child support laws

[ncimi]

Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
==
In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no charge.
If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume you
were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
==

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
==
In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no charge.
If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume you
were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
==

[Cameron Stevens]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!

How is it you came to have this debt?

Cameron

[Cameron Stevens]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!

How is it you came to have this debt?

Cameron

[ncimi]

"Gini" > wrote in message >...
> "ncimi" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
> ==
> In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no charge.
> If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume you
> were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
> ==
I called them and they said it would take over a year for them to even
process my account. Also, I was told by an attorney that I wouldn't
need an attorney, because no Judge would wipe away court ordered
payments. Well she did. Then I find out that she never ever started a
start date for payments to begin.

[ncimi]

"Gini" > wrote in message >...
> "ncimi" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
> ==
> In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no charge.
> If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume you
> were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
> ==
I called them and they said it would take over a year for them to even
process my account. Also, I was told by an attorney that I wouldn't
need an attorney, because no Judge would wipe away court ordered
payments. Well she did. Then I find out that she never ever started a
start date for payments to begin.

[ncimi]

"Cameron Stevens" > wrote in message >...
> "ncimi" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
>
> How is it you came to have this debt?
>
> Cameron
I was told when we got divorced, since he never showed up that he
waived his parental rights. I did not know that a parent could not do
that, and that visitation and child support are two different things.
I also figured if the DOR could not get him to pay or the state that
how was I going to?

[ncimi]

"Cameron Stevens" > wrote in message >...
> "ncimi" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
>
> How is it you came to have this debt?
>
> Cameron
I was told when we got divorced, since he never showed up that he
waived his parental rights. I did not know that a parent could not do
that, and that visitation and child support are two different things.
I also figured if the DOR could not get him to pay or the state that
how was I going to?

[Cameron Stevens]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...

> I was told when we got divorced, since he never showed up that he
> waived his parental rights. I did not know that a parent could not do
> that, and that visitation and child support are two different things.
> I also figured if the DOR could not get him to pay or the state that
> how was I going to?

It's scary the mis-information that is spewed.

[Cameron Stevens]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...

> I was told when we got divorced, since he never showed up that he
> waived his parental rights. I did not know that a parent could not do
> that, and that visitation and child support are two different things.
> I also figured if the DOR could not get him to pay or the state that
> how was I going to?

It's scary the mis-information that is spewed.

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> "Gini" > wrote in message
>...
> > "ncimi" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
> > ==
> > In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no
charge.
> > If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume
you
> > were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
> > ==
> I called them and they said it would take over a year for them to even
> process my account. Also, I was told by an attorney that I wouldn't
> need an attorney, because no Judge would wipe away court ordered
> payments. Well she did. Then I find out that she never ever started a
> start date for payments to begin.
==
I'm not sure what is going on with your case. The atty. is correct. A judge
cannot eliminate
arrears accumulated from an established order. The question is then: Was
there an established order?
It sounds like there was not. What did the judge say justified elimination
of arrears? Was the established order
a FL order? If you file for a modification or enforcement with DOR, they are
required by law to act within a few months (I do not recall the exact
time--30/60 days?). There must be other variables going on in your case and
without more information, I cannot help you sort it out. Was/is the NCP
disabled? Incarcerated? Active military?
==

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> "Gini" > wrote in message
>...
> > "ncimi" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
> > ==
> > In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no
charge.
> > If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume
you
> > were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
> > ==
> I called them and they said it would take over a year for them to even
> process my account. Also, I was told by an attorney that I wouldn't
> need an attorney, because no Judge would wipe away court ordered
> payments. Well she did. Then I find out that she never ever started a
> start date for payments to begin.
==
I'm not sure what is going on with your case. The atty. is correct. A judge
cannot eliminate
arrears accumulated from an established order. The question is then: Was
there an established order?
It sounds like there was not. What did the judge say justified elimination
of arrears? Was the established order
a FL order? If you file for a modification or enforcement with DOR, they are
required by law to act within a few months (I do not recall the exact
time--30/60 days?). There must be other variables going on in your case and
without more information, I cannot help you sort it out. Was/is the NCP
disabled? Incarcerated? Active military?
==

[ncimi]

"Gini" > wrote in message >...
> "ncimi" > wrote in message
> om...
> > "Gini" > wrote in message
> >...
> > > "ncimi" > wrote in message
> > > om...
> > > > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > > > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > > > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > > > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > > > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
> > > ==
> > > In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no
> charge.
> > > If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume
> you
> > > were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
> > > ==
I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
know what you think?
> > I called them and they said it would take over a year for them to even
> > process my account. Also, I was told by an attorney that I wouldn't
> > need an attorney, because no Judge would wipe away court ordered
> > payments. Well she did. Then I find out that she never ever started a
> > start date for payments to begin.
> ==
> I'm not sure what is going on with your case. The atty. is correct. A judge
> cannot eliminate
> arrears accumulated from an established order. The question is then: Was
> there an established order?
> It sounds like there was not. What did the judge say justified elimination
> of arrears? Was the established order
> a FL order? If you file for a modification or enforcement with DOR, they are
> required by law to act within a few months (I do not recall the exact
> time--30/60 days?). There must be other variables going on in your case and
> without more information, I cannot help you sort it out. Was/is the NCP
> disabled? Incarcerated? Active military?
> ==

[ncimi]

