
> laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it
> effectively.
>
> Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of
> your daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be
> a shared parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not
> saying that this will happen overnight, it will take time for her to
> regain yours, and the courts trust. Children need both a mother and
> a father, it takes that to create them, it certainly takes that to
> raise them properly.
>
> Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
> courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
> child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why
> you need to know 'the system'
>
> Finally, learn to be protective, not controling

Well said, Paul. You pointed out the exact same things I would have, but
more concisely than I could have. I tend to ramble on a bit, if you hadn't
noticed.

Betsy
--
Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
ketchup.

Lisa aka Surfer

July 22nd 03, 12:37 AM

"turtledove" > wrote in message
. com...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > Hello people,
> >
> >
> > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> contact
> > number, etc..
> >
> > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> even
> > let them take her for the day. Well...I'm not sure if I can give a
> straight
> > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say to
> > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> hours
> > late
> >
> > Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a
long
> > story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> evolving
> > serious legal action.
> >
> > So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
> >
> > Thanks People!!!
> >
>
>
> At the beginning of the divorce, my ex couldn't be trusted to bring our
son
> home on time. He'd deliberately bring him late or early in the attempt to
> screw with my schedule. As in, if I had to work until 5pm he'd show up at
> 4pm and say that I was irresponsible and the like....
>
> so, I started having him sign a paper everytime he picked up our son that
> said what time he was bringing him home. The same type paper you use at a
> child care place. This was all at the suggestion of my lawyer mind you.
It
> soon worked, because every time he would say "You never told me what time
to
> bring him home" I'd whip out the paper.
>
> Eventually the pettiness went away and we were better able to work with
each
> other with visitation (of course this was when DS was a toddler)
>
> If you are going to do it. Be sure to not make the wording condescending.
> Don't antagonize the situation. Always be mindful that your child needs
> both parents.
>
> with respect,
> *bri (who isn't really proud of how me and my ex handled things early on,
> but grew up and changed that quickly)
>
>
I too see nothing wrong with having the proper documentation. It saves a
lot in the long run. I've read through the thread, and can't help but think
that in your situation that it's really quite necessary. It may be wise to
ensure that both of you agree to terms of supervised visitation before
arranging a time. I really don't believe that anyone can be trusted without
having earned trust. You have the courts on your side, to help enforce the
terms of the visitation.

Good luck, I truly hope that it goes well. It's been a while, a leap of
faith never hurts, so, I hope that you will keep an open mind that you are
giving your daughter a wonderful opportunity. I hope that your ex sees that
too and doesn't blow it.

Lisa

Paul Fritz

July 22nd 03, 01:33 AM

"Betsy" > wrote in message
m...
> In ,
> Paul Fritz > typed:
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> >> ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
> >>
> >> I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
> >> calling you a dumb-ass and stuff.
> >>
> >> Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's
> >> mom want to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her
> >> daughter too.. right?!
> >
> > Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.
> >
> > (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps
> > right about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker>
> > )
> >
> >>
> >> You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need
> >> another road block. I just don't want to take any chances.
> >
> > Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
> > daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to
> > start dealing with that fact.
> >
> >>
> >> The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> >> visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
> >
> > Then that is her decision.
> >
> >> She rather not see her own
> >> daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to
> >> see her daughter.
> >
> > Then that is her decision
> >
> >> I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> >> decleared it.
> >
> > Based on the additional information you posted, this is not
> > necessarily a bad thing in the short term........she needs to
> > reestaclish trust with the courts.
> >
> >>
> >> I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
> >
> > More so than you could ever imagine.
> >
> >
> > I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look
> > up and join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need
> > it.....you are one of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got
> > custody of your child. The reason to join is that you will have
> > access to a lot of legal information, many times lawyers
> > attend......you need to learn how the system works, and to make it
> > work effectively for you and your daughter....parental kidnapping
> > laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it
> > effectively.
> >
> > Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of
> > your daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be
> > a shared parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not
> > saying that this will happen overnight, it will take time for her to
> > regain yours, and the courts trust. Children need both a mother and
> > a father, it takes that to create them, it certainly takes that to
> > raise them properly.
> >
> > Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
> > courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
> > child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why
> > you need to know 'the system'
> >
> > Finally, learn to be protective, not controling
>
>
> Well said, Paul. You pointed out the exact same things I would have, but
> more concisely than I could have. I tend to ramble on a bit, if you
hadn't
> noticed.

And I tend not to be an enabler of bad behavior and cut to the root of the
problem..........unlike some of the ASSuming whiners that post here. His
initial story wasn't consistent......and I had a gut feeling, based on the
posts, that he was the father.........no matter, my feeling would have been
the same either way.

>
> Betsy
> --
> Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
> ketchup.
>
>

Betsy

July 22nd 03, 01:56 AM

In ,
Paul Fritz > typed:
> "Betsy" > wrote in message
> m...
>> In ,
>> Paul Fritz > typed:
>>> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
>>> . ca...
>>>> ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
>>>>
>>>> I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
>>>> calling you a dumb-ass and stuff.
>>>>
>>>> Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's
>>>> mom want to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her
>>>> daughter too.. right?!
>>>
>>> Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.
>>>
>>> (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps
>>> right about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker>
>>> )
>>>
>>>>
>>>> You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need
>>>> another road block. I just don't want to take any chances.
>>>
>>> Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half
>>> your daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You
>>> need to start dealing with that fact.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the
>>>> supervised visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
>>>
>>> Then that is her decision.
>>>
>>>> She rather not see her own
>>>> daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to
>>>> see her daughter.
>>>
>>> Then that is her decision
>>>
>>>> I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
>>>> decleared it.
>>>
>>> Based on the additional information you posted, this is not
>>> necessarily a bad thing in the short term........she needs to
>>> reestaclish trust with the courts.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good
>>>> feeling.
>>>
>>> More so than you could ever imagine.
>>>
>>>
>>> I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you
>>> look up and join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need
>>> it.....you are one of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got
>>> custody of your child. The reason to join is that you will have
>>> access to a lot of legal information, many times lawyers
>>> attend......you need to learn how the system works, and to make it
>>> work effectively for you and your daughter....parental kidnapping
>>> laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it
>>> effectively.
>>>
>>> Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of
>>> your daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should
>>> be a shared parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am
>>> not saying that this will happen overnight, it will take time for
>>> her to regain yours, and the courts trust. Children need both a
>>> mother and a father, it takes that to create them, it certainly
>>> takes that to raise them properly.
>>>
>>> Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
>>> courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
>>> child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why
>>> you need to know 'the system'
>>>
>>> Finally, learn to be protective, not controling
>>
>>
>> Well said, Paul. You pointed out the exact same things I would
>> have, but more concisely than I could have. I tend to ramble on a
>> bit, if you hadn't noticed.
>
> And I tend not to be an enabler of bad behavior and cut to the root
> of the problem..........unlike some of the ASSuming whiners that post
> here. His initial story wasn't consistent......and I had a gut
> feeling, based on the posts, that he was the father.........no
> matter, my feeling would have been the same either way.
>

And I agreed with you throughout, although I didn't post because I wasn't
sure how. I am still new to this stuff, although I lurked for awhile back
several years ago, now that I saw mention of peterd in one of the posts. I
wasn't active then, and didn't really think I needed support. But I know I
have things to offer, and things to learn. I may go back to lurking at some
point. Who knows? Who cares?

Betsy (who wants to go searching for new sig lines but has no clue where to
start lol)

--
Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
ketchup.

>>
>> Betsy
>> --
>> Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good
>> with ketchup.

natural_4u

July 22nd 03, 07:34 AM

you are wrong!!! They denied me because the x party said in the affidavid
that she was affaid of me... I almost went to the local newpaper to
complain!

"©kat©" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> > Legal aid denied me..
>
> I said before, legal aid cannot deny you unless you make a higher income
> than x amount. That's what legal aid is for. Lower income persons who
> cannot afford a lawyer straight out of the book.
>
>

natural_4u

July 22nd 03, 07:58 AM

I was 21 when daughter was born. I was 24-25 when all of this court thing
happend I'm now 31.

I use to think like you ..regarding your second thought, that my daughter
needs both parent. This only works if both parents are normal people. I
really don't want to bash the X but I will not let my daughter's mom come
home 3-4 AM in the morning all drunk and wake up our daughter just so her
mom can show her friends this real cute dance that our daughter can do.

I agree with you that MOST children need both parent, but not all.

Single parents like me work twice as hard to be both parents. I tell
you...lol... it's hard to be a mother figure. I have lots of fun!!!
MY mother helps out a lot too, so it's not like my daughter is not around
any mother like figure.

How many single dad's do you know, know how to french brad hair??? Well let
me tell you ..... you know at lease one now...me!... lol!
DAMB it took a loooong time to even make it look right.

I hope you understand my view. Like I said before... her mom blew her chance
long time ago.

