On the subject of excruciatingly difficult kids whom we love

[Cele]

Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.

Joelle, I think you're making sense.

Bebe, I know you know, but Joelle's not on your ass, okay? She's not
really even talking to or about you. Your experiences are totally in
the picture, they count, and they've got something to offer, but you
need to lose the defensiveness. Joelle can get up your neck, but she's
not malicious. She's sincere and she does make sense.

Joelle, you're not the only one, I guarantee you. Quite a few of us
have been through agonising depression and medication and grief and
bereavement and pain with our kids. It's a bit minimising of that to
have you say you're the only one, IMO. Still, you make a ton of sense,
as you often do.

Sly, here's the thing:

You're gonna get tons of advice. You're gonna get even more judgement.
Everyone figures they know, and some of them do, but none of them do.
Bottom line: you've got to go with your gut. And even, subterranean,
bottom line: you've got to stay with it, thick or thin, no matter
what. Because the staying with it, however imperfectly, and however
hard, is the thing. It's what matters in the end.

Mine kicked in the door one time, after we agreed, in a rational
moment, that when she lost the plot I should lock her into her
bedroom. Another time, I nailed the window shut. Had to borrow a
ladder to do it. Can't tell you how many times I had her in holds - to
keep her from the razor blades, to keep her from the window - to keep
her from who she thought she was. Ever heard the P!NK song, 'I'm a
Hazard to Myself'? That was her theme song. Had her in holds on the
floor long past where any professional (which I am) would've tried a
one person hold. Called the cops one time when she lasted longer than
I did. Sat on the floor of her friend's house and refused to leave for
five hours one time, when she ran and I wouldn't give up. Spent
countless hours in hospital...spent one nasty night in the ICU waiting
to see if the intentional overdose would be a win or lose. Left home
to get her care. Yada, yada, yada.....

She's good now. Not totally healed, but good. Aware. Clear on whose
life it is, and who's in charge of it. Clear on who will make it or
break it. And when she decides to talk about it, which isn't often,
there's this one refrain....

'You stayed with me. You stuck it out.' I've said, "You'll never get
rid of me. You think that stunt will run me off? Dream on. I'm a
limpet. You're never gonna run me off. I'm your mother and you can't
run off your mother. We're like crazy glue. We're like a bad penny. No
matter what you do, I'm gonna be around. So quit trying." And she
heard me..through all of it, she heard me. She knew I was there.

If I could give you anything, it would be heart and strength and
courage and everything else you need, just to hang on to the precipice
when it feels like you're going over, because that's what they need,
and that's ultimately what we can give.

And eventually, they know what you did. They really do. They know you
hung in there, they know you gave a crap, they know you were alive
with them, and that's what they needed, to find their own lives. It's
excruciatingly, agonizingly, desperately hard. But it's worth it, it's
possible, and it's what you can do. So hang in there. Platitude number
six is available to your right. (platitude #6 says: take care of
yourself, find time for yourself, don't beat yourself up, yada yada
yada, like you have control, right?) But hard as it is, know it's
worth it, and know you can.

Joelle has.

I have.

Bebe has.

Others have.

You can.

Be well.

Cele

[Bebelestrnge0721]

>Subject: On the subject of excruciatingly difficult kids whom we love
>From: Cele
>Date: 9/17/2004 5:05 AM Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: >
>
>Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
>
>Joelle, I think you're making sense.
>
>Bebe, I know you know, but Joelle's not on your ass, okay? She's not
>really even talking to or about you. Your experiences are totally in
>the picture, they count, and they've got something to offer, but you
>need to lose the defensiveness. Joelle can get up your neck, but she's
>not malicious. She's sincere and she does make sense.
>
>Joelle, you're not the only one, I guarantee you. Quite a few of us
>have been through agonising depression and medication and grief and
>bereavement and pain with our kids. It's a bit minimising of that to
>have you say you're the only one, IMO. Still, you make a ton of sense,
>as you often do.
>
>Sly, here's the thing:
>
>You're gonna get tons of advice. You're gonna get even more judgement.
>Everyone figures they know, and some of them do, but none of them do.
>Bottom line: you've got to go with your gut. And even, subterranean,
>bottom line: you've got to stay with it, thick or thin, no matter
>what. Because the staying with it, however imperfectly, and however
>hard, is the thing. It's what matters in the end.
>
>Mine kicked in the door one time, after we agreed, in a rational
>moment, that when she lost the plot I should lock her into her
>bedroom. Another time, I nailed the window shut. Had to borrow a
>ladder to do it. Can't tell you how many times I had her in holds - to
>keep her from the razor blades, to keep her from the window - to keep
>her from who she thought she was. Ever heard the P!NK song, 'I'm a
>Hazard to Myself'? That was her theme song. Had her in holds on the
>floor long past where any professional (which I am) would've tried a
>one person hold. Called the cops one time when she lasted longer than
>I did. Sat on the floor of her friend's house and refused to leave for
>five hours one time, when she ran and I wouldn't give up. Spent
>countless hours in hospital...spent one nasty night in the ICU waiting
>to see if the intentional overdose would be a win or lose. Left home
>to get her care. Yada, yada, yada.....
>
>She's good now. Not totally healed, but good. Aware. Clear on whose
>life it is, and who's in charge of it. Clear on who will make it or
>break it. And when she decides to talk about it, which isn't often,
>there's this one refrain....
>
>'You stayed with me. You stuck it out.' I've said, "You'll never get
>rid of me. You think that stunt will run me off? Dream on. I'm a
>limpet. You're never gonna run me off. I'm your mother and you can't
>run off your mother. We're like crazy glue. We're like a bad penny. No
>matter what you do, I'm gonna be around. So quit trying." And she
>heard me..through all of it, she heard me. She knew I was there.
>
>If I could give you anything, it would be heart and strength and
>courage and everything else you need, just to hang on to the precipice
>when it feels like you're going over, because that's what they need,
>and that's ultimately what we can give.
>
> And eventually, they know what you did. They really do. They know you
>hung in there, they know you gave a crap, they know you were alive
>with them, and that's what they needed, to find their own lives. It's
>excruciatingly, agonizingly, desperately hard. But it's worth it, it's
>possible, and it's what you can do. So hang in there. Platitude number
>six is available to your right. (platitude #6 says: take care of
>yourself, find time for yourself, don't beat yourself up, yada yada
>yada, like you have control, right?) But hard as it is, know it's
>worth it, and know you can.
>
>Joelle has.
>
>I have.
>
>Bebe has.
>
>Others have.
>
>You can.
>
>Be well.
>
>Cele

Cele, You most definately do Know , I 'am' defensive with Joelle, I can only
try to understand her style, in my world she is hard to take, I know it does
not make her all wrong . Your advice to Sly is amazing, I consider this true
compassionate input, I just know there is a nicer way to point out the
possibility the boy may have a problem with the sig. other....and now that Sly
gave us the history there is just not much of a chance that there is any
problem
"there". I still feel Joelle belittled slys ability to know that, and how she
dismisses the unmarried couples sharing in a family, and in parenting in said
families. Thats the bottom line on that.
Bev

[Joelle]

>Quite a few of us
>have been through agonising depression and medication and grief and
>bereavement and pain with our kids. It's a bit minimising of that to
>have you say you're the only one,

Okay, lemme explain again because I'm in no way minimizing anybody's pain and
experience. I overstated the case because I thought it was so ironic that Kit
and my boys were SO similar with the anger and outbursts that don't make sense.
Frankly I've never known anyone to have a kid with quite the problems my son
does. It's just a matter of similarity.

Of course lots of people have difficulties with kids. God knows I'm not the
only one and I'm really lucky because it could have been worse. Although I
have to confess sometimes I used to wish my son had a drug problem, because
then at least I would know what to do.

Lots of people experience grief. But Kate and I know a particular kind of
grief, and even then, it's not the same so some things we can say "I know how
you feel" but other things we have to say "That I don't know or understand"

That's all I meant. God knows I haven't suffered any more, I don't know any
mroe, and I'm not any better than anyone else. Of course i've made mistakes.
In fact, if I do think I'm smart, it's from what I learned from my mistakes.

