The Greed Factor Part II

[Fighting For Kids]

Paul fritz.. is this your post or kens?

Blah Blah.. blah blah..


On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:45:46 -0800, "Paul Fritz"
> wrote:

> a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
>"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
>Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
>Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989, pg
>37-51.]
>
> b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74 to
>80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only slightly
>from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
>Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
>Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
>Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When Parents
>Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody Hughes,
>"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
>Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted in
>The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal of
>Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver & O'Connell,
>Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly, "Reasons
>for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of Divorce
>and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
>Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and Remarriage,
>Vol. 20, 1993. ]
>
> c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
>grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing more
>than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
>swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset in a
>marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the most
>likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce because
>they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
>control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change the
>way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are likely
>to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if the
>marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as parenting
>parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret F.
>Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most Divorce
>Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000. Quotes
>of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at Realities of
>Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
>
> d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces) have
>significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year decline
>in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
>custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states having
>low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
>Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the 11th
>annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
>
>
>"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives for
>divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties such
>as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as they
>would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both parents)
>and fewer false expectations."
>
>
>

[Paul Fritz]

a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989, pg
37-51.]

b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74 to
80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only slightly
from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When Parents
Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody Hughes,
"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted in
The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal of
Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver & O'Connell,
Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly, "Reasons
for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of Divorce
and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and Remarriage,
Vol. 20, 1993. ]

c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing more
than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset in a
marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the most
likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce because
they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change the
way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are likely
to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if the
marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as parenting
parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret F.
Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most Divorce
Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000. Quotes
of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at Realities of
Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]

d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces) have
significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year decline
in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states having
low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the 11th
annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]


"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives for
divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties such
as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as they
would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both parents)
and fewer false expectations."

[Freedom]

Excellent facts! Thank you! Keep it up! "You can lead a horse to water, but
you cannot make him drink."

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
> a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
> "What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
> Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
> Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989,
pg
> 37-51.]
>
> b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74 to
> 80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only slightly
> from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
> Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
> Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When Parents
> Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
Hughes,
> "Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
> Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted in
> The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal of
> Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver & O'Connell,
> Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
"Reasons
> for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of Divorce
> and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
> Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and Remarriage,
> Vol. 20, 1993. ]
>
> c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
> grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing more
> than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
> swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset in a
> marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the
most
> likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
because
> they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
> control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change the
> way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are
likely
> to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if the
> marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
parenting
> parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret F.
> Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
Divorce
> Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000.
Quotes
> of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at Realities
of
> Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
>
> d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces)
have
> significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
decline
> in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
> custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states having
> low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
> Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the 11th
> annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
>
>
> "It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives
for
> divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties
such
> as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as
they
> would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
parents)
> and fewer false expectations."
>
>
>
>

[Dusty]

Very well put, Paul! Very well indeed!!

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
> a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
> "What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
> Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
> Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989,
pg
> 37-51.]

[snip]

[TeacherMama]

Fighting For Kids > wrote in message >...
> Paul fritz.. is this your post or kens?
>
> Blah Blah.. blah blah..

And how, precisely, does this answer the concerns posted, FFK? He has
cited a number of studies.

>
>
> On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:45:46 -0800, "Paul Fritz"
> > wrote:
>
> > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
> >"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
> >Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
> >Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989, pg
> >37-51.]
> >
> > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74 to
> >80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only slightly
> >from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
> >Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> >Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
> >Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When Parents
> >Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody Hughes,
> >"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
> >Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted in
> >The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal of
> >Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver & O'Connell,
> >Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly, "Reasons
> >for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of Divorce
> >and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
> >Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and Remarriage,
> >Vol. 20, 1993. ]
> >
> > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
> >grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing more
> >than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
> >swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset in a
> >marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the most
> >likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce because
> >they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
> >control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change the
> >way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are likely
> >to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if the
> >marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as parenting
> >parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret F.
> >Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most Divorce
> >Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000. Quotes
> >of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at Realities of
> >Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
> >
> > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces) have
> >significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year decline
> >in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
> >custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states having
> >low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
> >Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the 11th
> >annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
> >
> >
> >"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives for
> >divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties such
> >as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as they
> >would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both parents)
> >and fewer false expectations."
> >
> >
> >