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
> >
> > I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
calling
> > you a dumb-ass and stuff.
> >
> > Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom
want
> > to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
> right?!
>
> Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.
>
> (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps right
> about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker> )
>
> >
> > You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another
> road
> > block. I just don't want to take any chances.
>
> Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
> daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to start
> dealing with that fact.
>
> >
> > The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> > visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
>
> Then that is her decision.
>
> >She rather not see her own
> > daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see
her
> > daughter.
>
> Then that is her decision
>
> > I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> > decleared it.
>
> Based on the additional information you posted, this is not necessarily a
> bad thing in the short term........she needs to reestaclish trust with the
> courts.
>
> >
> > I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
>
> More so than you could ever imagine.
>
>
> I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look up
and
> join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need it.....you are
one
> of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got custody of your child. The
> reason to join is that you will have access to a lot of legal information,
> many times lawyers attend......you need to learn how the system works, and
> to make it work effectively for you and your daughter....parental
kidnapping
> laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it
effectively.
>
> Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of your
> daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be a shared
> parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not saying that
this
> will happen overnight, it will take time for her to regain yours, and the
> courts trust. Children need both a mother and a father, it takes that
to
> create them, it certainly takes that to raise them properly.
>
> Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
> courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
> child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why you
need
> to know 'the system'
>
> Finally, learn to be protective, not controling
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

natural_4u

July 22nd 03, 08:18 AM

I know how you feel KAT.

You should of seen the look on my daughter's face when her mom didn't make
it to the Chucky Cheese Party. F**K... I was choked!!!!!

I felt so god dam helpless!!!! My daughter was 6 when this happened

"©kat©" > wrote in message
...
> "natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> > ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
> >
> > I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
calling
> > you a dumb-ass and stuff.
> >
> > Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom
want
> > to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
> right?!
> >
> > You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another
> road
> > block. I just don't want to take any chances.
> >
> > The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> > visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it. She rather not see her
> own
> > daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see
her
> > daughter. I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> > decleared it.
> >
> > I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
>
> We are all single parents here, and often for a reason. (Other parent's
> death, other parent leaving, single from the start, bla bla bla) so I'm
sure
> it is fairly safe to say that a good majority of us here have been burned
> before, and maybe some still, and of us who have been burned do know it's
> not a good feeling.
> I broke up with my ex right shortly after I found out I was pregnant. I
can
> count on 1 hand how many times he's seen Bran, and there is no need to
count
> anything when it comes to remembering his birthday and calling, emailing,
> bringing presents, showing face for special events in Brans life,
> remembering him at Christmas, dropping by ever to come see him and all
that.
> When we go out and happen to stumble across him, he barely even looks at
me,
> yet can often carry a conversation over the ****ing computer.
>
> And as for your daughter's mother not wanting any contact at all, that's
> fine. That is out of your control completely. I learned long ago you
> cannot make someone want, love, see or care for someone when they don't
want
> to. If it was her choice, then just accept it and move on. It seems you
> have gotten to the point of moving on, yet not getting over it. In some
> cases, there really is nothing you can do. You are only a human being,
just
> like the rest of us, and it is not any of our places to try and change
> someone else, even if it is something we believe to be right. If your
> daughter's mother has no interest in seeing your daughter the way the
courts
> make it, then that is her choice, and I'm not sure what the point of this
> entire mess is...
>
>

natural_4u

July 22nd 03, 09:13 AM

I hate to correct you but I'm a 14 hour drive West from you. :-) Still
neighbors
I use to think that legal aid lawyer cost the same as client paid lawyer...
not all!

The government will appoint you a cheap.... sorry I mean a low rate lawyer,
if you don't request a specific lawyer.
And I use to think that they (Legal Aid) CAN"T deny you... but they did to
me. Legal Aid looked at the mother's Affidavit and turned me down in a wink
of an eye. The court system was bound to make me loose this battle. I came
real close to going to the local newspaper to get funding. But I turned to
friends and family to borrow money... lots of money. I went to the yellow
pages and picked one of the first lawyer that was in the lawyer pages (the
ones with a full page ad)

My lawyer said he had seen lots of cases like mine where the mom pulls a
fast one and wins. Especially people that deal with legal aid.
Parents (mother or fathers) that do not work but have kids will just try to
win custody just so they can get more money from welfare and CCTB.
(Canadian Child Tax Benifits)

Parents like that make me sick in the stomach!!!!!!!!

"©kat©" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" wrote in message ...
>
> I could be wrong, but it appears you (natural_4u) are right close to home.
> I'm in Edmonton. You look like you come from Calgary. Howdy, neighbour.
>
> > OK detective Paul... I don't know what an ex-parte order is but... the
> other
> > parent NEVER appeared in court once. That looked good for me in court.
>
> Of course it would.
>
> > I guess it doesn't hurt to tell you exactly what happened. The other
> parent
> > did not like the fact that my daughter had my last name and that MY
> parents
> > are still together and not alcoholics.
>
> My son has my last name as well. That seems like a silly reason to just
> abandon a child, but you never know with some people...
> My parents are not alcoholics... lol
>
> > The other parent, I guess was
> > jealous. The other parent had told the legal aid lawyer they were
scared
> of
> > me... that why legal aid had denied me.
>
> The only way you can be denied legal aid, in Alberta, (which appears to be
> where you are from) is if you make a certain income which would kick out
out
> of being able to obtain legal aid assistance.
>
> > I had to pay for my lawyer. My
> > lawyer said to the judge, "My client has appeared at every court date
and
> > the other parents has not appeared once now the other parent has left my
> > client with the child"
>
> Good for a lawyer being able to tell the truth - if it is just that.
>
> > That cheap ass legal aid lawyer was put to shame. The judge did not
> hesitate
> > to reverse the restraining order and added a supervised visitation.
>
> Legal aid lawyers are not cheap. The government pays for legal aid if you
> cannot afford a lawyer. Many lawyers can be put to shame, but legal aid
> lawyers are often the same exact lawyers you pay for. They take turns
> going as paid lawyers and legal aid lawyers, if they so desire. I'm also
> not sure why a judge would not hesitate to add supervised visitation if
the
> other parent has done nothing but skip out on court dates.
>
> > Hey dumb-ass I almost forgot one last thing, if the other parents legal
> aid
> > lawyer can't get a hold of their own client and left the child to me...
> the
> > judge called it neglect and abandonment. My parents don't drink or do
> drugs.
> > The court usually will look at each parents family background for help
on
> > decision making on who the child should stay with.
>
> A lawyer is a lawyer. It doesn't matter if they work directly for a
paying
> client or for a government funded client. If a judge calls what your
> child's other parent did neglect and abandonment, and their lawyer could
not
> contact them or they didn't show up, why on earth would the other parent
get
> visitation? Supervised or not, they skipped out on court dates and
> abandoned your child. The courts do not usually look at the background of
> the parents' parents or family. Maybe in a few cases, but generally,
there
> isn't really any reason to, except possibly in certain circumstances.
Maybe
> your situation is one of those, I don't know. But there is no way that
the
> courts can hold against you something like if your brother is in a
hospital
> for mental disabilities, your parents are alcoholics, your sister is a
> prostitute. That usually has nothing to do with anything - again, on most
> occasions.
>
> > I think you are just in a different part of the world with different
> rules.
>
> As I said before, it appears we are neighbours. Please do correct me if
I'm
> wrong. But if you are somewhere south, the rules are all the same across
> the province.
>
>

natural_4u

July 22nd 03, 09:36 AM

Turtledove,

I've been wanting to here this for a long time!!!

Can you give me any samples of how an agreement form should start out? It
would be much appreciated. Feel free to e-mail me if you want... ok?

Thanks

"turtledove" > wrote in message
. com...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > Hello people,
> >
> >
> > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> contact
> > number, etc..
> >
> > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> even
> > let them take her for the day. Well...I'm not sure if I can give a
> straight
> > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say to
> > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> hours
> > late
> >
> > Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a
long
> > story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> evolving
> > serious legal action.
> >
> > So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
> >
> > Thanks People!!!
> >
>
>
> At the beginning of the divorce, my ex couldn't be trusted to bring our
son
> home on time. He'd deliberately bring him late or early in the attempt to
> screw with my schedule. As in, if I had to work until 5pm he'd show up at
> 4pm and say that I was irresponsible and the like....
>
> so, I started having him sign a paper everytime he picked up our son that
> said what time he was bringing him home. The same type paper you use at a
> child care place. This was all at the suggestion of my lawyer mind you.
It
> soon worked, because every time he would say "You never told me what time
to
> bring him home" I'd whip out the paper.
>
> Eventually the pettiness went away and we were better able to work with
each
> other with visitation (of course this was when DS was a toddler)
>
> If you are going to do it. Be sure to not make the wording condescending.
> Don't antagonize the situation. Always be mindful that your child needs
> both parents.
>
> with respect,
> *bri (who isn't really proud of how me and my ex handled things early on,
> but grew up and changed that quickly)
>
>

natural_4u

July 22nd 03, 09:41 AM

Thank for the support :-)