Joelle
The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page - St
Augustine
Joelle

[Joelle]

>judgement.
>Everyone figures they know, and some of them do, but none of them do.

Some old church lady told me this saying that I found to be full of grace...

"Everyone knows what to do with the crazy lady except the one that keeps her"

I almost made that my sig line.

Joelle
The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page - St
Augustine
Joelle

[Paul Griffiths]

"Cele" > wrote in message
...

> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.

Cele, you're lazy. Okay? :-Þ

On a more serious note I'd like to make the following two points to the
universe in general.

1) I doubt there are many kids out there who actually *choose* to be
"difficult".

2) Kids don't have the monopoly on this unconditional love business. Works
for adults too.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Tiffany]

"Cele" > wrote in message
...
> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
>
> Joelle, I think you're making sense.
>
> Bebe, I know you know, but Joelle's not on your ass, okay? She's not
> really even talking to or about you. Your experiences are totally in
> the picture, they count, and they've got something to offer, but you
> need to lose the defensiveness. Joelle can get up your neck, but she's
> not malicious. She's sincere and she does make sense.
>
> Joelle, you're not the only one, I guarantee you. Quite a few of us
> have been through agonising depression and medication and grief and
> bereavement and pain with our kids. It's a bit minimising of that to
> have you say you're the only one, IMO. Still, you make a ton of sense,
> as you often do.
>
> Sly, here's the thing:
>
> You're gonna get tons of advice. You're gonna get even more judgement.
> Everyone figures they know, and some of them do, but none of them do.
> Bottom line: you've got to go with your gut. And even, subterranean,
> bottom line: you've got to stay with it, thick or thin, no matter
> what. Because the staying with it, however imperfectly, and however
> hard, is the thing. It's what matters in the end.
>
> Mine kicked in the door one time, after we agreed, in a rational
> moment, that when she lost the plot I should lock her into her
> bedroom. Another time, I nailed the window shut. Had to borrow a
> ladder to do it. Can't tell you how many times I had her in holds - to
> keep her from the razor blades, to keep her from the window - to keep
> her from who she thought she was. Ever heard the P!NK song, 'I'm a
> Hazard to Myself'? That was her theme song. Had her in holds on the
> floor long past where any professional (which I am) would've tried a
> one person hold. Called the cops one time when she lasted longer than
> I did. Sat on the floor of her friend's house and refused to leave for
> five hours one time, when she ran and I wouldn't give up. Spent
> countless hours in hospital...spent one nasty night in the ICU waiting
> to see if the intentional overdose would be a win or lose. Left home
> to get her care. Yada, yada, yada.....
>
> She's good now. Not totally healed, but good. Aware. Clear on whose
> life it is, and who's in charge of it. Clear on who will make it or
> break it. And when she decides to talk about it, which isn't often,
> there's this one refrain....
>
> 'You stayed with me. You stuck it out.' I've said, "You'll never get
> rid of me. You think that stunt will run me off? Dream on. I'm a
> limpet. You're never gonna run me off. I'm your mother and you can't
> run off your mother. We're like crazy glue. We're like a bad penny. No
> matter what you do, I'm gonna be around. So quit trying." And she
> heard me..through all of it, she heard me. She knew I was there.
>
> If I could give you anything, it would be heart and strength and
> courage and everything else you need, just to hang on to the precipice
> when it feels like you're going over, because that's what they need,
> and that's ultimately what we can give.
>
> And eventually, they know what you did. They really do. They know you
> hung in there, they know you gave a crap, they know you were alive
> with them, and that's what they needed, to find their own lives. It's
> excruciatingly, agonizingly, desperately hard. But it's worth it, it's
> possible, and it's what you can do. So hang in there. Platitude number
> six is available to your right. (platitude #6 says: take care of
> yourself, find time for yourself, don't beat yourself up, yada yada
> yada, like you have control, right?) But hard as it is, know it's
> worth it, and know you can.
>
> Joelle has.
>
> I have.
>
> Bebe has.
>
> Others have.
>
> You can.
>
> Be well.
>
> Cele
>
>

Excellent. I need to say this just this one time, as I don't think I have
ever commented on your family situation before. I know it must be hard for
you to time and time again to type that story. It must be like reliving it.
But you do it, to help others. I commend you.

I commend all the women who have survived dramatic situations, you continue
to do the best jobs raising kids that may not been so blessed with another
mother. I see mother's doing great things here. If I were so inclined, I
would write a book. It is awesome to hear about single mothers doing great
things.

I also commend the wonderful single fathers in the group who also have dealt
with much drama. It keeps me grounded to know there are these great single
fathers like Paul, Paul and Dennis. (There are more here, I just don't
recall names.)

OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)

T

[Joelle]

>OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)
>

Don't stop now, youre on a roll...;-)
The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page - St
Augustine
Joelle

[CME]

"Joelle" > wrote in message
...
> >OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)
> >
>
> Don't stop now, youre on a roll...;-)
> The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page - St
> Augustine
> Joelle

Ooo I'm off to drink tonight. My neighbour is taking my kids over-night.
How I was ever blessed with that I don't know but yay I get to be amoung
adults and loud country music. Wait, it sounds more like a punishment when
I frame it like that. :(

Christine
(btw I'm not the biggest fan of country but my gf wants me to meet her new
man so I shall accommodate)

[Paul Griffiths]

"Tiffany" > wrote in message
...

<snip>

> Excellent. I need to say this just this one time, as I don't think I have
> ever commented on your family situation before. I know it must be hard for
> you to time and time again to type that story. It must be like reliving
it.
> But you do it, to help others. I commend you.

Do you honestly think she gives herself the option not to?

Please not that my opinion on this issue may be slightly biased. :-))

> I commend all the women who have survived dramatic situations, you
continue
> to do the best jobs raising kids that may not been so blessed with another
> mother. I see mother's doing great things here. If I were so inclined, I
> would write a book. It is awesome to hear about single mothers doing great
> things.

Amen to that.

> I also commend the wonderful single fathers in the group who also have
dealt
> with much drama. It keeps me grounded to know there are these great single
> fathers like Paul, Paul and Dennis. (There are more here, I just don't
> recall names.)

Amen to that too.

> OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)

Hell no, don't stop on my account. I've just finished a bottle of white
wine all by myself and I'm also in serious need of a hug so a virtual group
one would suit me just fine.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:ptK2d.67614$XP3.1266@edtnps84...

<snip>

> Ooo I'm off to drink tonight. My neighbour is taking my kids over-night.
> How I was ever blessed with that I don't know but yay I get to be amoung
> adults and loud country music. Wait, it sounds more like a punishment
when
> I frame it like that. :(

Then don't frame it like that. Easy!

Next problem? :-D

> (btw I'm not the biggest fan of country but my gf wants me to meet her new
> man so I shall accommodate)

And that's a neat statement of one of the reasons why I like you.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Tiffany]

I have to stop..... I don't want to be perceived as kind.

:)


"Joelle" > wrote in message
...
> >OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)
> >
>
> Don't stop now, youre on a roll...;-)
> The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page - St
> Augustine
> Joelle

[Tiffany]

Hugs all around then! :)


T
"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...

[Cele]

On 17 Sep 2004 09:19:02 GMT,
(Bebelestrnge0721) wrote:


>Cele, You most definately do Know , I 'am' defensive with Joelle, I can only
>try to understand her style, in my world she is hard to take, I know it does
>not make her all wrong .

OK. Joelle actually has a helluva lot to offer. I just wish people
were a little gentler all 'round. But that'd be *my* problem. ;-)

>Your advice to Sly is amazing, I consider this true
>compassionate input, I just know there is a nicer way to point out the
>possibility the boy may have a problem with the sig. other....

Well, y'know, it might just be that the way I communicate works better
for some, and the way Joelle communicates works better for others with
another style, and so on and so forth.....

>and now that Sly
>gave us the history there is just not much of a chance that there is any
>problem
>"there".

