Advice request, hoping I am right

[Andrew]

my wife left the country last october, for the past year i have been looking
after our 4YO daughter. my wife wanted me to send our daughter with her (my
wife's) dad to go and see her in summer. i vetoed that for a couple of
reasons, 1) with the changes and uncertainty in her life i did not feel it
would be good for our daughter to be packed off on a nine hour flight with
some people she has seen only rarely, i thought she might feel she was being
abandoned by everyone after moving house suddenly and ma not being around
any more 2) my wife's dad lives in sweden with his new wife and neither of
them are used to kids, she has never had kids and he is from the old school
of dad's parenting (hands off and let others get on with it) so i felt they
would not be good at looking after a kid without each party getting to know
the other first so they could recognise and address her needs. my suggestion
was that my wife come back to england for the summer to be with our daughter
but she felt that having just started a new job she would not be able to
take enough time off for it to be a worthwhile visit. my position was that
our child should only travel with one of her parents for the moment and due
to work commitments i could not afford to accompany her (it would have cost
me too much in lost earnings as well as ticket costs). my wife came back
(ps, most of this communication is on email although she has rung to speak
to our daughter six or seven times) to suggest that she (my wife) comes here
at xmas and takes our daughter to spend xmas in sweden with my wife and her
dad. i have agreed to this. i do feel that our daughter should know both her
parents. just a further quick bit of background, we both agree that the
school she is at now is the best for her, last year things went a bit belly
up financially so we had to sell our house and my daughter and i moved to
rented accomodation close to her school (walking distance actually which is
great), where my wife is living the schools are not so good and my wife
would not be able to earn enough to put her into a school there. as far as i
can tell communication between my wife and i is cordial in that we are
polite to each other, i update her on her daughters doings and post pictures
and every once in a while she sends me something she thinks might entertain
me, when she calls to talk neither of us is unpleasant to the other. my wife
did want to look after our daughter herself but without fairly major
financial support would not have been able to and also school and medical
care considerations came into it. a couple of questions, things i would
appreciate some feedback on:

1) do you think i should be worried about child abduction etc? my daughter
is pretty settled and secure now, will this trip do more damage than good?
2) what are your views on my decision not to send our daughter out to her
mum at summer accompanied by her grandparents? was i right or wrong from the
info you have?
3) is anyone in the group going to beat me up for any reason whatsoever? i
have seen some fairly heavy slaps for bad behaviour etc (hello the the
'judgemental *****', i think you are a great person with wonderful posts,
crawl, grovel, defuse?)
4) could someone in the group give me a nice warm cyber pat on the back/head
and tell me its all ok?

many thanks
sorry for long, rambling post. just nice to talk to someone about things
even if you can't see them and am hoping someone will have some good tips


Andrew

[Joelle]

I don't think you should send a 4 year old out of the country without you.

> do you think i should be worried about child abduction etc?

Yes.

>my daughter
>is pretty settled and secure now, will this trip do more damage than good?

I dunno, too many unknowns.

> what are your views on my decision not to send our daughter out to her
>mum at summer accompanied by her grandparents? was i right or wrong from the
>info you have?

I wouldn't send a 4 year old anywhere without me. What is the matter with her
mother that she can't make the effort to come and see her kid instead of making
the child do all the traveling? That's selfish on her part.

>is anyone in the group going to beat me up for any reason whatsoever? i
>have seen some fairly heavy slaps for bad behaviour etc (hello the the
>'judgemental *****', i think you are a great person with wonderful posts,
>crawl, grovel, defuse?)

No crawling necesary. I think you are doing the best you can in a crappy
situation. Don't send your baby overseas without you though.


>ould someone in the group give me a nice warm cyber pat on the back/head
>and tell me its all ok?

Here's your pat, but I can't promise all is okay. Nobody can.

Joelle

[Andrew]

Thanks for the pat and the feedback Joelle. I am still a bit torn as I want
my daughter to see both her parents as much as she can, I want to trust and
believe in her mum and believe her mum will take her to Sweden and then
bring her back after Xmas, I don't want her mum and I to have a hostile
relationship as I don't think it will help anyone.I keep going backwards and
forwards and trying to work out whats best for the child and what will not
do too much damage to my sanity. It has been a help talking about it here
and again thanks for feedback.