"Gini" > wrote in message >...
> "ncimi" > wrote in message
> om...
> > "Gini" > wrote in message
> >...
> > > "ncimi" > wrote in message
> > > om...
> > > > Can someone help me find someone that will help me find out if a Judge
> > > > in the state of Florida can erase 11 of 13 years back child support? I
> > > > have went to every website I can find from my Governors office to
> > > > advocates and no one will help. I'm pretty sure I got screwed, but I
> > > > can't find out for sure, because I can't afford a lawyer. Please help!
> > > ==
> > > In Florida, the DOR attorneys represent the custodial parent at no
> charge.
> > > If you are the custodial parent and you went before a judge, I presume
> you
> > > were there with a DOR attorney? If not, why not?
> > > ==
I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
know what you think?
> > I called them and they said it would take over a year for them to even
> > process my account. Also, I was told by an attorney that I wouldn't
> > need an attorney, because no Judge would wipe away court ordered
> > payments. Well she did. Then I find out that she never ever started a
> > start date for payments to begin.
> ==
> I'm not sure what is going on with your case. The atty. is correct. A judge
> cannot eliminate
> arrears accumulated from an established order. The question is then: Was
> there an established order?
> It sounds like there was not. What did the judge say justified elimination
> of arrears? Was the established order
> a FL order? If you file for a modification or enforcement with DOR, they are
> required by law to act within a few months (I do not recall the exact
> time--30/60 days?). There must be other variables going on in your case and
> without more information, I cannot help you sort it out. Was/is the NCP
> disabled? Incarcerated? Active military?
> ==

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote
.................................................
> I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
> with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> know what you think?

========================================
*DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
information
is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law and
Rules of Procedure. It may not
apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
========================================

OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:

1. Custody/visitation

2. "child support."

3. Parental rights

An NCP can
lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It takes
much much more than that.
My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
(which is way different from parental rights).
Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights) does
not eliminate financial responsibility.
Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
about
"parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
matters at this point. I need to know
exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made since
then and if so,
exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order, not
what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted, I
*still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
established. I first need to establish that you have a court order (signed
by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears and
no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where an
order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx beginning
on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain amount
each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you wish
at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
==
==

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote
.................................................
> I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
> with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> know what you think?

========================================
*DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
information
is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law and
Rules of Procedure. It may not
apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
========================================

OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:

1. Custody/visitation

2. "child support."

3. Parental rights

An NCP can
lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It takes
much much more than that.
My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
(which is way different from parental rights).
Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights) does
not eliminate financial responsibility.
Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
about
"parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
matters at this point. I need to know
exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made since
then and if so,
exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order, not
what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted, I
*still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
established. I first need to establish that you have a court order (signed
by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears and
no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where an
order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx beginning
on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain amount
each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you wish
at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
==
==

[Bob Whiteside]

"Gini" > wrote in message
...
>
> "ncimi" > wrote
> ................................................
> > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
> > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> > know what you think?
>
> ========================================
> *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> information
> is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law and
> Rules of Procedure. It may not
> apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> ========================================
>
> OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
>
> 1. Custody/visitation
>
> 2. "child support."
>
> 3. Parental rights
>
> An NCP can
> lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It takes
> much much more than that.
> My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
> (which is way different from parental rights).
> Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights)
does
> not eliminate financial responsibility.
> Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
> about
> "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
> matters at this point. I need to know
> exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made since
> then and if so,
> exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order, not
> what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted, I
> *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> established. I first need to establish that you have a court order (signed
> by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
> support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears and
> no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
> Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where an
> order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx beginning
> on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain amount
> each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you wish
> at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> ==
> ==

When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since the OP
said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that might be
the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the first
payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always the
possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court records
to formally document the CS obligation.

[Bob Whiteside]

"Gini" > wrote in message
...
>
> "ncimi" > wrote
> ................................................
> > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
> > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> > know what you think?
>
> ========================================
> *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> information
> is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law and
> Rules of Procedure. It may not
> apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> ========================================
>
> OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
>
> 1. Custody/visitation
>
> 2. "child support."
>
> 3. Parental rights
>
> An NCP can
> lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It takes
> much much more than that.
> My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
> (which is way different from parental rights).
> Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights)
does
> not eliminate financial responsibility.
> Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
> about
> "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
> matters at this point. I need to know
> exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made since
> then and if so,
> exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order, not
> what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted, I
> *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> established. I first need to establish that you have a court order (signed
> by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
> support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears and
> no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
> Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where an
> order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx beginning
> on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain amount
> each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you wish
> at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> ==
> ==

When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since the OP
said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that might be
the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the first
payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always the
possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court records
to formally document the CS obligation.

[Gini]

"Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
k.net...
>
> "Gini" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "ncimi" > wrote
> > ................................................
> > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
> > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> > > know what you think?
> >
> > ========================================
> > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > information
> > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law
and
> > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > ========================================
> >
> > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> >
> > 1. Custody/visitation
> >
> > 2. "child support."
> >
> > 3. Parental rights
> >
> > An NCP can
> > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
takes
> > much much more than that.
> > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
> > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights)
> does
> > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
> > about
> > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
> > matters at this point. I need to know
> > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
since
> > then and if so,
> > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order,
not
> > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted,
I
> > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
(signed
> > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
> > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears
and
> > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
> > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where
an
> > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
beginning
> > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
amount
> > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
wish
> > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > ==
> > ==
>
> When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since the
OP
> said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that might
be
> the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
first
> payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always the
> possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
records
> to formally document the CS obligation.
==
It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it to
Florida to screw
everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
prerequisite of any
Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it will
be interesting
to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
liability for
"clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
arrearages except for "two years."
It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
exist). It could have been established retroactively for
a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
retroactively no
further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge is
referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
established. Curious.
==
==

[Gini]

"Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
k.net...
>
> "Gini" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "ncimi" > wrote
> > ................................................
> > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > matter, because he still owed the money. The paper never got recorded
> > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> > > know what you think?
> >
> > ========================================
> > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > information
> > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law
and
> > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > ========================================
> >
> > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> >
> > 1. Custody/visitation
> >
> > 2. "child support."
> >
> > 3. Parental rights
> >
> > An NCP can
> > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
takes
> > much much more than that.
> > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
> > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights)
> does
> > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
> > about
> > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
> > matters at this point. I need to know
> > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
since
> > then and if so,
> > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order,
not
> > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted,
I
> > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
(signed
> > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
> > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears
and
> > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
> > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where
an
> > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
beginning
> > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
amount
> > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
wish
> > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > ==
> > ==
>
> When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since the
OP
> said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that might
be
> the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
first
> payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always the
> possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
records
> to formally document the CS obligation.
==
It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it to
Florida to screw
everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
prerequisite of any
Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it will
be interesting
to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
liability for
"clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
arrearages except for "two years."
It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
exist). It could have been established retroactively for
a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
retroactively no
further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge is
referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
established. Curious.
==
==

[Mel Gamble]

Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she signed
as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
that theory.