Oh, hell, who knows? I don't suppose any of us can tell over a few
posts on usenet. All anyone can do is toss out their thoughts and
experiences. Some of those will ring true for some people, some will
ring true for others, and some will be good typing exercise for the
poster at the very least. :-)

> I still feel Joelle belittled slys ability to know that, and how she
>dismisses the unmarried couples sharing in a family, and in parenting in said
>families. Thats the bottom line on that.
>Bev

Well, obviously, your feelings are your own and it's not up to anybody
to tell you how to feel. But of course, not everyone will feel as you
do, and they'll be just as quick to say so, and that, of course, is
Usenet.

Take care.

Cele

[Cele]

On 17 Sep 2004 12:21:31 GMT, (Joelle) wrote:

>>Quite a few of us
>>have been through agonising depression and medication and grief and
>>bereavement and pain with our kids. It's a bit minimising of that to
>>have you say you're the only one,
>
>Okay, lemme explain again because I'm in no way minimizing anybody's pain and
>experience. I overstated the case because I thought it was so ironic that Kit
>and my boys were SO similar with the anger and outbursts that don't make sense.
> Frankly I've never known anyone to have a kid with quite the problems my son
>does. It's just a matter of similarity.

Fair enough. :-)

>Of course lots of people have difficulties with kids. God knows I'm not the
>only one and I'm really lucky because it could have been worse. Although I
>have to confess sometimes I used to wish my son had a drug problem, because
>then at least I would know what to do.

Heh. I went through a period of time where I wished mine had cancer
(no diminishing of the pain of cancer, to anyone here who's been
there). I thought, if she had cancer, we'd know the enemy and we'd
fight it and we'd either win or lose. This...especially before we knew
what was wrong...just felt like fighting a war with cooked spaghetti
while standing in quicksand.

>Lots of people experience grief. But Kate and I know a particular kind of
>grief, and even then, it's not the same so some things we can say "I know how
>you feel" but other things we have to say "That I don't know or understand"

[g] Took me a minute there. I tend to think that Kate and *I* know a
particular kind of grief, because of our being the two suicide
survivors here. Just goes to show how egocentric I can be. You're
quite right, of course.

I don't use the phrase "I know how you feel" because, even when our
experiences are very similar, I don't. That's why I often phrase my
remarks in terms of my own experiences. I figure, I can't really
comment on other people's because I don't know the ins and outs of
their lives, but I can offer my *own*, and they can take what they
need and toss the rest.

I realize, though, that this could seem as if I talk endlessly about
myself. I've decided to live with that as a lesser evil.

>That's all I meant. God knows I haven't suffered any more, I don't know any
>mroe, and I'm not any better than anyone else. Of course i've made mistakes.
>In fact, if I do think I'm smart, it's from what I learned from my mistakes.

I know, Joelle. I don't see you as thinking you're better than anyone
else. I was just a bit uncomfortable with the phraseology, is all. I'm
over it. I didn't mean to be excessively PC. Just wanted to clarify.

Be well.

Cele

[Cele]

On 17 Sep 2004 13:01:18 GMT, (Joelle) wrote:

>>judgement.
>>Everyone figures they know, and some of them do, but none of them do.
>
>Some old church lady told me this saying that I found to be full of grace...
>
>"Everyone knows what to do with the crazy lady except the one that keeps her"
>
>I almost made that my sig line.

Heh. Love it. It *would* make a good sig.

Cele

[Cele]

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:46:31 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> wrote:

>"Cele" > wrote in message
...
>
>> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
>
>Cele, you're lazy. Okay? :-Þ

So obliging, is my Paul....LOL

>On a more serious note I'd like to make the following two points to the
>universe in general.
>
>1) I doubt there are many kids out there who actually *choose* to be
>"difficult".

True enough. Or even, people who do.

>2) Kids don't have the monopoly on this unconditional love business. Works
>for adults too.

Yup. But it can be harder when you're not responsible for them, the
way you are for kids.

Cele

[Cele]

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 18:16:44 -0400, "Tiffany" >
wrote:


>Excellent. I need to say this just this one time, as I don't think I have
>ever commented on your family situation before. I know it must be hard for
>you to time and time again to type that story. It must be like reliving it.
>But you do it, to help others. I commend you.

Thanks, Tiffany. I think in the beginning it was actually therapeutic.
Now, it's rather more.....I dunno. You just do it 'cause it might
help. It's not especially heroic; it's more that you really don't want
anyone to feel totally alone with what they're going through, 'cause
that does indeed suck.....and maybe giving someone else a hand makes
some of the going through it that lets you understand a bit a little
more ...acceptable. Turns **** into a learning experience with
consequences, if you see what I mean. But you may not, 'cause I'm
babbling. LOL

>I commend all the women who have survived dramatic situations, you continue
>to do the best jobs raising kids that may not been so blessed with another
>mother. I see mother's doing great things here. If I were so inclined, I
>would write a book. It is awesome to hear about single mothers doing great
>things.
>
>I also commend the wonderful single fathers in the group who also have dealt
>with much drama. It keeps me grounded to know there are these great single
>fathers like Paul, Paul and Dennis. (There are more here, I just don't
>recall names.)

I agree. There are times when human beings just leave me staggered. We
can be both so excruciatingly cruel and so desperately wonderful that
I am often in awe. :-)

>OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)

Heh. Now and then it won't kill you. ;-)

Cele

[Cele]

On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 01:28:24 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> wrote:

>"Tiffany" > wrote in message
...
>
><snip>
>
>> Excellent. I need to say this just this one time, as I don't think I have
>> ever commented on your family situation before. I know it must be hard for
>> you to time and time again to type that story. It must be like reliving
>it.
>> But you do it, to help others. I commend you.
>
>Do you honestly think she gives herself the option not to?
>
>Please not that my opinion on this issue may be slightly biased. :-))

Too true! But of course, you're entirely right.....(psst! Don't anyone
tell him that I'm really an evil troll under a bridge waiting to eat
small children in a single bite.....who only assumes human form when
Welshmen are about.....)

>> I commend all the women who have survived dramatic situations, you
>continue
>> to do the best jobs raising kids that may not been so blessed with another
>> mother. I see mother's doing great things here. If I were so inclined, I
>> would write a book. It is awesome to hear about single mothers doing great
>> things.
>
>Amen to that.
>
>> I also commend the wonderful single fathers in the group who also have
>dealt
>> with much drama. It keeps me grounded to know there are these great single
>> fathers like Paul, Paul and Dennis. (There are more here, I just don't
>> recall names.)
>
>Amen to that too.
>
>> OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)
>
>Hell no, don't stop on my account. I've just finished a bottle of white
>wine all by myself and I'm also in serious need of a hug so a virtual group
>one would suit me just fine.

See, now, if you were here, I could give you a hand with that.....

(OK, OK, I know, we'll get a room. It's just that we can't get one for
another three months and that seems to be causing a bit of trouble in
the hug deficit department.....)

Cele

[Paul Griffiths]

"Tiffany" > wrote in message
...

> Hugs all around then! :)

Okay! {{{{{everyone in the group}}}}}


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"Cele" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 01:28:24 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
> >"Tiffany" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> ><snip>
> >
> >> Excellent. I need to say this just this one time, as I don't think I
have
> >> ever commented on your family situation before. I know it must be hard
for
> >> you to time and time again to type that story. It must be like reliving
> >> it. But you do it, to help others. I commend you.
> >
> >Do you honestly think she gives herself the option not to?
> >
> >Please note that my opinion on this issue may be slightly biased. :-))
>
> Too true! But of course, you're entirely right.....

That's a first. You feeling okay Cele? :-Þ

> (psst! Don't anyone tell him that I'm really an evil troll under a bridge
waiting
> to eat small children in a single bite.....who only assumes human form
when
> Welshmen are about.....)

Sorry, did someone say something?

And why do I suddenly feel an uncontrollable urge to say that my passport
and birth certificate say I'm English?