"Lisa aka Surfer" > wrote in message
...
>
> "turtledove" > wrote in message
> . com...
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > Hello people,
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> > contact
> > > number, etc..
> > >
> > > You might be thinking... if I don't trust the other person/parent why
> > even
> > > let them take her for the day. Well...I'm not sure if I can give a
> > straight
> > > answer... and verbal agreements just don't cut-it anymore. When I say
to
> > > bring her (my daughter) back by 5 PM , it's never on time, always 3-4
> > hours
> > > late
> > >
> > > Before we went to court it was all verbal agreements... and to make a
> long
> > > story short, 7 years ago a SIMPLE weekend stay turn into a disaster
> > evolving
> > > serious legal action.
> > >
> > > So if I serve a consent form I might not have to worry.
> > >
> > > Thanks People!!!
> > >
> >
> >
> > At the beginning of the divorce, my ex couldn't be trusted to bring our
> son
> > home on time. He'd deliberately bring him late or early in the attempt
to
> > screw with my schedule. As in, if I had to work until 5pm he'd show up
at
> > 4pm and say that I was irresponsible and the like....
> >
> > so, I started having him sign a paper everytime he picked up our son
that
> > said what time he was bringing him home. The same type paper you use at
a
> > child care place. This was all at the suggestion of my lawyer mind you.
> It
> > soon worked, because every time he would say "You never told me what
time
> to
> > bring him home" I'd whip out the paper.
> >
> > Eventually the pettiness went away and we were better able to work with
> each
> > other with visitation (of course this was when DS was a toddler)
> >
> > If you are going to do it. Be sure to not make the wording
condescending.
> > Don't antagonize the situation. Always be mindful that your child needs
> > both parents.
> >
> > with respect,
> > *bri (who isn't really proud of how me and my ex handled things early
on,
> > but grew up and changed that quickly)
> >
> >
> I too see nothing wrong with having the proper documentation. It saves a
> lot in the long run. I've read through the thread, and can't help but
think
> that in your situation that it's really quite necessary. It may be wise
to
> ensure that both of you agree to terms of supervised visitation before
> arranging a time. I really don't believe that anyone can be trusted
without
> having earned trust. You have the courts on your side, to help enforce
the
> terms of the visitation.
>
> Good luck, I truly hope that it goes well. It's been a while, a leap of
> faith never hurts, so, I hope that you will keep an open mind that you are
> giving your daughter a wonderful opportunity. I hope that your ex sees
that
> too and doesn't blow it.
>
> Lisa
>

©kat©

July 22nd 03, 10:11 AM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> you are wrong!!! They denied me because the x party said in the affidavid
> that she was affaid of me... I almost went to the local newpaper to
> complain!
>
>
> "©kat©" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> > > Legal aid denied me..
> >
> > I said before, legal aid cannot deny you unless you make a higher income
> > than x amount. That's what legal aid is for. Lower income persons who
> > cannot afford a lawyer straight out of the book.
> >
> >
>
>

I would complain to someone, if I were you. You cannot be denied legal aid
because someone says they're scared of you. That's just plain and stupid.
What happens to the guy who tries to rape and attack someone? In that case,
I do think it's safe to assume that the victim would indeed be terrified of
the attacker, and for obvious reasons, yet, because we all have the right to
a fair shot in the courts, and an attorney, and if you cannot get your own,
you will be assigned one - ie, legal aid, pro bono, what have you.
If this is what has happened to you, then someone is ****ing you around, or
this is not what has happened. Keep pressing, if you do require legal aid,
and can qualify, for example, you are considered low income, then there is
no way you can be denied legal assistance.

©kat©

July 22nd 03, 10:24 AM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> I know how you feel KAT.
>
> You should of seen the look on my daughter's face when her mom didn't make
> it to the Chucky Cheese Party. F**K... I was choked!!!!!
>
> I felt so god dam helpless!!!! My daughter was 6 when this happened
>
<snipped all the mess below, in regards to forgotten birthdays and other
similar times, basically>

I'm sure that there are many people in this similar position. It does go
both ways. For every loving, non-custodial parent, there is always one ass
who "forgets" or just doesn't give a ****. I happen to be the second group,
and obviously your daughter would have been old enough to understand and
probably be quite upset by her 6th birthday. It's different for their first
and second birthday, or just pretty much the few early years, but whe you
have something, or HAD something, it's different.
I don't believe Brandon really cares who is at his birthdays. He's only 2
and a half, and all he really cares about is blowing out birthday candles,
sucking the icing off them after, then trying to put the candles back in the
cake for more as everyone tries to stop him. It's all fun for him right
now. As for presents, some may be very useful (clothes) but he doesn't
really care unless they have trucks, Spiderman, bugs, Hulk or Pooh on it.
Toys are useless unless they are trucks. But by 6, I assume it would be
very heartbreaking, even for you, no matter how far out to sea or on the
rocks your relationship with her mother may have been.
I know that when birthday comes around, as well as Christmas, I kinda hop up
to grab the phone as fast as can be, hoping that it just might be *him*
calling to wish his own son (that he denies to everyone but himself) a happy
birthday or a merry Christmas. Would you guess it never happens?
I'm not at all crazy about him - I really believe I have no reason to be. I
have written him off from our lives completely. Should he ever decide to
call one day - for whatever reason, I guess I'll have to go from there, as I
can say anything right now, but what would really happen (if it ever did)
would most likely be totally different. In all honesty, if someone told me
through the grapevine that he had died, I doubt I would even put up a dollar
or two to send a sympathy card to his family.

©kat©

July 22nd 03, 10:46 AM

"natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> I hate to correct you but I'm a 14 hour drive West from you. :-) Still
> neighbors

Not that it really matters, but I am wondering why you are showing up as
Cowtown for me on here, as well as the other one.
*Shrugs*
BC, Alberta, it's all the same to me...

> I use to think that legal aid lawyer cost the same as client paid
lawyer...
> not all!

Legal aid is the same lawyers as what you get pulling out of the phone book.
I bet if you asked your lawyer, or other lawyers in the same firm, they
would probably say that they are on the rotation list of legal aid lawyers.
They still get paid the same, just not by their client. The gov't pays
them. They still do the same work, they are still the same people and they
still work for clients regardless of who or what is paying them.

> The government will appoint you a cheap.... sorry I mean a low rate
lawyer,
> if you don't request a specific lawyer.

There's no such thing as a cheap or low rate lawyer. They're all
bloodhounds sniffing out the area for the biggest bang for their buck, but
legal aid lawyers put themselves on the rotation list, and every once in a
while you do get a student lawyer, who is often led and steered in the right
direction by an actual lawyer (one who is not a student) and even these
young newbie lawyers are working after their schooling and doing their 2
years required. I'm not sure if you can request for legal aid lawyers
because they do work on rotation, so I can't really say.

> And I use to think that they (Legal Aid) CAN"T deny you... but they did to
> me. Legal Aid looked at the mother's Affidavit and turned me down in a
wink
> of an eye. The court system was bound to make me loose this battle. I came
> real close to going to the local newspaper to get funding. But I turned to
> friends and family to borrow money... lots of money. I went to the yellow
> pages and picked one of the first lawyer that was in the lawyer pages (the
> ones with a full page ad)

Legal aid CAN deny you - if you are not low income. I have no clue why you
would be denied because of her affidavit. That seems somewhat silly.
Suppose you attack me and end up in court and need a lawyer? Obviously in
my written declaration I would state certain things that would not make you
look good, and you cannot just walk into a courtroom without a lawyer, if
you require or want a lawyer. If you had to borrow money from friends and
family, then I assume you are not on a very high income that would knock you
out of the group eligible for legal aid.

> My lawyer said he had seen lots of cases like mine where the mom pulls a
> fast one and wins. Especially people that deal with legal aid.
> Parents (mother or fathers) that do not work but have kids will just try
to
> win custody just so they can get more money from welfare and CCTB.
> (Canadian Child Tax Benifits)
>
> Parents like that make me sick in the stomach!!!!!!!!

Right now, I am not working. School is done, and my personal savings are
pretty much nothing, and it hasn't been that long since school was out. I'm
looking for work, which has been about as amusing and useful as a dog
chasing its tail. I've always been getting my child tax credit since
Brandon was born, but I would never, ever try to keep my son ONLY for the
reason of a big fat cheque of only 200, or a few bucks more on a welfare
cheque, but I'm sure that there are some that do. Those types of parents
that you speak of make me sick as well. Legal aid vs. Lawyer, as it's been
put here is still Lawyer X vs. Lawyer Y, and if you like it or not, Lawyer X
is going to lose. How do you know which lawyer is Legal aid and which one
is Lawyer?

Only because this is making me agry AND curious, I am going to call my cuz
tomorrow and get some more real info... When I called him earlier (for other
reasons) I just asked him a few questions that came to mind, and they were
somewhat out of the blue as my mind raced through the events of the day.
I'm gonna make a list to remember certain things ;)

Paul Fritz

July 22nd 03, 01:10 PM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> I was 21 when daughter was born. I was 24-25 when all of this court thing
> happend I'm now 31.
>
> I use to think like you ..regarding your second thought, that my daughter
> needs both parent. This only works if both parents are normal people. I
> really don't want to bash the X but I will not let my daughter's mom come
> home 3-4 AM in the morning all drunk and wake up our daughter just so her
> mom can show her friends this real cute dance that our daughter can do.
>
> I agree with you that MOST children need both parent, but not all.

All children NEED both parents......but it does not mean both parents are
fit to parent at the current time.

>
> Single parents like me work twice as hard to be both parents. I tell
> you...lol... it's hard to be a mother figure.

That is the whole point......you can't be.....as much as you would like to
be, each sex brings different aspects to the paretning table.