Andrew

"Joelle" > wrote in message
...
> I don't think you should send a 4 year old out of the country without you.
>
> > do you think i should be worried about child abduction etc?
>
> Yes.
>
> >my daughter
> >is pretty settled and secure now, will this trip do more damage than
good?
>
> I dunno, too many unknowns.
>
> > what are your views on my decision not to send our daughter out to her
> >mum at summer accompanied by her grandparents? was i right or wrong from
the
> >info you have?
>
> I wouldn't send a 4 year old anywhere without me. What is the matter with
her
> mother that she can't make the effort to come and see her kid instead of
making
> the child do all the traveling? That's selfish on her part.
>
> >is anyone in the group going to beat me up for any reason whatsoever? i
> >have seen some fairly heavy slaps for bad behaviour etc (hello the the
> >'judgemental *****', i think you are a great person with wonderful posts,
> >crawl, grovel, defuse?)
>
> No crawling necesary. I think you are doing the best you can in a crappy
> situation. Don't send your baby overseas without you though.
>
>
> >ould someone in the group give me a nice warm cyber pat on the back/head
> >and tell me its all ok?
>
> Here's your pat, but I can't promise all is okay. Nobody can.
>
> Joelle

[Andrew]

Thanks Kate, it helps me to hear from you guys about it.

> You made a decision. You can get out of it if you don't feel secure
> with the arrangements. You are allowed to change your mind.

True but I keep switching between 'yes, I trust her mum and nothing will go
wrong' and 'well, I did not know we would ever be here so how can I be sure
about anything'.

>
> If you go through with it, thinking and worrying about what may or may
> not happen is self-harming. It does nothing positive to shape the
> future and may do negative things because you're thinking of the
> negative.

In other words 'get a grip' , 'cease whining' and 'stop being your own worst
enemy'? You are right on that score. Negative thoughts always bad and would
not help in any way shape or form. Think I'll go and get myself a positive
Budweiser for this evening as an attitude adjuster! ; )

>
> Other than that, <pat pat pat>

Thanx.

Andrew

[Dennis Here]

Andrew wrote in message ...
>
>1) do you think i should be worried about child abduction etc? my daughter
>is pretty settled and secure now, will this trip do more damage than good?

Always a possibility. Do you have sole custody? If not , as the mother is
not taking any active role in you daughters life, I would go and get it.
Passport? does daughter have her own or is she on both parents passports?
Get her one of her own and keep possesion of it your self.

>2) what are your views on my decision not to send our daughter out to her
>mum at summer accompanied by her grandparents? was i right or wrong from
the
>info you have?

Quite right. The onus is on the mother to come and establish a relationship
with her daughter over a period of time first. Initially a few half days at
your home, then days out leading up to a few overnight stays.
If mother will not go along with this then too bad.

>3) is anyone in the group going to beat me up for any reason whatsoever? i
>have seen some fairly heavy slaps for bad behaviour etc (hello the the
>'judgemental *****', i think you are a great person with wonderful posts,
>crawl, grovel, defuse?)

Yeah we all need re-assurance from time to time.
I was in a similar situation to you and I did all of the above. Five years
down the line my son does go off abroad with his mother occasionally. It was
a long haul to get to that point though.

>4) could someone in the group give me a nice warm cyber pat on the
back/head
>and tell me its all ok?


Not OK if you send your daughter off with her grandfather so no pat on the
back yet.

Dennis

[Andrew]

Hi again Dennis,



"Dennis Here" oureply>
wrote in message ...
>
> Andrew wrote in message ...
> >
> >1) do you think i should be worried about child abduction etc? my
daughter
> >is pretty settled and secure now, will this trip do more damage than
good?
>
> Always a possibility. Do you have sole custody? If not , as the mother is
> not taking any active role in you daughters life, I would go and get it.
> Passport? does daughter have her own or is she on both parents passports?
> Get her one of her own and keep possesion of it your self.

Don't have sole custody but with recent changes in the law here my daughter
has to have her own passport and has had for past two/three years. We have
not had a formal split, just gone separate ways and not marked it with any
legalities as at now. Don't know if this will present problems at any stage
later on. In some ways relationship did not end with any large drama, not
with a bang but with a whimper. Had not even thought about sole custody etc,
does that involve filing a dispute with the courts? Have not looked at
custody issues, kind of thought we would work it out ourselves.

>
> >4) could someone in the group give me a nice warm cyber pat on the
> back/head
> >and tell me its all ok?
>
>
> Not OK if you send your daughter off with her grandfather so no pat on the
> back yet.