<snip>

> >> OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)
> >
> >Hell no, don't stop on my account. I've just finished a bottle of white
> >wine all by myself and I'm also in serious need of a hug so a virtual
group
> >one would suit me just fine.
>
> See, now, if you were here, I could give you a hand with that.....

Two would be better but I'm not greedy.

Actually that's not true. I *am* greedy but I'm also realistic.

> (OK, OK, I know, we'll get a room. It's just that we can't get one for
> another three months and that seems to be causing a bit of trouble in
> the hug deficit department.....)

I now have a picture of an official-sounding lady in a suit, sitting at a
desk, answering a phone and saying "Hug deficit department. How may I help
you?".


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"Cele" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:46:31 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
> >"Cele" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> >> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
> >
> >Cele, you're lazy. Okay? :-Þ
>
> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL

Only for you, my love.

> >On a more serious note I'd like to make the following two points to the
> >universe in general.
> >
> >1) I doubt there are many kids out there who actually *choose* to be
> >"difficult".
>
> True enough. Or even, people who do.

Except the ones that *do* choose, of course. :-)

> >2) Kids don't have the monopoly on this unconditional love business.
Works
> >for adults too.
>
> Yup. But it can be harder when you're not responsible for them, the
> way you are for kids.

There's usually a lot less one can do to control or influence the situation,
I agree. Scarier in some ways.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Cele]

On 18 Sep 2004 13:35:45 GMT, (Joelle) wrote:

>>I don't use the phrase "I know how you feel" because, even when our
>>experiences are very similar, I don't.
>
>Actually I try to be careful with that to. Because in grief all of us have
>lost something different, we react differently and we have different
>circumstances. It's a fine line to try to empathize and also allow a person to
>have their own pain.

It sure is. Worth it, generally, but hard to do.

>Anyway, I will be more careful about tossing out "I'm the only one" talk :-)

No worries, Joelle. :-) Thanks. :-)

Cele

[lm]

On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> wrote:

>"Cele" > wrote in message
...
>> On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:46:31 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
>> > wrote:
>> >"Cele" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >
>> >> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
>> >
>> >Cele, you're lazy. Okay? :-Þ
>>
>> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
>
>Only for you, my love.

OK, eww! :-)

lm

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "Cele" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 01:28:24 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > > wrote:
> > >"Tiffany" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > ><snip>
> > >
> > >> Excellent. I need to say this just this one time, as I don't think I
> have
> > >> ever commented on your family situation before. I know it must be
hard
> for
> > >> you to time and time again to type that story. It must be like
reliving
> > >> it. But you do it, to help others. I commend you.
> > >
> > >Do you honestly think she gives herself the option not to?
> > >
> > >Please note that my opinion on this issue may be slightly biased. :-))
> >
> > Too true! But of course, you're entirely right.....
>
> That's a first. You feeling okay Cele? :-Þ
>
> > (psst! Don't anyone tell him that I'm really an evil troll under a
bridge
> waiting
> > to eat small children in a single bite.....who only assumes human form
> when
> > Welshmen are about.....)
>
> Sorry, did someone say something?
>
> And why do I suddenly feel an uncontrollable urge to say that my passport
> and birth certificate say I'm English?
>

Because of the sheep connotation? :P

> <snip>
>
> > >> OK...... I am going to stop drinking now. ;)
> > >
> > >Hell no, don't stop on my account. I've just finished a bottle of
white
> > >wine all by myself and I'm also in serious need of a hug so a virtual
> group
> > >one would suit me just fine.
> >
> > See, now, if you were here, I could give you a hand with that.....
>
> Two would be better but I'm not greedy.
>
> Actually that's not true. I *am* greedy but I'm also realistic.
>
> > (OK, OK, I know, we'll get a room. It's just that we can't get one for
> > another three months and that seems to be causing a bit of trouble in
> > the hug deficit department.....)
>
> I now have a picture of an official-sounding lady in a suit, sitting at a
> desk, answering a phone and saying "Hug deficit department. How may I
help
> you?".
>

Sounds kinky is this the new IN porn?

Christine
> --
> Paul Griffiths
>
>

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "CME" > wrote in message
> news:ptK2d.67614$XP3.1266@edtnps84...
>
> <snip>
>
> > Ooo I'm off to drink tonight. My neighbour is taking my kids
over-night.
> > How I was ever blessed with that I don't know but yay I get to be amoung
> > adults and loud country music. Wait, it sounds more like a punishment
> when
> > I frame it like that. :(
>
> Then don't frame it like that. Easy!
>
> Next problem? :-D
>
> > (btw I'm not the biggest fan of country but my gf wants me to meet her
new
> > man so I shall accommodate)
>
> And that's a neat statement of one of the reasons why I like you.
>
Awwwwwww thanks. :D I have a pic of me in a cowboy hat. lol I wore it the
whole night and I needed a photo to blackmail myself with later.

Christine
>
> --
> Paul Griffiths
>
>

[CME]

"lm" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
>
> >"Cele" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:46:31 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> >> > wrote:
> >> >"Cele" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> >
> >> >> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
> >> >
> >> >Cele, you're lazy. Okay? :-Þ
> >>
> >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
> >
> >Only for you, my love.
>
> OK, eww! :-)
>
> lm

Oh good I'm not the only one that gagged at that comment. lol But I assure
you, only out of pure envy.

Christine

[Cele]

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 04:26:45 GMT, "CME" >
wrote:

>
>"lm" > wrote in message
...
>> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >"Cele" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >> On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:46:31 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >"Cele" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> >
>> >> >> Well, call me lazy, but I've only read some of the thread.
>> >> >
>> >> >Cele, you're lazy. Okay? :-Þ
>> >>
>> >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
>> >
>> >Only for you, my love.
>>
>> OK, eww! :-)
>>
>> lm
>
>Oh good I'm not the only one that gagged at that comment. lol But I assure
>you, only out of pure envy.
>
>Christine

Heh. It helps to be able to envision is expression as he types. LMAO

Cele

[Paul Griffiths]

"lm" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
> >"Cele" > wrote in message
> ...

<snip>

> >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
> >
> >Only for you, my love.
>
> OK, eww! :-)

Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the pocket
in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:9U73d.25354$yW6.1563@clgrps12...
> "lm" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > > wrote:
> > >"Cele" > wrote in message
> > ...

<snip>

> > >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
> > >
> > >Only for you, my love.
> >
> > OK, eww! :-)
>
> Oh good I'm not the only one that gagged at that comment. lol But I
assure
> you, only out of pure envy.

Just a point of information here, please, Cele started it. Okay?


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:xR73d.25353$yW6.4567@clgrps12...
> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "CME" > wrote in message
> > news:ptK2d.67614$XP3.1266@edtnps84...
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > > (btw I'm not the biggest fan of country but my gf wants me to meet her
> > > new man so I shall accommodate)
> >
> > And that's a neat statement of one of the reasons why I like you.
> >
> Awwwwwww thanks. :D

No problem. I'd say more but this place is knee deep in mush as it is. :-)

> I have a pic of me in a cowboy hat. lol I wore it the whole night and I
> needed a photo to blackmail myself with later.

LOL Sounds like a good plan but what do you want yourself to do?


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:bQ73d.25352$yW6.24134@clgrps12...
> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "Cele" > wrote in message
> > ...

<snip>

> > > (psst! Don't anyone tell him that I'm really an evil troll under a
> > > bridge waiting to eat small children in a single bite.....who only
> > > assumes human form when Welshmen are about.....)
> >
> > Sorry, did someone say something?
> >
> > And why do I suddenly feel an uncontrollable urge to say that my
passport
> > and birth certificate say I'm English?
>
> Because of the sheep connotation? :P

Gawd, the Welsh could certainly do with a better stereotype couldn't they?
Rugby-playing, mine-working, male-voice-choir-members who shag sheep at
every opportunity. Honestly that's only the guys who live "up the varleys".
Us coastal folks are different, we don't usually sing in choirs. :-Þ

> > <snip>

> > > (OK, OK, I know, we'll get a room. It's just that we can't get one for
> > > another three months and that seems to be causing a bit of trouble in
> > > the hug deficit department.....)
> >
> > I now have a picture of an official-sounding lady in a suit, sitting at
a
> > desk, answering a phone and saying "Hug deficit department. How may
> > I help you?".
>
> Sounds kinky is this the new IN porn?