> I have lots of fun!!!
> MY mother helps out a lot too, so it's not like my daughter is not around
> any mother like figure.

Good for both of them

>
> How many single dad's do you know, know how to french brad hair??? Well
let
> me tell you ..... you know at lease one now...me!... lol!

> DAMB it took a loooong time to even make it look right.
>
> I hope you understand my view. Like I said before... her mom blew her
chance
> long time ago.

I cannot stress this enough..........don't close the door on the kids
mother.....as much as you'd like to........people change with time....well
most of them........always leave the door open for the mother to return to
your daughter's life, allow her to build trust is she is willing, but at the
same time remain protective. Doing this, you will not cause resentment in
your daughter later on over the 'what ifs' and you will have taken the high
road and will be the better parent for it.

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
> > >
> > > I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
> calling
> > > you a dumb-ass and stuff.
> > >
> > > Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom
> want
> > > to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
> > right?!
> >
> > Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.
> >
> > (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps right
> > about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker> )
> >
> > >
> > > You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need
another
> > road
> > > block. I just don't want to take any chances.
> >
> > Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
> > daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to
start
> > dealing with that fact.
> >
> > >
> > > The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> > > visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
> >
> > Then that is her decision.
> >
> > >She rather not see her own
> > > daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see
> her
> > > daughter.
> >
> > Then that is her decision
> >
> > > I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> > > decleared it.
> >
> > Based on the additional information you posted, this is not necessarily
a
> > bad thing in the short term........she needs to reestaclish trust with
the
> > courts.
> >
> > >
> > > I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
> >
> > More so than you could ever imagine.
> >
> >
> > I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look up
> and
> > join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need it.....you are
> one
> > of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got custody of your child.
The
> > reason to join is that you will have access to a lot of legal
information,
> > many times lawyers attend......you need to learn how the system works,
and
> > to make it work effectively for you and your daughter....parental
> kidnapping
> > laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it
> effectively.
> >
> > Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of
your
> > daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be a
shared
> > parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not saying that
> this
> > will happen overnight, it will take time for her to regain yours, and
the
> > courts trust. Children need both a mother and a father, it takes
that
> to
> > create them, it certainly takes that to raise them properly.
> >
> > Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
> > courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
> > child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why you
> need
> > to know 'the system'
> >
> > Finally, learn to be protective, not controling
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

turtledove

July 22nd 03, 01:32 PM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> Turtledove,
>
> I've been wanting to here this for a long time!!!
>
> Can you give me any samples of how an agreement form should start out? It
> would be much appreciated. Feel free to e-mail me if you want... ok?
>
>
> Thanks
>

Basically, my agreements would have the description of the whole visitation.
Time of drop-off and time of pick-up. Our son was lactose intolerant, so I
had a statement in there stating just that (I acknowledge that I understand
that DS is lactose intolerant...or something like that). Then I told my ex
that the paper was for both of our benefit. Mainly so we both knew what the
schedule was. There were two copies, one for him and one for me. Oh yeah,
and I also put all contact information and emergency information on there,
like in case I had to work late my grandmother was allowed to pick DS up. I
made sure to NOT make the paper look like a legal document.

Let me tell you it was like pulling teeth to get him to sign it the first
time. I really had to play the 'it's best for both of us because we don't
get along at all, besides it has all the information you need on it'. And
the 'now you have a written document saying that you DID have
visitation'....he like the second one. And it was true, he could keep that
for himself to prove he did visit his son.

Did that help??

*brianne

ps. I think I started it like this: (insert name here) has agree to
visitation on _______. He will be picking DS up at ___________ and bringing
him home between _________ and __________. During this time I can be
reached at work at _____________________ if an emergency arises.

then I'd start on the DS eats this, doesn't like this, and is allergic to
this....and continue from there.

turtledove

July 22nd 03, 05:11 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
> The dangerous thing here is that currently, supervised visitation has been
> ordered. If he just allows the mother to pick up the kid, disregarding
the
> standing order, then he is opening Pandora's box. If the court allows
him
> to select the supervisor then he should do it, and the supervisor would be
> the one to take and return the kid. If the mother doesn't agree to it,
> then it is her problem, she has a choice of abiding by the current order
or
> attempting to change it. But at this point I would highly recommend NOT
> varying from the standing order.
>

Yikes!! I forgot that part. I agree with you, Paul. It's up the to the
supervisor, not either parents at this point.

hugs (thanks for keeping me in line!!)

*b

Paul Fritz

July 22nd 03, 06:39 PM

The dangerous thing here is that currently, supervised visitation has been
ordered. If he just allows the mother to pick up the kid, disregarding the
standing order, then he is opening Pandora's box. If the court allows him
to select the supervisor then he should do it, and the supervisor would be
the one to take and return the kid. If the mother doesn't agree to it,
then it is her problem, she has a choice of abiding by the current order or
attempting to change it. But at this point I would highly recommend NOT
varying from the standing order.

"turtledove" > wrote in message
om...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > Turtledove,
> >
> > I've been wanting to here this for a long time!!!
> >
> > Can you give me any samples of how an agreement form should start out?
It
> > would be much appreciated. Feel free to e-mail me if you want... ok?
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
>
>
> Basically, my agreements would have the description of the whole
visitation.
> Time of drop-off and time of pick-up. Our son was lactose intolerant, so
I
> had a statement in there stating just that (I acknowledge that I
understand
> that DS is lactose intolerant...or something like that). Then I told my
ex
> that the paper was for both of our benefit. Mainly so we both knew what
the
> schedule was. There were two copies, one for him and one for me. Oh
yeah,
> and I also put all contact information and emergency information on there,
> like in case I had to work late my grandmother was allowed to pick DS up.
I
> made sure to NOT make the paper look like a legal document.
>
> Let me tell you it was like pulling teeth to get him to sign it the first
> time. I really had to play the 'it's best for both of us because we don't
> get along at all, besides it has all the information you need on it'. And
> the 'now you have a written document saying that you DID have
> visitation'....he like the second one. And it was true, he could keep
that
> for himself to prove he did visit his son.
>
> Did that help??
>
> *brianne
>
> ps. I think I started it like this: (insert name here) has agree to
> visitation on _______. He will be picking DS up at ___________ and
bringing
> him home between _________ and __________. During this time I can be
> reached at work at _____________________ if an emergency arises.
>
> then I'd start on the DS eats this, doesn't like this, and is allergic to
> this....and continue from there.
>
>

Paul Fritz

July 22nd 03, 06:43 PM

"SA" > wrote in message
om...
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
>...
> > Free hint to the clueless......getting your facts straight may stop you
from
> > looking like such an ass the next time you post.
>
>
> > > Paul, in case you didnt see the newsgroup name, its support single
> > > parents,
>
> Ok fact check number one, it is the support single parents
> newsgroup!!!

Support does not equal enabling

>
>
>
> But if what that lady is saying is true and I have no
> > > reason whatsoever not to believe her, she was seeking help from people
> > > who may have been there already.
>
> next fact check, yup, natural4u is seeking help, as I said.

Not a 'she <snicker>

>
>
> > > Althought I cant see how a written agreement will make your
> > > ex bring your child back on time.
>
> Because if someone is determined to break the law by unlawfully taking
> a child, albeit their child, they will. There are numerous cases of it
> happening all the time.

Duh.....a written agreement will have no standing when there is a current
court order.

>
> There are certainly a lot of asses in here, no doubt about that..

What did yo do, look in the mirror?

>. I
> am blown away by the aggression in this room, there should be another
> place where this type of posting is sought and welcome.

If you can't handle the heat....................

>I dont think I
> have ever seen such nastiness for no reason whatsoever in my life.

You have no clue

> But, at the end of the day, I am thankful that I do not come across
> this people in real life, what a horrible thought!

What a horrible thought that you might actually learn something.

Dennis Here

July 22nd 03, 08:04 PM

SA wrote in message
>
>Ok fact check number one, it is the support single parents
>newsgroup!!!

Yes at is and there is plenty of support available here.
Support however, does not mean agreeing with what a poster says.

>But if what that lady is saying is true and I have no
> reason whatsoever not to believe her, she was seeking help from people
> who may have been there already.

You made an assumption. It was actually a man.

>
>There are certainly a lot of asses in here, no doubt about that... I
>am blown away by the aggression in this room,

You just happen to have walked in at a time when some old differences are
being re-hashed.

>there should be another
>place where this type of posting is sought and welcome.

OK. Try
www.rollercoaster.ie
Go to the single parent board. There are a few good discussions there ATM
particularly "Maintenance Controversy" and "Shared Parenting" As most people
there disagree with me as well you should be in good company!

You could also try James' moderated board at
www.solo.ie

>I dont think I
>have ever seen such nastiness for no reason whatsoever in my life.

Just because you don't know the reason does not mean that there isn't one.
I agree that it is a bit nasty ATM but it is not the norm. Just keep out of
those threads.

>But, at the end of the day, I am thankful that I do not come across
>this people in real life, what a horrible thought!

But we may have already met! I'm only down the road!
Stick around for a while and just don't read the posts from the people that
bother you. This can be arranged on the tool bar on your computer, Lorian is
particularly good at explaining computer settings, just ask her.