[Paul Fritz]

"TeacherMama" > wrote in message
om...
> Fighting For Kids > wrote in message
>...
> > Paul fritz.. is this your post or kens?
> >
> > Blah Blah.. blah blah..
>
> And how, precisely, does this answer the concerns posted, FFK? He has
> cited a number of studies.

<snicker> the mental midget 'stealing for mommies' hasn't yet mastered the
concept that not all things on the www is true. and that you need to check
sources.........so in the mean time, I am LMAO at SFM's dancing like a
puppet.

>
> >
> >
> > On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:45:46 -0800, "Paul Fritz"
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
> > >"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
> > >Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
> > >Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26,
1989, pg
> > >37-51.]
> > >
> > > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74
to
> > >80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only
slightly
> > >from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
> > >Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> > >Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
> > >Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When
Parents
> > >Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
Hughes,
> > >"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
> > >Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted
in
> > >The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal
of
> > >Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver &
O'Connell,
> > >Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
"Reasons
> > >for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of
Divorce
> > >and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
> > >Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and
Remarriage,
> > >Vol. 20, 1993. ]
> > >
> > > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
> > >grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing
more
> > >than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
> > >swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset
in a
> > >marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the
most
> > >likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
because
> > >they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
> > >control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change
the
> > >way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are
likely
> > >to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if
the
> > >marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
parenting
> > >parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret
F.
> > >Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
Divorce
> > >Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000.
Quotes
> > >of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at
Realities of
> > >Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
> > >
> > > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces)
have
> > >significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
decline
> > >in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
> > >custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states
having
> > >low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
> > >Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the
11th
> > >annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
> > >
> > >
> > >"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives
for
> > >divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> > > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties
such
> > >as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as
they
> > >would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
parents)
> > >and fewer false expectations."
> > >
> > >
> > >

[Dusty]

HA! Yeah and the strings are pretty frayed!!

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "TeacherMama" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Fighting For Kids > wrote in message
> >...
> > > Paul fritz.. is this your post or kens?
> > >
> > > Blah Blah.. blah blah..
> >
> > And how, precisely, does this answer the concerns posted, FFK? He has
> > cited a number of studies.
>
> <snicker> the mental midget 'stealing for mommies' hasn't yet mastered
the
> concept that not all things on the www is true. and that you need to
check
> sources.........so in the mean time, I am LMAO at SFM's dancing like a
> puppet.
>
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:45:46 -0800, "Paul Fritz"
> > > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce
[Bumpass,
> > > >"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics
and
> > > >Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin
&
> > > >Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26,
> 1989, pg
> > > >37-51.]
> > > >
> > > > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner:
74
> to
> > > >80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only
> slightly
> > > >from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.)
[Maggie
> > > >Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> > > >Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr.
and
> > > >Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When
> Parents
> > > >Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
> Hughes,
> > > >"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne:
Australian
> > > >Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as
quoted
> in
> > > >The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?"
Journal
> of
> > > >Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver &
> O'Connell,
> > > >Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
> "Reasons
> > > >for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of
> Divorce
> > > >and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced
Whom?
> > > >Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and
> Remarriage,
> > > >Vol. 20, 1993. ]
> > > >
> > > > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears
for
> > > >grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing
> more
> > > >than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody
absolutely
> > > >swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset
> in a
> > > >marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far
the
> most
> > > >likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
> because
> > > >they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives
them
> > > >control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change
> the
> > > >way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are
> likely
> > > >to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if
> the
> > > >marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
> parenting
> > > >parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play."
[Margaret
> F.
> > > >Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
> Divorce
> > > >Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000.
> Quotes
> > > >of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at
> Realities of
> > > >Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
> > > >
> > > > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of
divorces)
> have
> > > >significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
> decline
> > > >in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
> > > >custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states
> having
> > > >low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John
Guidubaldi,
> > > >Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the
> 11th
> > > >annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the
incentives
> for
> > > >divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> > > > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood
ties
> such
> > > >as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer
as
> they
> > > >would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
> parents)
> > > >and fewer false expectations."
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
>
>

[Fighting For Kids]

Oh ive mastered that all things on the internet are not true.
Ive mastered that you are a fake as are you made up sources.