Dunno, I was trying for a Monty Pythonish effect but if porn works for you
feel free to run with it. ;-)


--
Paul Griffiths

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "CME" > wrote in message
> news:xR73d.25353$yW6.4567@clgrps12...
>> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > "CME" > wrote in message
>> > news:ptK2d.67614$XP3.1266@edtnps84...
>> >
>> > <snip>
>> >
>> > > (btw I'm not the biggest fan of country but my gf wants me to meet
>> > > her
>> > > new man so I shall accommodate)
>> >
>> > And that's a neat statement of one of the reasons why I like you.
>> >
>> Awwwwwww thanks. :D
>
> No problem. I'd say more but this place is knee deep in mush as it is.
> :-)
>
>> I have a pic of me in a cowboy hat. lol I wore it the whole night and I
>> needed a photo to blackmail myself with later.
>
> LOL Sounds like a good plan but what do you want yourself to do?
>
>
> --
> Paul Griffiths
>
>

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "CME" > wrote in message
> news:xR73d.25353$yW6.4567@clgrps12...
>> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > "CME" > wrote in message
>> > news:ptK2d.67614$XP3.1266@edtnps84...
>> >
>> > <snip>
>> >
>> > > (btw I'm not the biggest fan of country but my gf wants me to meet
>> > > her
>> > > new man so I shall accommodate)
>> >
>> > And that's a neat statement of one of the reasons why I like you.
>> >
>> Awwwwwww thanks. :D
>
> No problem. I'd say more but this place is knee deep in mush as it is.
> :-)
>
>> I have a pic of me in a cowboy hat. lol I wore it the whole night and I
>> needed a photo to blackmail myself with later.
>
> LOL Sounds like a good plan but what do you want yourself to do?
>
>
> --
> Paul Griffiths
>

Ok it's really too early on a Sunday because I just sent a blank response...

My response WAS going to be... bad bad things, surely.

Christine

[lm]

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:34:12 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> wrote:

>"lm" > wrote in message
...
>> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
>> > wrote:
>> >"Cele" > wrote in message
>> ...
>
><snip>
>
>> >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
>> >
>> >Only for you, my love.
>>
>> OK, eww! :-)
>
>Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the pocket
>in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.

I wish I'd known that earlier. My keyboard's really a mess. :-) That
must be why the kids haven't been asking for computer time lately.

lm

[Purchgdss]

>Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the pocket
>in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.
>
>
>--
>Paul Griffiths

I've used mine and those surrounding me. Can I get an extra supply?

Hip boots too might be a bonus...... <Wink>

Just my 2 cents.........
Christine

[Paul Griffiths]

"lm" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:34:12 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
> >"lm" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> >> > wrote:
> >> >"Cele" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >
> ><snip>
> >
> >> >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
> >> >
> >> >Only for you, my love.
> >>
> >> OK, eww! :-)
> >
> >Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the
pocket
> >in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.
>
> I wish I'd known that earlier. My keyboard's really a mess. :-)

Oh sorry about that. Normally one of the flight crew would do the
announcement but they're all busy up at the pointly end right now.

> That must be why the kids haven't been asking for computer time lately.

Nice to know it had *some* beneficial effect I suppose. :-)


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
...

> >Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the
pocket
> >in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.
>
> I've used mine and those surrounding me. Can I get an extra supply?

Sure but what have you used them for?

> Hip boots too might be a bonus...... <Wink>

Do you mean like boots from Carnaby Street or do you mean those wader
thingies that fishermen wear?


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:Tnh3d.60077$KU5.29445@edtnps89...
> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "CME" > wrote in message
> > news:xR73d.25353$yW6.4567@clgrps12...

<snip>

> >> I have a pic of me in a cowboy hat. lol I wore it the whole night and I
> >> needed a photo to blackmail myself with later.
> >
> > LOL Sounds like a good plan but what do you want yourself to do?
>
> Ok it's really too early on a Sunday because I just sent a blank
response...

I noticed that.

> My response WAS going to be... bad bad things, surely.

You need to be blackmailed to do bad things?


--
Paul Griffiths

[lm]

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 22:29:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> wrote:

>"lm" > wrote in message
...
>> On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:34:12 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
>> > wrote:
>> >"lm" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 10:43:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >"Cele" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >
>> ><snip>
>> >
>> >> >> So obliging, is my Paul....LOL
>> >> >
>> >> >Only for you, my love.
>> >>
>> >> OK, eww! :-)
>> >
>> >Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the
>pocket
>> >in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.
>>
>> I wish I'd known that earlier. My keyboard's really a mess. :-)
>
>Oh sorry about that. Normally one of the flight crew would do the
>announcement but they're all busy up at the pointly end right now.
>

That's the problem with flying coach. The snobs up in business class
have one-a them fancy-schmancy autopilots.

lm

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "CME" > wrote in message
> news:Tnh3d.60077$KU5.29445@edtnps89...
>> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > "CME" > wrote in message
>> > news:xR73d.25353$yW6.4567@clgrps12...
>
> <snip>
>
>> >> I have a pic of me in a cowboy hat. lol I wore it the whole night and
>> >> I
>> >> needed a photo to blackmail myself with later.
>> >
>> > LOL Sounds like a good plan but what do you want yourself to do?
>>
>> Ok it's really too early on a Sunday because I just sent a blank
> response...
>
> I noticed that.
>
>> My response WAS going to be... bad bad things, surely.
>
> You need to be blackmailed to do bad things?
>
>
> --
> Paul Griffiths
>

No just a smidge of alcohol and I'm good to go.

Christine

[slykitten]

--
"Many have forgotten this truth, but you must not forget it.
You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
~Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Cele" > wrote in message
...
> On 17 Sep 2004 12:21:31 GMT, (Joelle) wrote:
>
> >>Quite a few of us
> >>have been through agonising depression and medication and grief and
> >>bereavement and pain with our kids. It's a bit minimising of that to
> >>have you say you're the only one,
> >
> >Okay, lemme explain again because I'm in no way minimizing anybody's pain
and
> >experience. I overstated the case because I thought it was so ironic
that Kit
> >and my boys were SO similar with the anger and outbursts that don't make
sense.
> > Frankly I've never known anyone to have a kid with quite the problems my
son
> >does. It's just a matter of similarity.

<big snip>
I'm discovering some things with my son that I either never realized or I
really did forget....
1) When he was born, his head was very misshapen. I'm not sure if it was a
birthing trauma or what but I'm at the point where both the therapist and I
believe that my son would benefit from a scan
2) some of his angry outbursts stem from the fact that he knows he's
different. When my ex finally divorced me (I filed 3 times and he denied me
a divorce but finally he filed and I said, "hell yeah! let's get it done!")
and set me free, he refused to allow me to change my son's last name. my
daughters' last names are hyphenated with my name and their dad's last name.
my son wants his step dad's name too but because my ex is.... well.... I
promised that I wouldn't bad mouth him so I'll refrain.... but he won't let
my sig other adopt my son, my ex won't give up his rights to my son, he
won't let me change my son's last name, etc.... making it very difficult for
me and leaving me with lots of questions to be answered.... very awkward
questions to be answered.... so my son does know he's different.
3) back in January 2003, my ex was granted a supervised visit with my son. I
was forced. I fought it as hard as I could but lost that fight. So my son
had to endure 2 hours of my ex. When my ex was granted supervised
visitations once a month for 6 months, a follow up hearing to determine if
enough progress had been made to allow for twice a month supervised visits,
etc.... my ex never followed through. My son again had some questions and
though the answers were given, my son still acted out. There's a lot of
anger in that little boy in spite of his over all sweet demeanor.
4) it's hard to hide nightmares.... those are some questions that I've had
to answer too. My son knows what had happened to me while I was married to
my ex. I also know he doesn't understand. These questions were brought up in
a session and it was the therapist and myself who came up with the best way
to answer my son's questions so he wouldn't be damaged. How do you *not*
damage a kid with an answer to a question like "mom, why is it that
sometimes when you and dad disagree and then you have a nightmare, you
scream out afraid of <so-and-so> hurting you?" or a question like "mom, why
did <so-and-so> rape you and what is rape?" It's come up in sessions. It's
in the open and it's been done in such a way that's "age appropriate" for my
2 older kids so they can understand and not be scared of my nightmares.
We've had some very good therapists who've worked with our family. THe one
we have now is fantastic!