Gini wrote:
>
> "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> k.net...
> >
> > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > ................................................
> > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > > matter, because he still owed the money.

Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to sign
for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?

> > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> > > > know what you think?

Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as forgiving
the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of the
original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has been
building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
collection.

Mel Gamble

> > > ========================================
> > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > > information
> > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law
> and
> > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > ========================================
> > >
> > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > >
> > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > >
> > > 2. "child support."
> > >
> > > 3. Parental rights
> > >
> > > An NCP can
> > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
> takes
> > > much much more than that.
> > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
> > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights)
> > does
> > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
> > > about
> > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
> > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
> since
> > > then and if so,
> > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order,
> not
> > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted,
> I
> > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
> (signed
> > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
> > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears
> and
> > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
> > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where
> an
> > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> beginning
> > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
> amount
> > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
> wish
> > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > ==
> > > ==
> >
> > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since the
> OP
> > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that might
> be
> > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
> first
> > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always the
> > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
> records
> > to formally document the CS obligation.
> ==
> It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it to
> Florida to screw
> everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> prerequisite of any
> Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it will
> be interesting
> to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
> liability for
> "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
> arrearages except for "two years."
> It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
> exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
> retroactively no
> further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge is
> referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> established. Curious.
> ==
> ==

[Mel Gamble]

Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she signed
as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
that theory.

Gini wrote:
>
> "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> k.net...
> >
> > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > ................................................
> > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we divorced
> > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do that. He
> > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only moved
> > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted me
> > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > > matter, because he still owed the money.

Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to sign
for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?

> > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court in
> > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court in
> > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except for
> > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this, she
> > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know who
> > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then. Let me
> > > > know what you think?

Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as forgiving
the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of the
original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has been
building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
collection.

Mel Gamble

> > > ========================================
> > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > > information
> > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family Law
> and
> > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > ========================================
> > >
> > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > >
> > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > >
> > > 2. "child support."
> > >
> > > 3. Parental rights
> > >
> > > An NCP can
> > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
> takes
> > > much much more than that.
> > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody* rights
> > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental rights)
> > does
> > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree says
> > > about
> > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing else
> > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
> since
> > > then and if so,
> > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the order,
> not
> > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have posted,
> I
> > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
> (signed
> > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of child
> > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS arrears
> and
> > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO arrears.
> > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except where
> an
> > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> beginning
> > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
> amount
> > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
> wish
> > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > ==
> > > ==
> >
> > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since the
> OP
> > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that might
> be
> > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
> first
> > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always the
> > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
> records
> > to formally document the CS obligation.
> ==
> It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it to
> Florida to screw
> everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> prerequisite of any
> Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it will
> be interesting
> to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
> liability for
> "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
> arrearages except for "two years."
> It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
> exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
> retroactively no
> further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge is
> referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> established. Curious.
> ==
> ==

[Gini]

"Mel Gamble" > wrote in message
...
> Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she signed
> as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
> that theory.
==
Not permissable under FL law. A parent does not have the right to waive the
"child's" support.
Not saying that isn't what happened, but it shouldn't under the law.
But--there is the matter of
appeals and it doesn't sound like anyone did it in this case. Perhaps a
judge accepted it and since it wasn't appealed within 30 days, it was upheld
later? Still too much info missing to be sure what happened. Hopefully we'll
get more details from the OP.
==
==
>
> Gini wrote:
> >
> > "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> > k.net...
> > >
> > > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > >
> > > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > > ................................................
> > > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we
divorced
> > > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do
that. He
> > > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only
moved
> > > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted
me
> > > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > > > matter, because he still owed the money.
>
> Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
> non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to sign
> for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?
>
> > > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court
in
> > > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court
in
> > > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except
for
> > > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this,
she
> > > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know
who
> > > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then.
Let me
> > > > > know what you think?
>
> Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as forgiving
> the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of the
> original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has been
> building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
> starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
> case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
> collection.
>
> Mel Gamble
>
> > > > ========================================
> > > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > > > information
> > > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family
Law
> > and
> > > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > > ========================================
> > > >
> > > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > > >
> > > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > > >
> > > > 2. "child support."
> > > >
> > > > 3. Parental rights
> > > >
> > > > An NCP can
> > > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
> > takes
> > > > much much more than that.
> > > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody*
rights
> > > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental
rights)
> > > does
> > > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree
says
> > > > about
> > > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing
else
> > > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
> > since
> > > > then and if so,
> > > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the
order,
> > not
> > > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have
posted,
> > I
> > > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
> > (signed
> > > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of
child
> > > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS
arrears
> > and
> > > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO
arrears.
> > > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except
where
> > an
> > > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> > beginning
> > > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
> > amount
> > > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
> > wish
> > > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > > ==
> > > > ==
> > >
> > > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since
the
> > OP
> > > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that
might
> > be
> > > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
> > first
> > > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always
the
> > > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> > > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
> > records
> > > to formally document the CS obligation.
> > ==
> > It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it
to
> > Florida to screw
> > everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> > prerequisite of any
> > Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it
will
> > be interesting
> > to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
> > liability for
> > "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
> > arrearages except for "two years."
> > It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
> > exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> > a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
> > retroactively no
> > further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge
is
> > referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> > should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> > established. Curious.
> > ==
> > ==

[Gini]