I dont give any of you in here credit.

Paul, Teachermama, Ken, Bob... is that you?

On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 00:12:13 -0500, "Paul Fritz"
> wrote:

>
>"TeacherMama" > wrote in message
om...
>> Fighting For Kids > wrote in message
>...
>> > Paul fritz.. is this your post or kens?
>> >
>> > Blah Blah.. blah blah..
>>
>> And how, precisely, does this answer the concerns posted, FFK? He has
>> cited a number of studies.
>
><snicker> the mental midget 'stealing for mommies' hasn't yet mastered the
>concept that not all things on the www is true. and that you need to check
>sources.........so in the mean time, I am LMAO at SFM's dancing like a
>puppet.
>
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:45:46 -0800, "Paul Fritz"
>> > > wrote:
>> >
>> > > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
>> > >"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
>> > >Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
>> > >Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26,
>1989, pg
>> > >37-51.]
>> > >
>> > > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74
>to
>> > >80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only
>slightly
>> > >from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
>> > >Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
>> > >Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
>> > >Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When
>Parents
>> > >Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
>Hughes,
>> > >"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
>> > >Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted
>in
>> > >The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal
>of
>> > >Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver &
>O'Connell,
>> > >Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
>"Reasons
>> > >for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of
>Divorce
>> > >and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
>> > >Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and
>Remarriage,
>> > >Vol. 20, 1993. ]
>> > >
>> > > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
>> > >grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing
>more
>> > >than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
>> > >swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset
>in a
>> > >marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the
>most
>> > >likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
>because
>> > >they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
>> > >control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change
>the
>> > >way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are
>likely
>> > >to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if
>the
>> > >marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
>parenting
>> > >parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret
>F.
>> > >Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
>Divorce
>> > >Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000.
>Quotes
>> > >of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at
>Realities of
>> > >Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
>> > >
>> > > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces)
>have
>> > >significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
>decline
>> > >in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
>> > >custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states
>having
>> > >low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
>> > >Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the
>11th
>> > >annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives
>for
>> > >divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
>> > > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties
>such
>> > >as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as
>they
>> > >would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
>parents)
>> > >and fewer false expectations."
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>

[Paul Fritz]

<snicker> poor little 'stealing for mommies' the desperation is getting
more comical by the day...........maybe we should start a pool on how long
before it reinvents itself.......I'm guessing when the new supply of meds
arrive.