I think that the more that I read here, I may find myself able to relate
more and I may even find more similarities..... I have a theory on why kids
of single parents act out but that's for a different time.... I know that my
son knows more than I give credit for. that's why I believe in being honest
with him.... but I'll never bad-mouth his biological father either, no
matter how much I truly hate that guy. Just because *I* feel that way,
shouldn't mean that my son should feel like that. I believe that my son
should find the truth for himself.

[Cele]

On 20 Sep 2004 10:31:50 GMT, (Joelle) wrote:

>>but I'll never bad-mouth his biological father either, no
>>matter how much I truly hate that guy.
>
>Well, if the guy has done bad things, there's no need to sugar coat it. It's
>important you make your kid understand that if th bio is not a good father,
>it's because of his own defects, not your son's. Explain that there is
>something wrong with his Bio dad that makes him unable to love his kid, nothing
>about the kid that is unlovable. If that's badmouthing so be it.

FWIW, I completely agree with this. Stating the facts with compassion
for your son isn't badmouthing. If you stick to what he did and stay
away from adjectives, that tends to keep it from being gratuitous
trashing.

Cele

[slykitten]

--
"Many have forgotten this truth, but you must not forget it.
You remain responsible, forever, for what you have tamed."
~Antoine de Saint-Exupery
"Cele" > wrote in message
...
> On 20 Sep 2004 10:31:50 GMT, (Joelle) wrote:
>
> >>but I'll never bad-mouth his biological father either, no
> >>matter how much I truly hate that guy.
> >
> >Well, if the guy has done bad things, there's no need to sugar coat it.
It's
> >important you make your kid understand that if th bio is not a good
father,
> >it's because of his own defects, not your son's. Explain that there is
> >something wrong with his Bio dad that makes him unable to love his kid,
nothing
> >about the kid that is unlovable. If that's badmouthing so be it.
>
> FWIW, I completely agree with this. Stating the facts with compassion
> for your son isn't badmouthing. If you stick to what he did and stay
> away from adjectives, that tends to keep it from being gratuitous
> trashing.
>
> Cele

I think that my problem is not that I explain to my son what my ex did to me
it's the fact that I know that I'm still angry about it and that's where
therapy comes in and it's during my sessions that I can trash him. That's
why when I say I "refuse to bad-mouth" my ex.... it's a very conscious
effort on my part to make sure that I don't say anything derrogatory and
inflammatory and with such hatred that my son picks up on it.... I have to
make the effort to explain it almost as if I'm explaining how to add 26 and
305 to get the total of 331. it's still easy for me to trash my ex and I
believe I'm classier than that. That's why I see a therapist. To help me
deal with the issues that I need to deal with. =)

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:6lq3d.86978$XP3.31545@edtnps84...
> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
> ...

<snip>

> > You need to be blackmailed to do bad things?
>
> No just a smidge of alcohol and I'm good to go.

And you didn't mention this when I was in Canada because? ;-)


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
...

> >> I've used mine and those surrounding me. Can I get an extra supply?
> >
> >Sure but what have you used them for?
>
> I could show you if you'd like <Snicker> but it would have to be our
secret

As a kid I used to think secrets were fun. These days I'm not so sure.
Seems I grew up and got boring.

> >> Hip boots too might be a bonus...... <Wink>
> >
> >Do you mean like boots from Carnaby Street or do you mean those wader
> >thingies that fishermen wear?
> >
> Waders for sure....... I need them to wade thru the envy of happy
beginnings.

Well if it helps at all, it's not all happiness, at least not yet awhile.

> Preferably hot pink.... it's my best color.

Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you may
be looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"lm" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 22:29:54 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
> >"lm" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:34:12 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> >> > wrote:

<snip>

> >> >Would all passengers please note that vomit bags are available in the
> >> >pocket in front of your seats. Thank you for travelling with us.
> >>
> >> I wish I'd known that earlier. My keyboard's really a mess. :-)
> >
> >Oh sorry about that. Normally one of the flight crew would do the
> >announcement but they're all busy up at the pointly end right now.
>
> That's the problem with flying coach. The snobs up in business class
> have one-a them fancy-schmancy autopilots.

True but if the thing hits a mountain you get to the next world just as
quickly as they do and in no less comfort. :-)


--
Paul Griffiths

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "CME" > wrote in message
> news:6lq3d.86978$XP3.31545@edtnps84...
>> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
>> ...
>
> <snip>
>
>> > You need to be blackmailed to do bad things?
>>
>> No just a smidge of alcohol and I'm good to go.
>
> And you didn't mention this when I was in Canada because? ;-)
>
>
> --
> Paul Griffiths

LOL nah I'm not THAT cheap and easy... or so I like to tell myself.

Christine

[Paul Griffiths]

"CME" > wrote in message
news:pfG3d.29208$t61.28137@clgrps13...
> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "CME" > wrote in message
> > news:6lq3d.86978$XP3.31545@edtnps84...
> >> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> >> > You need to be blackmailed to do bad things?
> >>
> >> No just a smidge of alcohol and I'm good to go.
> >
> > And you didn't mention this when I was in Canada because? ;-)
>
> LOL nah I'm not THAT cheap and easy... or so I like to tell myself.

Glad to hear that but where did I say that you were?


--
Paul Griffiths

[CME]

"Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
...
> "CME" > wrote in message
> news:pfG3d.29208$t61.28137@clgrps13...
>> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > "CME" > wrote in message
>> > news:6lq3d.86978$XP3.31545@edtnps84...
>> >> "Paul Griffiths" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >
>> > <snip>
>> >
>> >> > You need to be blackmailed to do bad things?
>> >>
>> >> No just a smidge of alcohol and I'm good to go.
>> >
>> > And you didn't mention this when I was in Canada because? ;-)
>>
>> LOL nah I'm not THAT cheap and easy... or so I like to tell myself.
>
> Glad to hear that but where did I say that you were?
>
>
> --
> Paul Griffiths

No I implied it, so you've been absolved of any responsibility in this case.

Christine

[Purchgdss]

>"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
...
>
>> >> I've used mine and those surrounding me. Can I get an extra supply?
>> >
>> >Sure but what have you used them for?
>>
>> I could show you if you'd like <Snicker> but it would have to be our
>secret
>
>As a kid I used to think secrets were fun. These days I'm not so sure.
>Seems I grew up and got boring.

Well get back to your roots MAN! Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from
premature "oldness". Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great
sprinkler at the neighbors (or even your own!)
>
>> >> Hip boots too might be a bonus...... <Wink>
>> >
>> >Do you mean like boots from Carnaby Street or do you mean those wader
>> >thingies that fishermen wear?
>> >
>> Waders for sure....... I need them to wade thru the envy of happy
>beginnings.
>
>Well if it helps at all, it's not all happiness, at least not yet awhile.
>
>> Preferably hot pink.... it's my best color.
>
>Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you may
>be looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)

Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya know. ;-D
Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I can
get.
>
>
>--
>Paul Griffiths



Just my 2 cents.........
Christine

[Paul Griffiths]

"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
...
> >"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
> ...

<snip>

> >> I could show you if you'd like <Snicker> but it would have to be our
> >> secret
> >
> >As a kid I used to think secrets were fun. These days I'm not so sure.
> >Seems I grew up and got boring.
>
> Well get back to your roots MAN!

I'll try and my roots aren't grey so maybe that'll make it easier.

> Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from premature "oldness".

I agree but how would you define premature?

> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at the
> neighbors (or even your own!)

Agreed again but is that an invitation?