"Mel Gamble" > wrote in message
...
> Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she signed
> as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
> that theory.
==
Not permissable under FL law. A parent does not have the right to waive the
"child's" support.
Not saying that isn't what happened, but it shouldn't under the law.
But--there is the matter of
appeals and it doesn't sound like anyone did it in this case. Perhaps a
judge accepted it and since it wasn't appealed within 30 days, it was upheld
later? Still too much info missing to be sure what happened. Hopefully we'll
get more details from the OP.
==
==
>
> Gini wrote:
> >
> > "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> > k.net...
> > >
> > > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > >
> > > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > > ................................................
> > > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we
divorced
> > > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do
that. He
> > > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only
moved
> > > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted
me
> > > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > > > matter, because he still owed the money.
>
> Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
> non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to sign
> for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?
>
> > > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court
in
> > > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court
in
> > > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except
for
> > > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this,
she
> > > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know
who
> > > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then.
Let me
> > > > > know what you think?
>
> Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as forgiving
> the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of the
> original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has been
> building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
> starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
> case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
> collection.
>
> Mel Gamble
>
> > > > ========================================
> > > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > > > information
> > > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family
Law
> > and
> > > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > > ========================================
> > > >
> > > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > > >
> > > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > > >
> > > > 2. "child support."
> > > >
> > > > 3. Parental rights
> > > >
> > > > An NCP can
> > > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
> > takes
> > > > much much more than that.
> > > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody*
rights
> > > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental
rights)
> > > does
> > > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree
says
> > > > about
> > > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing
else
> > > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
> > since
> > > > then and if so,
> > > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the
order,
> > not
> > > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have
posted,
> > I
> > > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
> > (signed
> > > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of
child
> > > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS
arrears
> > and
> > > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO
arrears.
> > > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except
where
> > an
> > > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> > beginning
> > > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
> > amount
> > > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
> > wish
> > > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > > ==
> > > > ==
> > >
> > > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since
the
> > OP
> > > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that
might
> > be
> > > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
> > first
> > > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always
the
> > > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> > > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
> > records
> > > to formally document the CS obligation.
> > ==
> > It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it
to
> > Florida to screw
> > everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> > prerequisite of any
> > Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it
will
> > be interesting
> > to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
> > liability for
> > "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
> > arrearages except for "two years."
> > It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
> > exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> > a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
> > retroactively no
> > further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge
is
> > referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> > should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> > established. Curious.
> > ==
> > ==

[ncimi]

"Gini" > wrote in message >...
> "Mel Gamble" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she signed
> > as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
> > that theory.
> ==
> Not permissable under FL law. A parent does not have the right to waive the
> "child's" support.
> Not saying that isn't what happened, but it shouldn't under the law.
> But--there is the matter of
> appeals and it doesn't sound like anyone did it in this case. Perhaps a
> judge accepted it and since it wasn't appealed within 30 days, it was upheld
> later? Still too much info missing to be sure what happened. Hopefully we'll
> get more details from the OP.
> ==
> ==
> >
> > Gini wrote:
> > >
> > > "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> > > k.net...
> > > >
> > > > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > > > ................................................
> > > > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we
> divorced
> > > > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do
> that. He
> > > > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only
> moved
> > > > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted
> me
> > > > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > > > > matter, because he still owed the money.
> >
> > Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
> > non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to sign
> > for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?
> >
> > > > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court
> in
> > > > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court
> in
> > > > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except
> for
> > > > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this,
> she
> > > > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know
> who
> > > > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then.
> Let me
> > > > > > know what you think?
> >
> > Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as forgiving
> > the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of the
> > original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has been
> > building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
> > starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
> > case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
> > collection.
> >
> > Mel Gamble
> >
> > > > > ========================================
> > > > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > > > > information
> > > > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family
> Law
> and
> > > > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > > > ========================================
> > > > >
> > > > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > > > >
> > > > > 2. "child support."
> > > > >
> > > > > 3. Parental rights
> > > > >
> > > > > An NCP can
> > > > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
> takes
> > > > > much much more than that.
> > > > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody*
> rights
> > > > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental
> rights)
> does
> > > > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree
> says
> > > > > about
> > > > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing
> else
> > > > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
> since
> > > > > then and if so,
> > > > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the
> order,
> not
> > > > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have
> posted,
> I
> > > > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > > > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
> (signed
> > > > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of
> child
> > > > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS
> arrears
> and
> > > > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO
> arrears.
> > > > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except
> where
> an
> > > > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> beginning
> > > > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
> amount
> > > > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
> wish
> > > > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > > > ==
> > > > > ==
> > > >
> > > > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since
> the
> OP
> > > > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that
> might
> be
> > > > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
> first
> > > > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always
> the
> > > > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> > > > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
> records
> > > > to formally document the CS obligation.
> > > ==
> > > It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it
> to
> > > Florida to screw
> > > everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> > > prerequisite of any
> > > Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it
> will
> > > be interesting
> > > to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
> > > liability for
> > > "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
> > > arrearages except for "two years."
> > > It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
> > > exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> > > a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
> > > retroactively no
> > > further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge
> is
> > > referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> > > should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> > > established. Curious.
> > > ==
> > > ==

Thank you to everyone that has given me your opinion on my issue. It
is greatly appreciated. But it seems that everyone is making me out to
be the bad guy in this situation. Yes, I never went after him for
child support, because I didn't think I could, because of what the
divorce judge said. Also, why should I track him down to spend time
with her daughter. He is an adult (I use the word lossly) he should of
stepped up and been a father. Now my daughter wants nothing to do with
him. Now is that my fault, or his? How come I am being punished for
this? I am just trying to raise my daughter the best I can. According
to the divorce papers he was ordered (signed by the judge) to pay
$156.00 month(which isn't jack) starting on the 15 of October 1991.
The judge in October of 2003 said that the paper that I signed in 2000
was not a legal document. She erased 11 of the 13 years because she
said that Florida law only allows to go back 13 years. See, I can't
afford an attorney and by what everyone says, I am pretty much
screwed, trying to collect the back because the judge already erased
it. The DOR was never involved because they have no record of him
owing, but I have divorce papers saying he does. My wish is to find
somebody who can help me find out what went wrong? He is suppose to
start paying on the 15th of this month ($156.00) I guess I will see if
any of the two years is added in to that? If Gini reads this I tried
to e-mail but it wouldn't go thru. You said your e-mail is dot net? Is
it dot com?Let me know.