Dennis

dolores

July 22nd 03, 10:17 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
> Why this smells to high heaven.....................
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > 7 years ago before court the other parent wanted to spend the weekend
with
> > our daughter.. naturally without any hesitation I agreed . Come Sunday
> night
> > my daughter was never returned.
>
> With no court order WRT parenting time......the other parent has just as
> much right to the child as you.

Dont think anyone is saying they're not just as entitled, but ARE saying
that the custodial parent has every right to know where the child is, or is
this just too much like common sense for you Paul Fritz.
>
> >I tried calling and going to the place where
> > my daughter was staying but no answer.
>
> No one is required to answer a phone
>
> >Tried calling the police and they
> > said call back in 24 hours.
>
> Standard procedure
>
> >
> > Monday morning a sheriff came to my house and served me a restraining
> order
> > stating no verbal, physical, or written contact with my daughter or the
> > other parent. What did I do to deserve this?
>
> This is where your story falls apart. The only type of order this could
be
> is an ex-parte order. It would only b calid until you both appeared in
> court, typically within 14 days

Well I dunno about Amerikaa, but an ex parte order is just that, ex parte,
and they aint that hard to get either, ya just need to be convincing
enough....thats' all...

Dolores

dolores

July 22nd 03, 10:20 PM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> OK detective Paul... I don't know what an ex-parte order is but... the
other
> parent NEVER appeared in court once. That looked good for me in court.
>
>
> I guess it doesn't hurt to tell you exactly what happened. The other
parent
> did not like the fact that my daughter had my last name and that MY
parents
> are still together and not alcoholics. The other parent, I guess was
> jealous. The other parent had told the legal aid lawyer they were scared
of
> me... that why legal aid had denied me. I had to pay for my lawyer. My
> lawyer said to the judge, "My client has appeared at every court date and
> the other parents has not appeared once now the other parent has left my
> client with the child"
>
> That cheap ass legal aid lawyer was put to shame. The judge did not
hesitate
> to reverse the restraining order and added a supervised visitation.
>
> Hey dumb-ass I almost forgot one last thing, if the other parents legal
aid
> lawyer can't get a hold of their own client and left the child to me...
the
> judge called it neglect and abandonment. My parents don't drink or do
drugs.
> The court usually will look at each parents family background for help on
> decision making on who the child should stay with.
>
> I think you are just in a different part of the world with different
rules.
>

Yeah, and that world is call hisanus.........waaaay out there

Dolores

dolores

July 22nd 03, 10:26 PM

"©kat©" > wrote in message
. ..
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > you are wrong!!! They denied me because the x party said in the
affidavid
> > that she was affaid of me... I almost went to the local newpaper to
> > complain!
> >
> >
> > "©kat©" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> > > > Legal aid denied me..
> > >
> > > I said before, legal aid cannot deny you unless you make a higher
income
> > > than x amount. That's what legal aid is for. Lower income persons
who
> > > cannot afford a lawyer straight out of the book.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
> I would complain to someone, if I were you. You cannot be denied legal
aid
> because someone says they're scared of you. That's just plain and stupid.
> What happens to the guy who tries to rape and attack someone? In that
case,
> I do think it's safe to assume that the victim would indeed be terrified
of
> the attacker, and for obvious reasons, yet, because we all have the right
to
> a fair shot in the courts, and an attorney, and if you cannot get your
own,
> you will be assigned one - ie, legal aid, pro bono, what have you.
> If this is what has happened to you, then someone is ****ing you around,
or
> this is not what has happened. Keep pressing, if you do require legal
aid,
> and can qualify, for example, you are considered low income, then there is
> no way you can be denied legal assistance.
>

I dunno is US is different to UK, but should the opposing parties, both
apply for legal aid, then only one will recieve it. It would appear to me
that in this case this poster is the father.....and if a woman turns up at a
solicitor seeking legal aid then tis more likely she will get it if *fear*
is factored in....and dont tell me that this has never happened...cos I know
women that have used this against their husbands to deny him access to his
children......

There may be more absent fathers than mothers but this doesnt mean that some
women wont stoop to any level to make it so......then whinge cos they dont
get CS...

Dolores

Dolores
>

dolores

July 22nd 03, 10:30 PM

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view

A restraining order can normally only be issued if *both* parties are
present...However, under certain circumstances, eg domestic violence, then
the aggrieved can apply for an ex parte order, without the alleged
aggravator being present at the hearing. Usually they are short term, but
there are instances where they can be valid for a few months. Depends on
where the judges sympathies lie more often than not...

Dolores

>
>
>
>
>
>

dolores

July 22nd 03, 10:41 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
> >
> > I didn't know that before. I guess I should of looked it up before
calling
> > you a dumb-ass and stuff.
> >
> > Paul... I'm just saying that why all of sudden does my daughter's mom
want
> > to start seeing her again? I know... because it's her daughter too..
> right?!
>
> Exactly......and your daughter NEEDS both her parents.

Dunno what planet yer on........but I've got some news for ya.......not ALL
parents are interested in their kids.....

>
> (On a side note.........Amy Lynn should be choking on her kneecaps right
> about now, she stuck her feet so far down her throat <snicker> )
>
> >
> > You know I'm just getting my life back together and I dont need another
> road
> > block. I just don't want to take any chances.
>
> Your daughter's mother is NOT a road block...........she is half your
> daughter.......and will be part of your life forever. You need to start
> dealing with that fact.

>
> >
> > The court did let me decide on the person to pick for the supervised
> > visitation. My daughter's mom never went for it.
>
> Then that is her decision.
>
> >She rather not see her own
> > daughter than to have someone peeking over everytime she wants to see
her
> > daughter.
>
> Then that is her decision
>
> > I nevered ask for that supervised visitation, the judge just
> > decleared it.
>
> Based on the additional information you posted, this is not necessarily a
> bad thing in the short term........she needs to reestaclish trust with the
> courts.
>
> >
> > I'm not sure if you'd been burned before but its' not a good feeling.
>
> More so than you could ever imagine.
>
>
> I may be wrong, but you sound young. I would suggest that you look up
and
> join a local 'father's rights' group. Not that you need it.....you are
one
> of the lucky (and rare) ones that actually got custody of your child. The
> reason to join is that you will have access to a lot of legal information,
> many times lawyers attend......you need to learn how the system works, and
> to make it work effectively for you and your daughter....parental
kidnapping
> laws for one........but you need set parenting times to use it
effectively.
>
> Second......never bash your ex to your daughter, and for the sake of your
> daughter, and in her best interest, your ultimate goal should be a shared
> parenting of your your daughter with her mother. I am not saying that
this
> will happen overnight, it will take time for her to regain yours, and the
> courts trust. Children need both a mother and a father, it takes that
to
> create them, it certainly takes that to raise them properly.

Errrr...once again, I dunno what planet yer on.....there are one or two kids
in this world actually better off without the mother or father....

>
> Third, realize that your daughter is a 'ward of the court' The
> courts......not you, will be the ultimate decision maker for your
> child......as bad as that seems, it is the fact........which is why you
need
> to know 'the system'
>
> Finally, learn to be protective, not controling

In order to *protect* your child/ren you have to have a certain amount of
*control*.......and unfortunately that *control* is often determined by the
courts cos the parents cant agree...

Dolores
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

dolores

July 22nd 03, 11:09 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "SA" > wrote in message
> om...
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> >...
> > > Free hint to the clueless......getting your facts straight may stop
you
> from
> > > looking like such an ass the next time you post.
> >
> >
> > > > Paul, in case you didnt see the newsgroup name, its support single
> > > > parents,
> >
> > Ok fact check number one, it is the support single parents
> > newsgroup!!!
>
> Support does not equal enabling

Errrr, yes it does....if done right.....Ya only have to look around in real
life...ya know!!..that thing outside yer front door...to see that "Support
*does* equal enable

Dolores

natural_4u

July 23rd 03, 10:52 AM

Like I said before ... my daughter's mom asked for our daughter to spend the
weekend with her and I naturally agreed. She must of said something
(bull****ed) to someone to get that restraining order.

First she tricks me to get our daughter...
Then traps me with the order...

"dolores" > wrote in message
...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > ex-parte = From a one-sided or strongly biased point of view
>
> A restraining order can normally only be issued if *both* parties are
> present...However, under certain circumstances, eg domestic violence, then
> the aggrieved can apply for an ex parte order, without the alleged
> aggravator being present at the hearing. Usually they are short term, but
> there are instances where they can be valid for a few months. Depends on
> where the judges sympathies lie more often than not...
>
> Dolores
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

natural_4u

July 23rd 03, 11:14 AM

Oh brianne.. you are the best!!! That helped a lot.

But Paul is correct.