<snip>

> >> Preferably hot pink.... it's my best color.
> >
> >Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you
may
> >be looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)
>
> Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya know.
;-D

Which thing would that be exactly?

> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
can
> get.

We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give yourself
credit for.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Purchgdss]

>> >Seems I grew up and got boring.
>>
>> Well get back to your roots MAN!
>
>I'll try and my roots aren't grey so maybe that'll make it easier.
>
Heh, typically when the roots go grey (or the absence of roots take over,
depending on your mother's genetic contribution) is when it seems to become
easiest to revert. Grandchildren have a way of reminding you of the wonders of
bubbles and catapillars that we loose in the years of cycles between our own
childhood, our children's childhood, and our grandchildrens.

But no need to wait for that.

>> Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from premature "oldness".
>
>I agree but how would you define premature?

Anything before the grave.
>
>> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at the
>> neighbors (or even your own!)
>
>Agreed again but is that an invitation?

Sure! My backyard swing and sprinkler are always open to all! Heh, maybe
instead of a meeting somewhere in the middle of North America where it's cold,
we should all meet in the south in the summer for a swinging and sprinkler
party. Embarass our teenagers and thrill our younger ones!.......

Hey that could work! Someone loan me a younger child for a week so I can
torment my Teen....
>
><snip>
>
>> >> Preferably hot pink.... it's my best color.
>> >
>> >Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you
>may
>> >be looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)
>>
>> Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya know.
>;-D
>
>Which thing would that be exactly?

C'mere and let me hit you with my book bag and run away..... (j/k).

>
>> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
>can
>> get.
>
>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give yourself
>credit for.
>
<sigh> At the risk of embarassing myself, this has been drilled into me by my
friends who are honest enough to send me home to re-coordinate my colors.
Whoda thunk Flourescent Orange and plum purple would create such a scene. 0;-D


Just my 2 cents.........
Christine

[Istara]

Purchgdss wrote:

>>>>Seems I grew up and got boring.
>>>
>>>Well get back to your roots MAN!
>>
>>I'll try and my roots aren't grey so maybe that'll make it easier.
>>
>
> Heh, typically when the roots go grey (or the absence of roots take over,
> depending on your mother's genetic contribution) is when it seems to become
> easiest to revert. Grandchildren have a way of reminding you of the wonders of
> bubbles and catapillars that we loose in the years of cycles between our own
> childhood, our children's childhood, and our grandchildrens.
>
> But no need to wait for that.
>
>
>>>Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from premature "oldness".
>>
>>I agree but how would you define premature?
>
>
> Anything before the grave.
>
>>>Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at the
>>>neighbors (or even your own!)
>>
>>Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>
>
> Sure! My backyard swing and sprinkler are always open to all! Heh, maybe
> instead of a meeting somewhere in the middle of North America where it's cold,
> we should all meet in the south in the summer for a swinging and sprinkler
> party. Embarass our teenagers and thrill our younger ones!.......
>
> Hey that could work! Someone loan me a younger child for a week so I can
> torment my Teen....

Hmm... We live in The South - in Georgia, USA - in a semi-sub-tropical
sort of climate. We have a swingset... A sprinkler... A 3-foot snap-set
swimming pool... A dog to run with... and an acre-plus back yard. We do
hay-rides with the lawn tractor and utility trailer, around Halloween.
You can borrow my nine-year-old (as long as you have him back by
bed-time)... And we ALWAYS have bubble stuff under the kitchen sink. :-)
You wouldn't want to be here in high summer - temps run around 100
degrees with 90+ % humidity during most of July and August - but April
thru June and early September are usually perfect for sprinkler parties
and cook-outs. :-)

>
>><snip>
>>
>>>>>Preferably hot pink.... it's my best color.
>>>>
>>>>Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you
>>
>>may
>>
>>>>be looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)
>>>
>>>Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya know.
>>
>>;-D
>>
>>Which thing would that be exactly?
>
>
> C'mere and let me hit you with my book bag and run away..... (j/k).
>
>
>>>Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
>>
>>can
>>
>>>get.
>>
>>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give yourself
>>credit for.
>>
>
> <sigh> At the risk of embarassing myself, this has been drilled into me by my
> friends who are honest enough to send me home to re-coordinate my colors.
> Whoda thunk Flourescent Orange and plum purple would create such a scene. 0;-D
>

Hey, at least you wear COLORS. I usually get sent home - if my friends
can find me - because I'm wearing such blah colors that I fade into the
background scenery. :-)

>
> Just my 2 cents.........
> Christine

(still dancing around the kitchen)

~ Dor

[Cele]

On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 07:51:59 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> wrote:

>"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
...
>> >"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
>> ...
>
><snip>
>
>> >> I could show you if you'd like <Snicker> but it would have to be our
>> >> secret
>> >
>> >As a kid I used to think secrets were fun. These days I'm not so sure.
>> >Seems I grew up and got boring.
>>
>> Well get back to your roots MAN!
>
>I'll try and my roots aren't grey so maybe that'll make it easier.

Show off!

>> Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from premature "oldness".
>
>I agree but how would you define premature?

Before death.

>> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at the
>> neighbors (or even your own!)
>
>Agreed again but is that an invitation?

Hold up a sec while I get my camera....

><snip>
>
>> >> Preferably hot pink.... it's my best color.
>> >
>> >Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you
>may
>> >be looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)
>>
>> Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya know.
>;-D
>
>Which thing would that be exactly?

Yes...do tell....

>> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
>can
>> get.
>
>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give yourself
>credit for.

You could post a pic, for general discussion....

LOL

Cele

[Purchgdss]

>>> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at the
>>> neighbors (or even your own!)
>>
>>Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>
>Hold up a sec while I get my camera....

Cele, SURELY this would be worth a video posted on the net!
<snip>

>>Which thing would that be exactly?
>
>Yes...do tell....

Again, I revert to the bookbag and run... Since we are recreating our
childhood, isn't this a staple? LOLOL


>>> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
>>can
>>> get.
>>
>>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give yourself
>>credit for.
>
>You could post a pic, for general discussion....
>
>LOL
>
>Cele

Just look for my pic on any of the fashion sites in the "DON'T" section.......
That would be me.


Just my 2 cents.........
Christine

[Cele]

On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 08:37:55 -0600, "slykitten" >
wrote:

>> FWIW, I completely agree with this. Stating the facts with compassion
>> for your son isn't badmouthing. If you stick to what he did and stay
>> away from adjectives, that tends to keep it from being gratuitous
>> trashing.
>>
>> Cele
>
>I think that my problem is not that I explain to my son what my ex did to me
>it's the fact that I know that I'm still angry about it and that's where
>therapy comes in and it's during my sessions that I can trash him. That's
>why when I say I "refuse to bad-mouth" my ex.... it's a very conscious
>effort on my part to make sure that I don't say anything derrogatory and
>inflammatory and with such hatred that my son picks up on it.... I have to
>make the effort to explain it almost as if I'm explaining how to add 26 and
>305 to get the total of 331. it's still easy for me to trash my ex and I
>believe I'm classier than that. That's why I see a therapist. To help me
>deal with the issues that I need to deal with. =)

Yes, I see. It sounds like you've assessed your own needs accurately
and taken steps to meet them in a way that will keep your son safe
from any overflow. That's half the battle right there - hell, more
than half!

Take care. :-)

Cele

[Cele]

On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 22:12:03 -0600, "slykitten" >
wrote:

>I'm discovering some things with my son that I either never realized or I
>really did forget....
>1) When he was born, his head was very misshapen. I'm not sure if it was a
>birthing trauma or what but I'm at the point where both the therapist and I
>believe that my son would benefit from a scan

Absolutely. I'm just a special ed teacher, but certainly any kind of
possible head trauma is generally investigated with a scan, especially
when there are symptoms of any sort. You definitely want to rule out
organic issues before treating them as behavioural/emotional. And a
lot of the behaviour you describe is common with closed head injuries.
It's a factor in other things, too, of course, which is why a scan is
a fine idea.

>2) some of his angry outbursts stem from the fact that he knows he's
>different.