[ncimi]

"Gini" > wrote in message >...
> "Mel Gamble" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she signed
> > as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
> > that theory.
> ==
> Not permissable under FL law. A parent does not have the right to waive the
> "child's" support.
> Not saying that isn't what happened, but it shouldn't under the law.
> But--there is the matter of
> appeals and it doesn't sound like anyone did it in this case. Perhaps a
> judge accepted it and since it wasn't appealed within 30 days, it was upheld
> later? Still too much info missing to be sure what happened. Hopefully we'll
> get more details from the OP.
> ==
> ==
> >
> > Gini wrote:
> > >
> > > "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> > > k.net...
> > > >
> > > > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > > > ................................................
> > > > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we
> divorced
> > > > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived his
> > > > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do
> that. He
> > > > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only
> moved
> > > > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he contacted
> me
> > > > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all the
> > > > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still didn't
> > > > > > matter, because he still owed the money.
> >
> > Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
> > non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to sign
> > for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?
> >
> > > > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to court
> in
> > > > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind of
> > > > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to court
> in
> > > > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages except
> for
> > > > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did this,
> she
> > > > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't know
> who
> > > > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then.
> Let me
> > > > > > know what you think?
> >
> > Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as forgiving
> > the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of the
> > original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has been
> > building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
> > starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
> > case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
> > collection.
> >
> > Mel Gamble
> >
> > > > > ========================================
> > > > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise. This
> > > > > information
> > > > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida Family
> Law
> and
> > > > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > > > ========================================
> > > > >
> > > > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > > > >
> > > > > 2. "child support."
> > > > >
> > > > > 3. Parental rights
> > > > >
> > > > > An NCP can
> > > > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing. It
> takes
> > > > > much much more than that.
> > > > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or *custody*
> rights
> > > > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental
> rights)
> does
> > > > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce decree
> says
> > > > > about
> > > > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support." Nothing
> else
> > > > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been made
> since
> > > > > then and if so,
> > > > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the
> order,
> not
> > > > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have
> posted,
> I
> > > > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever being
> > > > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court order
> (signed
> > > > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of
> child
> > > > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS
> arrears
> and
> > > > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO
> arrears.
> > > > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with except
> where
> an
> > > > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> beginning
> > > > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a certain
> amount
> > > > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if you
> wish
> > > > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > > > ==
> > > > > ==
> > > >
> > > > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added. Since
> the
> OP
> > > > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that
> might
> be
> > > > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when the
> first
> > > > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is always
> the
> > > > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to sign
> > > > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the court
> records
> > > > to formally document the CS obligation.
> > > ==
> > > It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave it
> to
> > > Florida to screw
> > > everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> > > prerequisite of any
> > > Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up, it
> will
> > > be interesting
> > > to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt from
> > > liability for
> > > "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of erasing
> > > arrearages except for "two years."
> > > It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it doesn't
> > > exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> > > a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be established
> > > retroactively no
> > > further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the judge
> is
> > > referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> > > should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> > > established. Curious.
> > > ==
> > > ==

Thank you to everyone that has given me your opinion on my issue. It
is greatly appreciated. But it seems that everyone is making me out to
be the bad guy in this situation. Yes, I never went after him for
child support, because I didn't think I could, because of what the
divorce judge said. Also, why should I track him down to spend time
with her daughter. He is an adult (I use the word lossly) he should of
stepped up and been a father. Now my daughter wants nothing to do with
him. Now is that my fault, or his? How come I am being punished for
this? I am just trying to raise my daughter the best I can. According
to the divorce papers he was ordered (signed by the judge) to pay
$156.00 month(which isn't jack) starting on the 15 of October 1991.
The judge in October of 2003 said that the paper that I signed in 2000
was not a legal document. She erased 11 of the 13 years because she
said that Florida law only allows to go back 13 years. See, I can't
afford an attorney and by what everyone says, I am pretty much
screwed, trying to collect the back because the judge already erased
it. The DOR was never involved because they have no record of him
owing, but I have divorce papers saying he does. My wish is to find
somebody who can help me find out what went wrong? He is suppose to
start paying on the 15th of this month ($156.00) I guess I will see if
any of the two years is added in to that? If Gini reads this I tried
to e-mail but it wouldn't go thru. You said your e-mail is dot net? Is
it dot com?Let me know.

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote
.................................................. .....................
>
> Thank you to everyone that has given me your opinion on my issue. It
> is greatly appreciated. But it seems that everyone is making me out to
> be the bad guy in this situation.
===
Not everyone. alt.child-support has always been a refuge for NCPs
(including my husband) who
have been treated very badly by the system. Your case deals with very small
amounts of money so
the system isn't going to put resources in trying to collect for you. Most
of the dads here have been
ordered to pay a *lot* of child support (my husband paid 1200. a month for
two kids--now grown,
fortunately). Many here are"deadbroke dads," due to high "lifestyle" CS
awards, not deadbeat dads.
My guess is that is a side of the system you haven't experienced so try to
be patient--you can learn
a lot here if you chose to.
==
..........................................
According
> to the divorce papers he was ordered (signed by the judge) to pay
> $156.00 month(which isn't jack) starting on the 15 of October 1991.
> The judge in October of 2003 said that the paper that I signed in 2000
> was not a legal document.
==
This is true. Any agreement between parents must be approved by a judge to
be valid.
Notory Publics don't count.
==
She erased 11 of the 13 years because she
> said that Florida law only allows to go back 13 years.
==
That doesn't make sense to me. If FL law permits 13 years, why were 11 years
erased?
==
See, I can't
> afford an attorney and by what everyone says, I am pretty much
> screwed, trying to collect the back because the judge already erased
> it.
==
You have a right to appeal an order but it must be within 30 days of the
ruling.
You probably could have won on appeal but the time has expired.
==
The DOR was never involved because they have no record of him
> owing, but I have divorce papers saying he does. My wish is to find
> somebody who can help me find out what went wrong?
==
You must go to DOR and establish a case with them.
==
He is suppose to
> start paying on the 15th of this month ($156.00) I guess I will see if
> any of the two years is added in to that?
==
Normally, a small amount for arrears is added to the monthly support.
If that were going to happen, it should say so in your order.
==
If Gini reads this I tried
> to e-mail but it wouldn't go thru. You said your e-mail is dot net? Is
> it dot com?Let me know.
==
No, it is dot net