Apologies, can see I have been a bit incoherent, the proposal was for her
mother to come to England, stay with us for one night and then fly with our
daughter to Sweden, returning after xmas to England so daughter, mum and
grandad all in Sweden for xmas then daughter back with me just before term
starts again and mum leaves, all flights daughter travelling with mum. I am
in agreement that really needs a bit more than 18 hours for daughter to get
used to a mother she has not seen for a year to travel with but my daughter
is pretty comfortable with people and new situations and her mum is not a
total stranger and current proposed plan just has that much time in it.
Definitely would not send daughter flying with just grandparent for company.
At present mother lives out in Zambia where she has an uncle and two nieces.
She says lifestyle there much better than over here (UK).

????? don't kids in Ireland need own passports now?

????? can't I get a cuddle anyway?? LOL

Do you mind me asking, don't answer if intrusive, I get the impression from
the age range of your kids two partners?

Andrew

>
> Dennis
>
>

[Dennis Here]

Andrew wrote in message ...

>Hi again Dennis,

>Don't have sole custody but with recent changes in the law here my daughter
>has to have her own passport and has had for past two/three years. We have
>not had a formal split, just gone separate ways and not marked it with any
>legalities as at now. Don't know if this will present problems at any stage
>later on. In some ways relationship did not end with any large drama, not
>with a bang but with a whimper. Had not even thought about sole custody
etc,
>does that involve filing a dispute with the courts? Have not looked at
>custody issues, kind of thought we would work it out ourselves.


Always best if you can both agree.
>
>Apologies, can see I have been a bit incoherent, the proposal was for her
>mother to come to England, stay with us for one night and then fly with our
>daughter to Sweden, returning after xmas to England so daughter, mum and
>grandad all in Sweden for xmas then daughter back with me just before term
>starts again and mum leaves, all flights daughter travelling with mum. I am
>in agreement that really needs a bit more than 18 hours for daughter to get
>used to a mother she has not seen for a year to travel with but my daughter
>is pretty comfortable with people and new situations and her mum is not a
>total stranger and current proposed plan just has that much time in it.

I agree that 18 hours seems far too short a time after a year away. Daughter
will be asleep for most of that anyway!

>Definitely would not send daughter flying with just grandparent for
company.
>At present mother lives out in Zambia where she has an uncle and two
nieces.
>She says lifestyle there much better than over here (UK).


Must have change a lot since I was last there then.
A good guide on the state of a country is to compare the official exchange
rate with the unoficial black market exchange rate. Zambia's black rate was
about four times the official rate indicating that people were prepared to
leg it out of the country with only a quarter of their life savings. At the
time only Tanzania and Uganda came anywhere near it.

>????? don't kids in Ireland need own passports now?


Don't know, I got one anyway so that I have control of it.


>Do you mind me asking, don't answer if intrusive, I get the impression from
>the age range of your kids two partners?


Yeah, I married for life twice.

Dennis

[Andrew]

"Dennis Here" oureply>
wrote in message ...
>
> Yeah, I married for life twice.
>
> Dennis
>
>

Huzzah! Two reasons:

1) Dennis is not offended by personal grilling and is still talking to me
2) From the answer it is perfectly possible that I will have a partner for
life again someday (however long that will be) (should I feel guilty about
not wanting to enter my dotage alone? Nah!)

PS, re the above comment it was parents day at my daughters school today.
Felt a bit odd when I saw in her book she has written (with the help of the
teachers) 'I have two people in my family' and a picture of her and daddy
above it. Makes me feel a bit sad. Just a self pitying whinge, its part of
what this group is for after all.

Andrew

[Dennis Here]

Andrew wrote in message ...
>
>1) Dennis is not offended by personal grilling and is still talking to me

I often state some of my personal experiences especialy if I think it lends
credance to a support post.

>2) From the answer it is perfectly possible that I will have a partner for
>life again someday (however long that will be) (should I feel guilty about
>not wanting to enter my dotage alone? Nah!)


There is someone out there for everyone.

>PS, re the above comment it was parents day at my daughters school today.
>Felt a bit odd when I saw in her book she has written (with the help of the
>teachers) 'I have two people in my family' and a picture of her and daddy
>above it. Makes me feel a bit sad.

I used to mention Freddie's extended family like cousins, uncles, aunts when
he seemed a little wistful about there only being the two of us.
Thankfully, his mother is now taking an active role in his life as well. It
took about five years to get there but the benefits are doing him the world
of good.
Never write off the other parent.

Dennis
Now the cats are part of the family too!