"turtledove" > wrote in message
om...
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > Turtledove,
> >
> > I've been wanting to here this for a long time!!!
> >
> > Can you give me any samples of how an agreement form should start out?
It
> > would be much appreciated. Feel free to e-mail me if you want... ok?
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
>
>
> Basically, my agreements would have the description of the whole
visitation.
> Time of drop-off and time of pick-up. Our son was lactose intolerant, so
I
> had a statement in there stating just that (I acknowledge that I
understand
> that DS is lactose intolerant...or something like that). Then I told my
ex
> that the paper was for both of our benefit. Mainly so we both knew what
the
> schedule was. There were two copies, one for him and one for me. Oh
yeah,
> and I also put all contact information and emergency information on there,
> like in case I had to work late my grandmother was allowed to pick DS up.
I
> made sure to NOT make the paper look like a legal document.
>
> Let me tell you it was like pulling teeth to get him to sign it the first
> time. I really had to play the 'it's best for both of us because we don't
> get along at all, besides it has all the information you need on it'. And
> the 'now you have a written document saying that you DID have
> visitation'....he like the second one. And it was true, he could keep
that
> for himself to prove he did visit his son.
>
> Did that help??
>
> *brianne
>
> ps. I think I started it like this: (insert name here) has agree to
> visitation on _______. He will be picking DS up at ___________ and
bringing
> him home between _________ and __________. During this time I can be
> reached at work at _____________________ if an emergency arises.
>
> then I'd start on the DS eats this, doesn't like this, and is allergic to
> this....and continue from there.
>
>

natural_4u

July 23rd 03, 11:18 AM

Hey Paul,

I was just wondering...

if I change the order so that the mother has our duaghter for the weekend
and the mom doesn't show up ... what happens?

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
> The dangerous thing here is that currently, supervised visitation has been
> ordered. If he just allows the mother to pick up the kid, disregarding
the
> standing order, then he is opening Pandora's box. If the court allows
him
> to select the supervisor then he should do it, and the supervisor would be
> the one to take and return the kid. If the mother doesn't agree to it,
> then it is her problem, she has a choice of abiding by the current order
or
> attempting to change it. But at this point I would highly recommend NOT
> varying from the standing order.
>
> "turtledove" > wrote in message
> om...
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > Turtledove,
> > >
> > > I've been wanting to here this for a long time!!!
> > >
> > > Can you give me any samples of how an agreement form should start out?
> It
> > > would be much appreciated. Feel free to e-mail me if you want... ok?
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks
> > >
> >
> >
> > Basically, my agreements would have the description of the whole
> visitation.
> > Time of drop-off and time of pick-up. Our son was lactose intolerant,
so
> I
> > had a statement in there stating just that (I acknowledge that I
> understand
> > that DS is lactose intolerant...or something like that). Then I told my
> ex
> > that the paper was for both of our benefit. Mainly so we both knew what
> the
> > schedule was. There were two copies, one for him and one for me. Oh
> yeah,
> > and I also put all contact information and emergency information on
there,
> > like in case I had to work late my grandmother was allowed to pick DS
up.
> I
> > made sure to NOT make the paper look like a legal document.
> >
> > Let me tell you it was like pulling teeth to get him to sign it the
first
> > time. I really had to play the 'it's best for both of us because we
don't
> > get along at all, besides it has all the information you need on it'.
And
> > the 'now you have a written document saying that you DID have
> > visitation'....he like the second one. And it was true, he could keep
> that
> > for himself to prove he did visit his son.
> >
> > Did that help??
> >
> > *brianne
> >
> > ps. I think I started it like this: (insert name here) has agree to
> > visitation on _______. He will be picking DS up at ___________ and
> bringing
> > him home between _________ and __________. During this time I can be
> > reached at work at _____________________ if an emergency arises.
> >
> > then I'd start on the DS eats this, doesn't like this, and is allergic
to
> > this....and continue from there.
> >
> >
>
>

Paul Fritz

July 23rd 03, 12:50 PM

Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further standing in the
court should she ever try to change things.

Personally, I would keep the supervised time, until she regains the trust of
both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing up on
time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you can change it
to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights and weekends.......it
doesn't have to be expensive if you file the motions yourself and you show
the court your ultimate goal of allowing the mother to establish a normal
relationship with your daughter.

"natural_4u" > wrote in message
. ca...
> Hey Paul,
>
> I was just wondering...
>
> if I change the order so that the mother has our duaghter for the weekend
> and the mom doesn't show up ... what happens?
>
>
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> > The dangerous thing here is that currently, supervised visitation has
been
> > ordered. If he just allows the mother to pick up the kid, disregarding
> the
> > standing order, then he is opening Pandora's box. If the court allows
> him
> > to select the supervisor then he should do it, and the supervisor would
be
> > the one to take and return the kid. If the mother doesn't agree to it,
> > then it is her problem, she has a choice of abiding by the current order
> or
> > attempting to change it. But at this point I would highly recommend
NOT
> > varying from the standing order.
> >
> > "turtledove" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > >
> > > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > > . ca...
> > > > Turtledove,
> > > >
> > > > I've been wanting to here this for a long time!!!
> > > >
> > > > Can you give me any samples of how an agreement form should start
out?
> > It
> > > > would be much appreciated. Feel free to e-mail me if you want... ok?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Basically, my agreements would have the description of the whole
> > visitation.
> > > Time of drop-off and time of pick-up. Our son was lactose intolerant,
> so
> > I
> > > had a statement in there stating just that (I acknowledge that I
> > understand
> > > that DS is lactose intolerant...or something like that). Then I told
my
> > ex
> > > that the paper was for both of our benefit. Mainly so we both knew
what
> > the
> > > schedule was. There were two copies, one for him and one for me. Oh
> > yeah,
> > > and I also put all contact information and emergency information on
> there,
> > > like in case I had to work late my grandmother was allowed to pick DS
> up.
> > I
> > > made sure to NOT make the paper look like a legal document.
> > >
> > > Let me tell you it was like pulling teeth to get him to sign it the
> first
> > > time. I really had to play the 'it's best for both of us because we
> don't
> > > get along at all, besides it has all the information you need on it'.
> And
> > > the 'now you have a written document saying that you DID have
> > > visitation'....he like the second one. And it was true, he could keep
> > that
> > > for himself to prove he did visit his son.
> > >
> > > Did that help??
> > >
> > > *brianne
> > >
> > > ps. I think I started it like this: (insert name here) has agree to
> > > visitation on _______. He will be picking DS up at ___________ and
> > bringing
> > > him home between _________ and __________. During this time I can be
> > > reached at work at _____________________ if an emergency arises.
> > >
> > > then I'd start on the DS eats this, doesn't like this, and is allergic
> to
> > > this....and continue from there.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

©kat©

July 23rd 03, 08:35 PM

> "natural_4u" wrote in message
> ...
> > Hey Paul,
> >
> > I was just wondering...
> >
> > if I change the order so that the mother has our duaghter for the
weekend
> > and the mom doesn't show up ... what happens?

"Paul Fritz" wrote in message ...
>
> Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further standing in
the
> court should she ever try to change things.
>
> Personally, I would keep the supervised time, until she regains the trust
of
> both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing up on
> time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you can change
it
> to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights and
weekends.......it
> doesn't have to be expensive if you file the motions yourself and you show
> the court your ultimate goal of allowing the mother to establish a normal
> relationship with your daughter.
>

Paul, I have no clue where you are, but I know that in Canada, if one parent
fails to show face and takes off, it can be considered kidnapping. Suppose
Mother Mary comes to pick up Daughter Sally from Father Frank; Mary is
supposed to have Sally back to Fred at 6pm the next day. Mary decideds to
not show up, Frank can call the police and file a missing persons report.
There's more to it, obviously, but in some cases, it can be considered
kidnapping, and if the parent who 'kidnaps' take the child out of the
province the child lives in, assuming both parents live in the same
province, then it's big problems. Yes, and that parent who fails to show
would definitely lose further standing in the court.

Betsy

July 23rd 03, 10:21 PM

In ,
©kat© > typed:
>> "natural_4u" wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Hey Paul,
>>>
>>> I was just wondering...
>>>
>>> if I change the order so that the mother has our duaghter for the
>>> weekend and the mom doesn't show up ... what happens?
>
>
> "Paul Fritz" wrote in message ...
>>
>> Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further
>> standing in the court should she ever try to change things.
>>
>> Personally, I would keep the supervised time, until she regains the
>> trust of both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of
>> showing up on time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few
>> months you can change it to a few hours a day, and then eventually
>> ovenrnights and weekends.......it doesn't have to be expensive if
>> you file the motions yourself and you show the court your ultimate
>> goal of allowing the mother to establish a normal relationship with
>> your daughter.
>>
>
>
> Paul, I have no clue where you are, but I know that in Canada, if one
> parent fails to show face and takes off, it can be considered
> kidnapping. Suppose Mother Mary comes to pick up Daughter Sally from
> Father Frank; Mary is supposed to have Sally back to Fred at 6pm the
> next day. Mary decideds to not show up, Frank can call the police
> and file a missing persons report. There's more to it, obviously, but
> in some cases, it can be considered kidnapping, and if the parent who
> 'kidnaps' take the child out of the province the child lives in,
> assuming both parents live in the same province, then it's big
> problems. Yes, and that parent who fails to show would definitely
> lose further standing in the court.

I read the question as being, what if the mother doesn't show up to pick up
the daughter. Quite possibly I was wrong. Been known to happen on
occasion. ROFL

Betsy
--
Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
ketchup.