"Dusty" > wrote in message ...
> HA! Yeah and the strings are pretty frayed!!
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "TeacherMama" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > > Fighting For Kids > wrote in message
> > >...
> > > > Paul fritz.. is this your post or kens?
> > > >
> > > > Blah Blah.. blah blah..
> > >
> > > And how, precisely, does this answer the concerns posted, FFK? He has
> > > cited a number of studies.
> >
> > <snicker> the mental midget 'stealing for mommies' hasn't yet mastered
> the
> > concept that not all things on the www is true. and that you need to
> check
> > sources.........so in the mean time, I am LMAO at SFM's dancing like a
> > puppet.
> >
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:45:46 -0800, "Paul Fritz"
> > > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce
> [Bumpass,
> > > > >"What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics
> and
> > > > >Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498.
Martin
> &
> > > > >Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26,
> > 1989, pg
> > > > >37-51.]
> > > > >
> > > > > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female
partner:
> 74
> > to
> > > > >80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only
> > slightly
> > > > >from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.)
> [Maggie
> > > > >Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> > > > >Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr.
> and
> > > > >Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When
> > Parents
> > > > >Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
> > Hughes,
> > > > >"Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne:
> Australian
> > > > >Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as
> quoted
> > in
> > > > >The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?"
> Journal
> > of
> > > > >Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver &
> > O'Connell,
> > > > >Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
> > "Reasons
> > > > >for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of
> > Divorce
> > > > >and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced
> Whom?
> > > > >Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and
> > Remarriage,
> > > > >Vol. 20, 1993. ]
> > > > >
> > > > > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears
> for
> > > > >grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one
contributing
> > more
> > > > >than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody
> absolutely
> > > > >swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important
asset
> > in a
> > > > >marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far
> the
> > most
> > > > >likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
> > because
> > > > >they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives
> them
> > > > >control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to
change
> > the
> > > > >way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers
are
> > likely
> > > > >to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them
if
> > the
> > > > >marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
> > parenting
> > > > >parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play."
> [Margaret
> > F.
> > > > >Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
> > Divorce
> > > > >Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July,
2000.
> > Quotes
> > > > >of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at
> > Realities of
> > > > >Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
> > > > >
> > > > > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of
> divorces)
> > have
> > > > >significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
> > decline
> > > > >in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of
joint
> > > > >custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states
> > having
> > > > >low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John
> Guidubaldi,
> > > > >Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at
the
> > 11th
> > > > >annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >"It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the
> incentives
> > for
> > > > >divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> > > > > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood
> ties
> > such
> > > > >as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer
> as
> > they
> > > > >would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
> > parents)
> > > > >and fewer false expectations."
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> >
> >
>
>

[Bob Whiteside]

"Fighting For Kids" > wrote in message
...
>
> Oh ive mastered that all things on the internet are not true.
> Ive mastered that you are a fake as are you made up sources.
>
> I dont give any of you in here credit.
>
> Paul, Teachermama, Ken, Bob... is that you?

So TJ posts a bunch of sources like she is throwing stuff against a wall
hoping some of it will stick. We turn them back around on TJ when she
reinvents herself as FFK showing they contradict her positions, and she
tells us we have made up the sources. And she denies she is TJ, and
suggests TJ's sources are made up too.

Or TJ/FFK posts a bunch of opinions without any sources, and when real
sources are posted to show her opinions are not based on facts, she claims
those sources are made up too.

BTW - None of us are looking for you to give us any credit. But we do
believe the truth will always prevail.

[Paul Fritz]

"Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
nk.net...
>
> "Fighting For Kids" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Oh ive mastered that all things on the internet are not true.
> > Ive mastered that you are a fake as are you made up sources.
> >
> > I dont give any of you in here credit.
> >
> > Paul, Teachermama, Ken, Bob... is that you?
>
> So TJ posts a bunch of sources like she is throwing stuff against a wall
> hoping some of it will stick. We turn them back around on TJ when she
> reinvents herself as FFK showing they contradict her positions, and she
> tells us we have made up the sources. And she denies she is TJ, and
> suggests TJ's sources are made up too.
>
> Or TJ/FFK posts a bunch of opinions without any sources, and when real
> sources are posted to show her opinions are not based on facts, she claims
> those sources are made up too.

OR she attacks the messengers because she has no credible rebuttal

>
> BTW - None of us are looking for you to give us any credit. But we do
> believe the truth will always prevail.
>
>

[Dusty]

HA! Yeah, usually with the classic "Blah, blah, blah.." Now -there's- a
good rebuttal if I ever heard one!

"Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> nk.net...
> >
> > "Fighting For Kids" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > Oh ive mastered that all things on the internet are not true.
> > > Ive mastered that you are a fake as are you made up sources.
> > >
> > > I dont give any of you in here credit.
> > >
> > > Paul, Teachermama, Ken, Bob... is that you?
> >
> > So TJ posts a bunch of sources like she is throwing stuff against a wall
> > hoping some of it will stick. We turn them back around on TJ when she
> > reinvents herself as FFK showing they contradict her positions, and she
> > tells us we have made up the sources. And she denies she is TJ, and
> > suggests TJ's sources are made up too.
> >
> > Or TJ/FFK posts a bunch of opinions without any sources, and when real
> > sources are posted to show her opinions are not based on facts, she
claims
> > those sources are made up too.
>
> OR she attacks the messengers because she has no credible rebuttal
>
> >
> > BTW - None of us are looking for you to give us any credit. But we do
> > believe the truth will always prevail.
> >
> >
>
>

[Kenneth S.]

Or, as some would have it, "you can lead a horticulture, but you can't
make her think."

No one who knows anything about the overall statistical picture of
divorce in the U.S. would dispute the figures below. The only dispute
is about their interpretation, and what policy implications should be
drawn from them.

However, the plain facts are that: (a) about 70-75 percent of divorces
in the U.S. are initiated by wives over the objections of their
husbands; (b) the causes cited for divorces are predominantly not the
traditional fault causes like adultery, but touchy-feely things like "we
just grew apart" (which, being translated, means in many cases that life
wasn't perfect); and (c) the most important factor in decisions to file
for divorce are expectations of custody.

There are known ways of arresting, and reversing, the epidemic of
divorce and fatherless families in the U.S. So why, considering the
damage that divorce and fatherless inflict, are the remedies not
adopted? Because, for the most part, they would involve restricting the
options available to women (including the option to kick their husbands
out of the family, but maintain a pipeline into their wallets).
Restricting the options available to women is, for most politicians, the
equivalent of touching the third rail.

Freedom wrote:
>
> Excellent facts! Thank you! Keep it up! "You can lead a horse to water, but
> you cannot make him drink."
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
> > "What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
> > Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
> > Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989,
> pg
> > 37-51.]
> >
> > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74 to
> > 80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only slightly
> > from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
> > Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> > Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
> > Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When Parents
> > Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
> Hughes,
> > "Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
> > Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted in
> > The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal of
> > Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver & O'Connell,
> > Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
> "Reasons
> > for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of Divorce
> > and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
> > Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and Remarriage,
> > Vol. 20, 1993. ]
> >
> > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
> > grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing more
> > than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
> > swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset in a
> > marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the
> most
> > likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
> because
> > they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
> > control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change the
> > way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are
> likely
> > to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if the
> > marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
> parenting
> > parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret F.
> > Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
> Divorce
> > Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000.
> Quotes
> > of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at Realities
> of
> > Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
> >
> > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces)
> have
> > significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
> decline
> > in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
> > custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states having
> > low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
> > Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the 11th
> > annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
> >
> >
> > "It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives
> for
> > divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties
> such
> > as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as
> they
> > would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
> parents)
> > and fewer false expectations."
> >
> >
> >
> >

[Kenneth S.]

Or, as some would have it, "you can lead a horticulture, but you can't
make her think."

No one who knows anything about the overall statistical picture of
divorce in the U.S. would dispute the figures below. The only dispute
is about their interpretation, and what policy implications should be
drawn from them.

However, the plain facts are that: (a) about 70-75 percent of divorces
in the U.S. are initiated by wives over the objections of their
husbands; (b) the causes cited for divorces are predominantly not the
traditional fault causes like adultery, but touchy-feely things like "we
just grew apart" (which, being translated, means in many cases that life
wasn't perfect); and (c) the most important factor in decisions to file
for divorce are expectations of custody.

There are known ways of arresting, and reversing, the epidemic of
divorce and fatherless families in the U.S. So why, considering the
damage that divorce and fatherless inflict, are the remedies not
adopted? Because, for the most part, they would involve restricting the
options available to women (including the option to kick their husbands
out of the family, but maintain a pipeline into their wallets).
Restricting the options available to women is, for most politicians, the
equivalent of touching the third rail.