[Gini]

"ncimi" > wrote
.................................................. .....................
>
> Thank you to everyone that has given me your opinion on my issue. It
> is greatly appreciated. But it seems that everyone is making me out to
> be the bad guy in this situation.
===
Not everyone. alt.child-support has always been a refuge for NCPs
(including my husband) who
have been treated very badly by the system. Your case deals with very small
amounts of money so
the system isn't going to put resources in trying to collect for you. Most
of the dads here have been
ordered to pay a *lot* of child support (my husband paid 1200. a month for
two kids--now grown,
fortunately). Many here are"deadbroke dads," due to high "lifestyle" CS
awards, not deadbeat dads.
My guess is that is a side of the system you haven't experienced so try to
be patient--you can learn
a lot here if you chose to.
==
..........................................
According
> to the divorce papers he was ordered (signed by the judge) to pay
> $156.00 month(which isn't jack) starting on the 15 of October 1991.
> The judge in October of 2003 said that the paper that I signed in 2000
> was not a legal document.
==
This is true. Any agreement between parents must be approved by a judge to
be valid.
Notory Publics don't count.
==
She erased 11 of the 13 years because she
> said that Florida law only allows to go back 13 years.
==
That doesn't make sense to me. If FL law permits 13 years, why were 11 years
erased?
==
See, I can't
> afford an attorney and by what everyone says, I am pretty much
> screwed, trying to collect the back because the judge already erased
> it.
==
You have a right to appeal an order but it must be within 30 days of the
ruling.
You probably could have won on appeal but the time has expired.
==
The DOR was never involved because they have no record of him
> owing, but I have divorce papers saying he does. My wish is to find
> somebody who can help me find out what went wrong?
==
You must go to DOR and establish a case with them.
==
He is suppose to
> start paying on the 15th of this month ($156.00) I guess I will see if
> any of the two years is added in to that?
==
Normally, a small amount for arrears is added to the monthly support.
If that were going to happen, it should say so in your order.
==
If Gini reads this I tried
> to e-mail but it wouldn't go thru. You said your e-mail is dot net? Is
> it dot com?Let me know.
==
No, it is dot net

[Bob Whiteside]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> "Gini" > wrote in message
>...
> > "Mel Gamble" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she
signed
> > > as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
> > > that theory.
> > ==
> > Not permissable under FL law. A parent does not have the right to waive
the
> > "child's" support.
> > Not saying that isn't what happened, but it shouldn't under the law.
> > But--there is the matter of
> > appeals and it doesn't sound like anyone did it in this case. Perhaps a
> > judge accepted it and since it wasn't appealed within 30 days, it was
upheld
> > later? Still too much info missing to be sure what happened. Hopefully
we'll
> > get more details from the OP.
> > ==
> > ==
> > >
> > > Gini wrote:
> > > >
> > > > "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> > > > k.net...
> > > > >
> > > > > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > > > > ...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > > > > ................................................
> > > > > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we
> > divorced
> > > > > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived
his
> > > > > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do
> > that. He
> > > > > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only
> > moved
> > > > > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he
contacted
> > me
> > > > > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all
the
> > > > > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still
didn't
> > > > > > > matter, because he still owed the money.
> > >
> > > Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
> > > non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to
sign
> > > for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?
> > >
> > > > > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to
court
> > in
> > > > > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind
of
> > > > > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to
court
> > in
> > > > > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages
except
> > for
> > > > > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did
this,
> > she
> > > > > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't
know
> > who
> > > > > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then.
> > Let me
> > > > > > > know what you think?
> > >
> > > Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as
forgiving
> > > the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of
the
> > > original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has
been
> > > building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
> > > starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
> > > case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
> > > collection.
> > >
> > > Mel Gamble
> > >
> > > > > > ========================================
> > > > > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise.
This
> > > > > > information
> > > > > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida
Family
> > Law
> > and
> > > > > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > > > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > > > > ========================================
> > > > > >
> > > > > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 2. "child support."
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 3. Parental rights
> > > > > >
> > > > > > An NCP can
> > > > > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing.
It
> > takes
> > > > > > much much more than that.
> > > > > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or
*custody*
> > rights
> > > > > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > > > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental
> > rights)
> > does
> > > > > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > > > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce
decree
> > says
> > > > > > about
> > > > > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support."
Nothing
> > else
> > > > > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > > > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been
made
> > since
> > > > > > then and if so,
> > > > > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the
> > order,
> > not
> > > > > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have
> > posted,
> > I
> > > > > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever
being
> > > > > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court
order
> > (signed
> > > > > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of
> > child
> > > > > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS
> > arrears
> > and
> > > > > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO
> > arrears.
> > > > > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with
except
> > where
> > an
> > > > > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> > beginning
> > > > > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a
certain
> > amount
> > > > > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if
you
> > wish
> > > > > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > > > > ==
> > > > > > ==
> > > > >
> > > > > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added.
Since
> > the
> > OP
> > > > > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that
> > might
> > be
> > > > > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when
the
> > first
> > > > > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is
always
> > the
> > > > > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to
sign
> > > > > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the
court
> > records
> > > > > to formally document the CS obligation.
> > > > ==
> > > > It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave
it
> > to
> > > > Florida to screw
> > > > everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> > > > prerequisite of any
> > > > Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up,
it
> > will
> > > > be interesting
> > > > to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt
from
> > > > liability for
> > > > "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of
erasing
> > > > arrearages except for "two years."
> > > > It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it
doesn't
> > > > exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> > > > a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be
established
> > > > retroactively no
> > > > further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the
judge
> > is
> > > > referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> > > > should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> > > > established. Curious.
> > > > ==
> > > > ==
>
> Thank you to everyone that has given me your opinion on my issue. It
> is greatly appreciated. But it seems that everyone is making me out to
> be the bad guy in this situation. Yes, I never went after him for
> child support, because I didn't think I could, because of what the
> divorce judge said. Also, why should I track him down to spend time
> with her daughter. He is an adult (I use the word lossly) he should of
> stepped up and been a father. Now my daughter wants nothing to do with
> him. Now is that my fault, or his? How come I am being punished for
> this? I am just trying to raise my daughter the best I can. According
> to the divorce papers he was ordered (signed by the judge) to pay
> $156.00 month(which isn't jack) starting on the 15 of October 1991.
> The judge in October of 2003 said that the paper that I signed in 2000
> was not a legal document. She erased 11 of the 13 years because she
> said that Florida law only allows to go back 13 years. See, I can't
> afford an attorney and by what everyone says, I am pretty much
> screwed, trying to collect the back because the judge already erased
> it. The DOR was never involved because they have no record of him
> owing, but I have divorce papers saying he does. My wish is to find
> somebody who can help me find out what went wrong? He is suppose to
> start paying on the 15th of this month ($156.00) I guess I will see if
> any of the two years is added in to that? If Gini reads this I tried
> to e-mail but it wouldn't go thru. You said your e-mail is dot net? Is
> it dot com?Let me know.