©kat©

July 24th 03, 04:40 AM

"'Kate" wrote in message ...
> On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 19:26:07 GMT, "©kat©"
> wasted bandwidth once again by posting:
>
> >"natural_4u" wrote in message ...
> >> Cowtown?!?!...lol
> >
> >Haha, yea, that's where you're showing up from for me... Server has been
> >acting real strange and being a real whore lately, so I don't know
> >
> >> Just wonder do all lawyer charge the same rate? $250/hour?
> >
> >As for that, I have no idea. Most lawyers are comparable in price, but
I've
> >only worked with lawyers that take a percentage of what they win for you.
> >lol I'd say if your lawyer charged $250/hour, it would be comparable to
> >what every other lawyer on the bandwagon is charging.
> >P.S., I hate lawyers and insurance companies.
>
> hehe.. my sister is a lawyer who works for an insurance company.....
> would you hate her double or will the combination cancel the hatred?
> Just curious.... and kidding. There are good lawyers who work hard for
> their clients... taking fee cuts to help out and doing a lot of pro bono
> work. Likewise, there are good insurance companies and bad. When I had
> my accident, state farm settled immediately. I guess you just have to
> know who you're dealing with in both instances.
>
> 'Kate
>
>

OH NO! Say it ain't so! I'm going to stop right here before I blow up and
go real off topic about insurance companies, who are just communist pricks.
I'd take a lawyer over anthing to do with insurance companies - any day.
lol
There is nothing wrong with your sister, even if she is a lawyer for an
insurance company. I'm just glad I don't have a sister right now... And
I've always wanted a sister... lol :P

©kat©

July 24th 03, 04:43 AM

Yes, I see what you mean now... Maybe it had something to do both with the
wording and the hour I was reading.
Yea, I was thinking if the mother doesn't show up with the daughter at set
time what happens, but I see, and understand, now that it was a question of
what happens if she doesn't show up to begin with.
My bad.

"Paul Fritz" wrote in message ...
> Similar here.......................but the key is that it has to be in the
> court order..........i.e. the order has to say 'parenting time form
6:00pm
> Fri to 6:00pm on Sunday......after 24 hours it is considered parental
> kidnapping. But if the orders do not set times, there is no basis for
the
> charge.. I thought what the OP was asking is if the times are set and she
> doesn't show in the first place but I can see how you could read it the
> other way.
>
> "©kat©" wrote in message
> ...
> > > "natural_4u" wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > Hey Paul,
> > > >
> > > > I was just wondering...
> > > >
> > > > if I change the order so that the mother has our duaghter for the
> > weekend
> > > > and the mom doesn't show up ... what happens?
> >
> >
> > "Paul Fritz" wrote in message ...
> > >
> > > Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further standing
in
> > the
> > > court should she ever try to change things.
> > >
> > > Personally, I would keep the supervised time, until she regains the
> trust
> > of
> > > both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing up
> on
> > > time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you can
change
> > it
> > > to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights and
> > weekends.......it
> > > doesn't have to be expensive if you file the motions yourself and you
> show
> > > the court your ultimate goal of allowing the mother to establish a
> normal
> > > relationship with your daughter.
> > >
> >
> >
> > Paul, I have no clue where you are, but I know that in Canada, if one
> parent
> > fails to show face and takes off, it can be considered kidnapping.
> Suppose
> > Mother Mary comes to pick up Daughter Sally from Father Frank; Mary is
> > supposed to have Sally back to Fred at 6pm the next day. Mary decideds
to
> > not show up, Frank can call the police and file a missing persons
report.
> > There's more to it, obviously, but in some cases, it can be considered
> > kidnapping, and if the parent who 'kidnaps' take the child out of the
> > province the child lives in, assuming both parents live in the same
> > province, then it's big problems. Yes, and that parent who fails to
show
> > would definitely lose further standing in the court.
> >
> >
>
>

CME

July 24th 03, 07:58 AM

"Moon Shyne" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further standing in
the
> > court should she ever try to change things.
> >
> > Personally, I would keep the supervised time,
>
> From: "Paul Fritz" >
> Subject: Re: Please help on conent/agreement form
> Date: Sunday, July 20, 2003 5:26 PM
>
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
> > The court has ordered supervised visitation, but I don't know who I can
> get
> > to be the supervisor.
>
> You don't.........stop being a control freak
>
>
>
>
>
> until she regains the trust of
> > both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing up
on
> > time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you can change
it
> > to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights and
weekends.......it
> > doesn't have to be expensive if you file the motions yourself and you
show
> > the court your ultimate goal of allowing the mother to establish a
normal
> > relationship with your daughter.
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > Hello people,
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was just
> > > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> > contact
> > > number, etc..
> >
> > You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> > control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the
sooner
> > you realize that, the better
>
>
> Amazing how much more reasonable you appear to be now that you know you're
> talking to a man.
>

Yeah I noticed that too... but I tried not to read anything into it though.
So much for that. lol

Christine

<snip>

Paul Fritz

July 24th 03, 11:34 AM

"CME" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "Moon Shyne" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further standing
in
> the
> > > court should she ever try to change things.
> > >
> > > Personally, I would keep the supervised time,
> >
> > From: "Paul Fritz" >
> > Subject: Re: Please help on conent/agreement form
> > Date: Sunday, July 20, 2003 5:26 PM
> >
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> > > The court has ordered supervised visitation, but I don't know who I
can
> > get
> > > to be the supervisor.
> >
> > You don't.........stop being a control freak
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > until she regains the trust of
> > > both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing up
> on
> > > time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you can
change
> it
> > > to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights and
> weekends.......it
> > > doesn't have to be expensive if you file the motions yourself and you
> show
> > > the court your ultimate goal of allowing the mother to establish a
> normal
> > > relationship with your daughter.
> >
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > > . ca...
> > > > Hello people,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was
just
> > > > wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> > > > consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop off,
> > > contact
> > > > number, etc..
> > >
> > > You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> > > control what happens when the child is with the other parent......the
> sooner
> > > you realize that, the better
> >
> >
> > Amazing how much more reasonable you appear to be now that you know
you're
> > talking to a man.
> >
>
> Yeah I noticed that too... but I tried not to read anything into it
though.
> So much for that. lol

Nope, but not surpising coming from the parental alienator amy
lynn...........ever the ASSuming ass.

Funny how little 'support" HE got from the 'regulars' once it was discovered
he was a father.

Its not 'amazing' that when you have enough facts on the situation that the
suggestions can be more effective

BTW.....if he was still insisting on being the supervisor......will would
still be calling him a control freak.

>
> Christine
>
> <snip>
>
>

Betsy

July 24th 03, 12:28 PM

In ,
Moon Shyne > typed:
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further
>> standing in the court should she ever try to change things.
>>
>> Personally, I would keep the supervised time,
>
> From: "Paul Fritz" >
> Subject: Re: Please help on conent/agreement form
> Date: Sunday, July 20, 2003 5:26 PM
>
>
> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> . ca...
>> The court has ordered supervised visitation, but I don't know who I
>> can
> get
>> to be the supervisor.
>
> You don't.........stop being a control freak
>
>
>
>
>
> until she regains the trust of
>> both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing
>> up on time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you
>> can change it to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights
>> and weekends.......it doesn't have to be expensive if you file the
>> motions yourself and you show the court your ultimate goal of
>> allowing the mother to establish a normal relationship with your
>> daughter.
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
>> . ca...
>>> Hello people,
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was
>>> just wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
>>> consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop
>>> off, contact number, etc..
>>
>> You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
>> control what happens when the child is with the other
>> parent......the sooner you realize that, the better
>
>
> Amazing how much more reasonable you appear to be now that you know
> you're talking to a man.
>

Actually, I found that both are being more reasonable in their posting.
Paul reacts to what's posted. Always has from what I've seen. If you don't
have all the information, what else can you do? I actually agreed with
Paul's point of view. Call me strange or whatever.

Betsy
--
Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
ketchup.

turtledove

July 24th 03, 07:49 PM

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "CME" > wrote in message
> . ..
> >
> > "Moon Shyne" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > >
>
> Nope, but not surpising coming from the parental alienator amy
> lynn...........ever the ASSuming ass.
>
> Funny how little 'support" HE got from the 'regulars' once it was
discovered
> he was a father.
>

*** HEY! I thought I did quite well!

> Its not 'amazing' that when you have enough facts on the situation that
the
> suggestions can be more effective
>
> BTW.....if he was still insisting on being the supervisor......will would
> still be calling him a control freak.
>

Thppt!

*bri (wink)

Paul Fritz

July 24th 03, 11:02 PM

'Moonshyne' aka amy lynn, aka tree stump, never has been very bright, she is
also the poster child of parental alienators.......having been successful in
driving off the father of her kids.......and then whining about how he never
sees the kids......its no wonder she and looney lorain seek each other out
for support.