Freedom wrote:
>
> Excellent facts! Thank you! Keep it up! "You can lead a horse to water, but
> you cannot make him drink."
>
> "Paul Fritz" > wrote in message
> ...
> > a.. 60% of marriages in the United States end in divorce [Bumpass,
> > "What's Happening to the Family? Interactions Between Demographics and
> > Institutional Change." Demography Vol 27.4, 1990, pp 483-498. Martin &
> > Bumpass, "Recent Trends in Marital Disruption," Demography Vol 26, 1989,
> pg
> > 37-51.]
> >
> > b.. 67 to 75% of all divorces are initiated by the female partner: 74 to
> > 80% of unilateral (non-mutual) divorces. (Percentages vary only slightly
> > from the US to Australia to Germany and from study to study.) [Maggie
> > Gallagher, The Abolition of Marriage: How We Destroy Lasting Love,
> > Washington, DC: Regnery, 1996, who cites Frank F. Furstenberg, Jr. and
> > Andrew J. Cherlin, Divided Families: What Happens to Children When Parents
> > Part, Harvard University Press, 1991, p. 22. Ilene Wolcott and Jody
> Hughes,
> > "Towards Understanding the Reasons for Divorce," Melbourne: Australian
> > Institute of Family Studies, Working Paper No. 20, June 1999, as quoted in
> > The Australian, 5 July 1999. Beuhler, "Whose Decision Was It?" Journal of
> > Marriage and the Family, Vol. 48, pp 587 - 595, 1987. Braver & O'Connell,
> > Divorced Dads, Tarcher Putnam, 1998, p. 34. Lynn Gigy & Joan Kelly,
> "Reasons
> > for Divorce: Perspectives of Divorcing Men and Women," Journal of Divorce
> > and Remarriage, Vol. 18, 1992. Braver, Whitley, Ng, "Who Divorced Whom?
> > Methodological and Theoretical Issues," Journal of Divorce and Remarriage,
> > Vol. 20, 1993. ]
> >
> > c.. No gender difference in the number of divorce filings appears for
> > grounds of violence (6% of filings), "exploitation" (one contributing more
> > than receiving - 20%), or adultery. "The question of custody absolutely
> > swamps all the other variables. Children are the most important asset in a
> > marriage, and the partner who expects to get sole custody is by far the
> most
> > likely to file for divorce." Women are much more willing to divorce
> because
> > they rarely fear losing custody of the children. Usually it gives them
> > control over them. "If you remove that distortion, it's apt to change the
> > way men and women relate to each other and to their kids. Fathers are
> likely
> > to spend more time with kids if they can expect to still see them if the
> > marriage doesn't work out. Women will be more likely to see men as
> parenting
> > parnters, and less likely to use divorce as a power play." [Margaret F.
> > Brinig & Douglas Allen, "These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most
> Divorce
> > Filers Are Women," American Journal of Law and Economics, July, 2000.
> Quotes
> > of Dr. Brinig's conclusions are from John Tierney, "New Look at Realities
> of
> > Divorce," The New York Times, July 11, 2000.]
> >
> > d.. U.S. states with high levels of joint custody (> 30% of divorces)
> have
> > significantly lower divorce rates four years later. Their four-year
> decline
> > in divorce rates is double that of states with medium levels of joint
> > custody arrangements (10 - 30%), and over four times that of states having
> > low levels of joint custody (< 10%). [Richard Kuhn & John Guidubaldi,
> > Child Custody Policies and Divorce Rates in the US, submitted at the 11th
> > annual Conference of the Children's Rights Council, Oct, 1997.]
> >
> >
> > "It would be easy to reduce the divorce rate. a) Remove the incentives
> for
> > divorce (implement a level playing field so there is no "winner").
> > b) If society did more to honour, respect, and protect blood ties
> such
> > as parental ones, the next generation's marriages would last longer as
> they
> > would enter their social ties with less neediness (having had both
> parents)
> > and fewer false expectations."
> >
> >
> >
> >