What is perplexing about your case is the fact the Bradley Amendment in
federal CS law does not allow a judge to wipe out previous support accruals.
Since you have not mentioned any welfare or medical benefits received from
the state, it appears your case is "private" money. (If you were on welfare
then everything changes.)

For a private money debt to be wiped out the judgment creditor (you) can
sign a partial satisfaction of judgment to remove the arrearage by claiming
it is no longer owned to you.

The discrepancy in what you have disclosed so far is the judge appears to
have not accepted your attempt to wipe out the debt, yet the judge wiped out
the debt anyway. Can you explain what reasoning the judge used or cite the
language in the order that eliminated the prior CS debt?

Now if you were on welfare, then the state is owed that portion of the CS
necessary to reimburse the state for the benefits paid to you. In that
case, only the state has the authority to wipe out CS amounts owed. Was the
state a party to your case and did they appear at your hearing?

[Bob Whiteside]

"ncimi" > wrote in message
om...
> "Gini" > wrote in message
>...
> > "Mel Gamble" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Gini, it sounds to me like the court is recognising the paper she
signed
> > > as waiving the arrears. The time periods are close enough to support
> > > that theory.
> > ==
> > Not permissable under FL law. A parent does not have the right to waive
the
> > "child's" support.
> > Not saying that isn't what happened, but it shouldn't under the law.
> > But--there is the matter of
> > appeals and it doesn't sound like anyone did it in this case. Perhaps a
> > judge accepted it and since it wasn't appealed within 30 days, it was
upheld
> > later? Still too much info missing to be sure what happened. Hopefully
we'll
> > get more details from the OP.
> > ==
> > ==
> > >
> > > Gini wrote:
> > > >
> > > > "Bob Whiteside" > wrote in message
> > > > k.net...
> > > > >
> > > > > "Gini" > wrote in message
> > > > > ...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > "ncimi" > wrote
> > > > > > ................................................
> > > > > > > I will just give you quick run down of the situation. When we
> > divorced
> > > > > > > he never showed up for our divorce so the judge said he waived
his
> > > > > > > parential rights. I did not know till now that he couldn't do
> > that. He
> > > > > > > never contacted her or paid child support. In 13 years I only
> > moved
> > > > > > > twice, but never out of the state. In the year 2000 he
contacted
> > me
> > > > > > > and wanted me to sign a paper saying that I would waive all
the
> > > > > > > arrearages. I signed it because I didn't know that it still
didn't
> > > > > > > matter, because he still owed the money.
> > >
> > > Is it true that he would still owe the money in FL, even if it was a
> > > non-TANF (?) case for the entire time? Does FL not allow the CP to
sign
> > > for arrears as long as they are a private debt and not a state debt?
> > >
> > > > > > > The paper never got recorded
> > > > > > > with the county so it never counted. He then took me back to
court
> > in
> > > > > > > October of 2003. The judge said he needed to set up some kind
of
> > > > > > > visitation so he called her four times until we went back to
court
> > in
> > > > > > > Dec. 2003. That's when the judge erased all back arreages
except
> > for
> > > > > > > two years. She said it is a Florida law. But when she did
this,
> > she
> > > > > > > never set a start date, and now she has moved and they don't
know
> > who
> > > > > > > the new judge will be. He has not called her again since then.
> > Let me
> > > > > > > know what you think?
> > >
> > > Sounds like the judge (she?) accepted the signed agreement as
forgiving
> > > the arrears up to the date of the agreement without changing any of
the
> > > original parameters of the decree. I would say that the father has
been
> > > building up new arrears at the rate established by the original decree
> > > starting immediately after the date she signed the "waiver", in which
> > > case she still has an order in effect and just needs help with
> > > collection.
> > >
> > > Mel Gamble
> > >
> > > > > > ========================================
> > > > > > *DISCLAIMER: I AM NOT AN ATTORNEY and this is not legal advise.
This
> > > > > > information
> > > > > > is based solely on my experience in and research of Florida
Family
> > Law
> > and
> > > > > > Rules of Procedure. It may not
> > > > > > apply to your case and I could be wrong.*
> > > > > > ========================================
> > > > > >
> > > > > > OK. You are presenting three *entirely* different legal matters:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 1. Custody/visitation
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 2. "child support."
> > > > > >
> > > > > > 3. Parental rights
> > > > > >
> > > > > > An NCP can
> > > > > > lose parental rights but not for failing to show up a a hearing.
It
> > takes
> > > > > > much much more than that.
> > > > > > My guess is that the judge said he lost *visitation* or
*custody*
> > rights
> > > > > > (which is way different from parental rights).
> > > > > > Further, the loss of visitation rights (and sometimes parental
> > rights)
> > does
> > > > > > not eliminate financial responsibility.
> > > > > > Before going any further--tell me exactly what your divorce
decree
> > says
> > > > > > about
> > > > > > "parental rights" and/or "visitation" and "child support."
Nothing