"Betsy" > wrote in message
. com...
> In ,
> Moon Shyne > typed:
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >>
> >> Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further
> >> standing in the court should she ever try to change things.
> >>
> >> Personally, I would keep the supervised time,
> >
> > From: "Paul Fritz" >
> > Subject: Re: Please help on conent/agreement form
> > Date: Sunday, July 20, 2003 5:26 PM
> >
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> >> The court has ordered supervised visitation, but I don't know who I
> >> can
> > get
> >> to be the supervisor.
> >
> > You don't.........stop being a control freak
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > until she regains the trust of
> >> both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing
> >> up on time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you
> >> can change it to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights
> >> and weekends.......it doesn't have to be expensive if you file the
> >> motions yourself and you show the court your ultimate goal of
> >> allowing the mother to establish a normal relationship with your
> >> daughter.
> >
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >>
> >> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> >> . ca...
> >>> Hello people,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was
> >>> just wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> >>> consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop
> >>> off, contact number, etc..
> >>
> >> You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> >> control what happens when the child is with the other
> >> parent......the sooner you realize that, the better
> >
> >
> > Amazing how much more reasonable you appear to be now that you know
> > you're talking to a man.
> >
>
> Actually, I found that both are being more reasonable in their posting.
> Paul reacts to what's posted. Always has from what I've seen. If you
don't
> have all the information, what else can you do? I actually agreed with
> Paul's point of view. Call me strange or whatever.
>
> Betsy
> --
> Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
> ketchup.
>
>

©kat©

July 25th 03, 07:24 PM

"'Kate" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 08:58:11 GMT, "©kat©" >
> wasted bandwidth once again by posting:
>
> >
> >"'Kate" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> You'd love her. She's a great little sister even if she is an
> >> overachiever who can't sit for a minute without needing to do
something.
> >> : )
> >
> >I can relate. I have 2 younger brothers, and although we never really
got
> >along as kids (and still don't really presently) things are getting
better
> >as we all get older, and since I moved away from home. It took me up
until
> >a year or so ago to realize that my brothers can both be the biggest
> >assholes at times, they are still great. Plus the youngest of the two
makes
> >a great last minute babysitter, and it's even better because if I can't
> >afford to pay him for his services, he often doesn't mind and knows I'll
pay
> >him back other ways. (Giving him a ride to his friend's place, taking him
to
> >a movie, giving him B to play with and spend time with, or even sending
Bran
> >off with my parents when my brother has a hockey game or something)
> >I often think of what it would be like if I was an only child. (Many
people
> >say I should have been an only child) but if I was, I know I'd miss
having
> >little brothers to bug and fight with, and so much more.
>
> Boy have you been blessed! Brothers come in so handy.. especially when
> you move and need the muscles! My poor brother had to put up with three
> women helping when he moved - his wife, my sister and myself.

My brothers make a big deal when I ask for some help. Since my back and hip
seem to be shot, I do ask my brothers for help. Sometimes I ask my dad, but
why get an almost 50 year old man to lift and move when there's a 17 and 14
year old? Plus my dad has, in the past, had some unknown medical problems.
His nose used to bleed like crazy, yet no one seemed to know why. It
happens every so often. Since that, I've tried to use that against my
brothers with no luck.

> >Brandon saw babies on the tv the other day and wanted a baby. I told him
> >when he's older with his own house and job and wife, he can have as many
> >babies as he wants. At 2 and a half, he didn't like that answer.
>
> LOL... he may have meant something else. Babies are adorable just to
> sucker us in ya know.

I hope he meant that he wants me to maybe babysit a baby so he can have one
for a few hours every now and then. No more babies are allowed to live in
this house... err... apartment suite. Not for a very, very long time,
anyways! lol

> 'Kate

Betsy

July 25th 03, 10:49 PM

In ,
©kat© > typed:
> "'Kate" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Thu, 24 Jul 2003 08:58:11 GMT, "©kat©" >
>> wasted bandwidth once again by posting:
>>
>>>
>>> "'Kate" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> You'd love her. She's a great little sister even if she is an
>>>> overachiever who can't sit for a minute without needing to do
> something.
>>>>> )
>>>
>>> I can relate. I have 2 younger brothers, and although we never
>>> really got along as kids (and still don't really presently) things
>>> are getting better as we all get older, and since I moved away from
>>> home. It took me up until a year or so ago to realize that my
>>> brothers can both be the biggest assholes at times, they are still
>>> great. Plus the youngest of the two makes a great last minute
>>> babysitter, and it's even better because if I can't afford to pay
>>> him for his services, he often doesn't mind and knows I'll pay him
>>> back other ways. (Giving him a ride to his friend's place, taking
>>> him to a movie, giving him B to play with and spend time with, or
>>> even sending Bran off with my parents when my brother has a hockey
>>> game or something)
>>> I often think of what it would be like if I was an only child.
>>> (Many people say I should have been an only child) but if I was, I
>>> know I'd miss having little brothers to bug and fight with, and so
>>> much more.
>>
>> Boy have you been blessed! Brothers come in so handy.. especially
>> when you move and need the muscles! My poor brother had to put up
>> with three women helping when he moved - his wife, my sister and
>> myself.
>
> My brothers make a big deal when I ask for some help. Since my back
> and hip seem to be shot, I do ask my brothers for help. Sometimes I
> ask my dad, but why get an almost 50 year old man to lift and move
> when there's a 17 and 14 year old? Plus my dad has, in the past, had
> some unknown medical problems. His nose used to bleed like crazy, yet
> no one seemed to know why. It happens every so often. Since that,
> I've tried to use that against my brothers with no luck.
>

Has your father had his blood pressure monitored by a doctor? Sometimes
high blood pressure can cause nosebleeds like what you described. Might be
worth looking into.

Betsy
--
Meddle not in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with
ketchup.

Paul Fritz

July 25th 03, 11:40 PM

"'Kate" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 25 Jul 2003 18:24:09 GMT, "©kat©" >
> wasted bandwidth once again by posting:
>
>
> >My brothers make a big deal when I ask for some help. Since my back and
hip
> >seem to be shot, I do ask my brothers for help. Sometimes I ask my dad,
but
> >why get an almost 50 year old man to lift and move when there's a 17 and
14
> >year old? Plus my dad has, in the past, had some unknown medical
problems.
> >His nose used to bleed like crazy, yet no one seemed to know why. It
> >happens every so often. Since that, I've tried to use that against my
> >brothers with no luck.
>
> That seems pretty typical for 17 & 14 year olds and I agree with you,
> it's very difficult to ask someone who is older for help but a 50 year
> old man isn't very old... not really.

Gosh I hope not!!!!!!! or else I only have a few years left LOL.

WRT to the nose bleeds, my dad used to get them like that too.....he was a
borrderline bleeder......a small cit would take forever to stop bleeding.

> I've met some very buff 50 year
> old men.

>
> >> >Brandon saw babies on the tv the other day and wanted a baby. I told
him
> >> >when he's older with his own house and job and wife, he can have as
many
> >> >babies as he wants. At 2 and a half, he didn't like that answer.
> >>
> >> LOL... he may have meant something else. Babies are adorable just to
> >> sucker us in ya know.
> >
> >I hope he meant that he wants me to maybe babysit a baby so he can have
one
> >for a few hours every now and then. No more babies are allowed to live
in
> >this house... err... apartment suite. Not for a very, very long time,
> >anyways! lol
>
> Same here! The next one better be a grandchild or niece/nephew.
>
> Two boys is a nice amount anyway... I'd be satisfied with a family like
> that. My second and third children were very much the surprise after
> having been through infertility treatments and given up hope years
> before. My first and second children are 9 years apart. One trip to
> Disneyworld... I swear it's the water there and bam... two kids one
> after the other. My advice... don't go to Disneyworld unless you plan
> on remaining celibate!

Buying a new house seems to have the same consequences LOL

>
> 'Kate

Lisa aka Surfer

July 26th 03, 03:32 AM

"Betsy" > wrote in message
. com...
> In ,
> Moon Shyne > typed:
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >>
> >> Typically nothing, except that the mother would lose further
> >> standing in the court should she ever try to change things.
> >>
> >> Personally, I would keep the supervised time,
> >
> > From: "Paul Fritz" >
> > Subject: Re: Please help on conent/agreement form
> > Date: Sunday, July 20, 2003 5:26 PM
> >
> >
> > "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> > . ca...
> >> The court has ordered supervised visitation, but I don't know who I
> >> can
> > get
> >> to be the supervisor.
> >
> > You don't.........stop being a control freak
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > until she regains the trust of
> >> both you and the court. Is she shows the responsibility of showing
> >> up on time and dealing with the supervisor, after a few months you
> >> can change it to a few hours a day, and then eventually ovenrnights
> >> and weekends.......it doesn't have to be expensive if you file the
> >> motions yourself and you show the court your ultimate goal of
> >> allowing the mother to establish a normal relationship with your
> >> daughter.
> >
> > "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >>
> >> "natural_4u" > wrote in message
> >> . ca...
> >>> Hello people,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> I'm a single parent with a beautiful 10 years old daughter. I was
> >>> just wondering if anyone can help me with any ideas on preparing a
> >>> consent/agreement form. The form must have time of pick up/drop
> >>> off, contact number, etc..
> >>
> >> You sound like a control freak.........a free hint.........you do not
> >> control what happens when the child is with the other
> >> parent......the sooner you realize that, the better
> >
> >
> > Amazing how much more reasonable you appear to be now that you know
> > you're talking to a man.
> >
>
> Actually, I found that both are being more reasonable in their posting.
> Paul reacts to what's posted. Always has from what I've seen. If you
don't
> have all the information, what else can you do? I actually agreed with
> Paul's point of view. Call me strange or whatever.
>
> Betsy
> --

You're strange or whatever

Surf