> > else
> > > > > > matters at this point. I need to know
> > > > > > exactly what the decree states and whether any orders have been
made
> > since
> > > > > > then and if so,
> > > > > > exactly what they/it say(s). I need the *exact* wording of the
> > order,
> > not
> > > > > > what you think it says (sorry). Why?--From everything you have
> > posted,
> > I
> > > > > > *still* do not see any evidence of a child support order ever
being
> > > > > > established. I first need to establish that you have a court
order
> > (signed
> > > > > > by a judge) that says the child's father must pay xxx amount of
> > child
> > > > > > support per month. IF you have that, and he didn't pay, he HAS
> > arrears
> > and
> > > > > > no judge can wipe it out. IF you DO NOT have that, he has NO
> > arrears.
> > > > > > Arrears ONLY accumulate when an order is not complied with
except
> > where
> > an
> > > > > > order is established retroactively (a judge says he must pay xxx
> > beginning
> > > > > > on xxx date). *Do you have an order requiring him to pay a
certain
> > amount
> > > > > > each month?* If so, what is the date on it? You can email me, if
you
> > wish
> > > > > > at, ginih at jlink dot net or post here.
> > > > > > ==
> > > > > > ==
> > > > >
> > > > > When the decree language is disclosed a lot more can be added.
Since
> > the
> > OP
> > > > > said the order was not valid because there was no start date, that
> > might
> > be
> > > > > the issue. Every order I have ever seen specifically states when
the
> > first
> > > > > payment accrues and the duration of the obligation. There is
always
> > the
> > > > > possibility whoever prepared the order for the original judge to
sign
> > > > > screwed it up and/or no money judgment was ever entered in the
court
> > records
> > > > > to formally document the CS obligation.
> > > > ==
> > > > It sounds to me (so far) as if that is the crux of the matter. Leave
it
> > to
> > > > Florida to screw
> > > > everything up. I've come to the conclusion that being a moron is a
> > > > prerequisite of any
> > > > Florida state job. If a judge ordered support and DOR screwed it up,
it
> > will
> > > > be interesting
> > > > to see where the court goes with it. Predictably, DOR/CSE is exempt
from
> > > > liability for
> > > > "clerical errors." I am interested in a further explanation of
erasing
> > > > arrearages except for "two years."
> > > > It's a law I never heard of (which of course, doesn't mean it
doesn't
> > > > exist). It could have been established retroactively for
> > > > a period longer than allowed by law--I believe FL CS can be
established
> > > > retroactively no
> > > > further back than the date of separation. Perhaps that is what the
judge
> > is
> > > > referring to. However, the longer retroactive period
> > > > should have been appealed within 30 days of establishment, if it was
> > > > established. Curious.
> > > > ==
> > > > ==
>
> Thank you to everyone that has given me your opinion on my issue. It
> is greatly appreciated. But it seems that everyone is making me out to
> be the bad guy in this situation. Yes, I never went after him for
> child support, because I didn't think I could, because of what the
> divorce judge said. Also, why should I track him down to spend time
> with her daughter. He is an adult (I use the word lossly) he should of
> stepped up and been a father. Now my daughter wants nothing to do with
> him. Now is that my fault, or his? How come I am being punished for
> this? I am just trying to raise my daughter the best I can. According
> to the divorce papers he was ordered (signed by the judge) to pay
> $156.00 month(which isn't jack) starting on the 15 of October 1991.
> The judge in October of 2003 said that the paper that I signed in 2000
> was not a legal document. She erased 11 of the 13 years because she
> said that Florida law only allows to go back 13 years. See, I can't
> afford an attorney and by what everyone says, I am pretty much
> screwed, trying to collect the back because the judge already erased
> it. The DOR was never involved because they have no record of him
> owing, but I have divorce papers saying he does. My wish is to find
> somebody who can help me find out what went wrong? He is suppose to
> start paying on the 15th of this month ($156.00) I guess I will see if
> any of the two years is added in to that? If Gini reads this I tried
> to e-mail but it wouldn't go thru. You said your e-mail is dot net? Is
> it dot com?Let me know.

What is perplexing about your case is the fact the Bradley Amendment in
federal CS law does not allow a judge to wipe out previous support accruals.
Since you have not mentioned any welfare or medical benefits received from
the state, it appears your case is "private" money. (If you were on welfare
then everything changes.)

For a private money debt to be wiped out the judgment creditor (you) can
sign a partial satisfaction of judgment to remove the arrearage by claiming
it is no longer owned to you.

The discrepancy in what you have disclosed so far is the judge appears to
have not accepted your attempt to wipe out the debt, yet the judge wiped out
the debt anyway. Can you explain what reasoning the judge used or cite the
language in the order that eliminated the prior CS debt?

Now if you were on welfare, then the state is owed that portion of the CS
necessary to reimburse the state for the benefits paid to you. In that
case, only the state has the authority to wipe out CS amounts owed. Was the
state a party to your case and did they appear at your hearing?