Sure. The kids who sometimes have the roughest time are the ones who
are bright and aware of their differences, but not able to change
things.

>When my ex finally divorced me (I filed 3 times and he denied me
>a divorce but finally he filed and I said, "hell yeah! let's get it done!")
>and set me free, he refused to allow me to change my son's last name. my
>daughters' last names are hyphenated with my name and their dad's last name.
>my son wants his step dad's name too but because my ex is.... well.... I
>promised that I wouldn't bad mouth him so I'll refrain.... but he won't let
>my sig other adopt my son, my ex won't give up his rights to my son, he
>won't let me change my son's last name, etc.... making it very difficult for
>me and leaving me with lots of questions to be answered.... very awkward
>questions to be answered.... so my son does know he's different.

I'm not surprised your ex didn't want him to change his name. Whatever
faults he may have or sins he may have committed, most people feel
fairly strongly about their kids keeping their name. My own father was
not someone whose name I chose to carry after my divorce, and even
though I'd not seen him in many years, I'm told that he was pretty
choked when I went with my mother's instead.

As for that making him different, I'd guess that in and of itself it
wouldn't be a problem, if he wasn't *already* feeling insecure and
different. I could be wrong, but it's my best thought on it.

>3) back in January 2003, my ex was granted a supervised visit with my son. I
>was forced. I fought it as hard as I could but lost that fight. So my son
>had to endure 2 hours of my ex. When my ex was granted supervised
>visitations once a month for 6 months, a follow up hearing to determine if
>enough progress had been made to allow for twice a month supervised visits,
>etc.... my ex never followed through. My son again had some questions and
>though the answers were given, my son still acted out. There's a lot of
>anger in that little boy in spite of his over all sweet demeanor.

May I ask why your ex is restricted to supervised visits? Or
not....what I'm getting at, is, has your son suffered some harm that
in and of itself could be adding to things?

>4) it's hard to hide nightmares.... those are some questions that I've had
>to answer too. My son knows what had happened to me while I was married to
>my ex. I also know he doesn't understand. These questions were brought up in
>a session and it was the therapist and myself who came up with the best way
>to answer my son's questions so he wouldn't be damaged. How do you *not*
>damage a kid with an answer to a question like "mom, why is it that
>sometimes when you and dad disagree and then you have a nightmare, you
>scream out afraid of <so-and-so> hurting you?" or a question like "mom, why
>did <so-and-so> rape you and what is rape?" It's come up in sessions. It's
>in the open and it's been done in such a way that's "age appropriate" for my
>2 older kids so they can understand and not be scared of my nightmares.
>We've had some very good therapists who've worked with our family. THe one
>we have now is fantastic!

Yeah, I see what you mean. It sounds like maybe you've got a touch of
PTSD? And it doesn't sound surprising that you would, if you do. My
heart goes out to you. That has to make the whole situation so much
harder. I'm glad you've got a reall fine therapist, because it sounds
like you all have a lot of healing to do. Did you get any support from
the legal system on the rape?

>I think that the more that I read here, I may find myself able to relate
>more and I may even find more similarities..... I have a theory on why kids
>of single parents act out but that's for a different time....

They don't *all* act out, but I'd be interested in your thoughts, all
the same. :-)

> I know that my
>son knows more than I give credit for. that's why I believe in being honest
>with him.... but I'll never bad-mouth his biological father either, no
>matter how much I truly hate that guy. Just because *I* feel that way,
>shouldn't mean that my son should feel like that. I believe that my son
>should find the truth for himself.

Yup, I agree. My ex is a decent enough fellow, but my approach with my
daughters has been pretty much the same: shut up about him and any of
our differences, and let them decide on their own opinions for
themselves. Interestingly, now that they're in late adolesence, they
are making the same observations I did, both positive and not so
positive. I expect they can see all my faults, too. :-)

Be well.

Cele

[Cele]

On 21 Sep 2004 23:45:12 GMT, (Purchgdss) wrote:

>>>> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at the
>>>> neighbors (or even your own!)
>>>
>>>Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>>
>>Hold up a sec while I get my camera....
>
>Cele, SURELY this would be worth a video posted on the net!
><snip>

Without question. But alas, I only have a Hi8 recorder, so someone
else'll have to do the filming....

>>>Which thing would that be exactly?
>>
>>Yes...do tell....
>
>Again, I revert to the bookbag and run... Since we are recreating our
>childhood, isn't this a staple? LOLOL

I thought that was potatoes? Maybe it's a paperclip.....
>
>>>> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
>>>can
>>>> get.
>>>
>>>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give yourself
>>>credit for.
>>
>>You could post a pic, for general discussion....
>>
>>LOL
>>
>>Cele
>
>Just look for my pic on any of the fashion sites in the "DON'T" section.......
>That would be me.

Oh, you must be wearing the same things I am, then. Value Village,
provider of haute couture....

LOL

Cele

[Paul Griffiths]

"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
...

> >> >Seems I grew up and got boring.
> >>
> >> Well get back to your roots MAN!
> >
> >I'll try and my roots aren't grey so maybe that'll make it easier.
> >
> Heh, typically when the roots go grey (or the absence of roots take over,
> depending on your mother's genetic contribution) is when it seems to
become
> easiest to revert.

I seem to have selected the second option.

> Grandchildren have a way of reminding you of the wonders of
> bubbles and catapillars that we loose in the years of cycles between
> our own childhood, our children's childhood, and our grandchildrens.

I'll take your word for it. I'm still a big kid at heart myself.

> But no need to wait for that.

Agreed, I'm not good at waiting.

> >> Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from premature "oldness".
> >
> >I agree but how would you define premature?
>
> Anything before the grave.

Works for me. :-)

> >> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at
the
> >> neighbors (or even your own!)
> >
> >Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>
> Sure! My backyard swing and sprinkler are always open to all! Heh, maybe
> instead of a meeting somewhere in the middle of North America where it's
cold,
> we should all meet in the south in the summer for a swinging and sprinkler
> party. Embarass our teenagers and thrill our younger ones!.......

Sounds like a decent plan, let me know when you've finished the organising.

> Hey that could work! Someone loan me a younger child for a week so I can
> torment my Teen....

Mine'll be 11 if that's any help. Not that young but in a teens eyes maybe.

> ><snip>

> >> Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya
know.
> >;-D
> >
> >Which thing would that be exactly?
>
> C'mere and let me hit you with my book bag and run away..... (j/k).

Okay. Where was it you said you lived?

> >> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
> >> can get.
> >
> >We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give
yourself
> >credit for.
> >
> <sigh> At the risk of embarassing myself, this has been drilled into me by
my
> friends who are honest enough to send me home to re-coordinate my colors.

Some friends they are. A true friend would let you dress any way you
liked...

....on the basis you'd always make them look good by comparison. ;-)

> Whoda thunk Flourescent Orange and plum purple would create such a scene.
0;-D

Not me.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
> Purchgdss wrote:

<snip>

> >>>Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at
the
> >>>neighbors (or even your own!)
> >>
> >>Agreed again but is that an invitation?
> >
> > Sure! My backyard swing and sprinkler are always open to all! Heh,
maybe
> > instead of a meeting somewhere in the middle of North America where it's
cold,
> > we should all meet in the south in the summer for a swinging and
sprinkler
> > party. Embarass our teenagers and thrill our younger ones!.......
> >
> > Hey that could work! Someone loan me a younger child for a week so I
can
> > torment my Teen....
>
> Hmm... We live in The South - in Georgia, USA - in a semi-sub-tropical
> sort of climate. We have a swingset... A sprinkler... A 3-foot snap-set
> swimming pool... A dog to run with... and an acre-plus back yard. We do
> hay-rides with the lawn tractor and utility trailer, around Halloween.

So far so good.

> You can borrow my nine-year-old (as long as you have him back by
> bed-time)... And we ALWAYS have bubble stuff under the kitchen sink. :-)
> You wouldn't want to be here in high summer - temps run around 100
> degrees with 90+ % humidity during most of July and August - but April
> thru June and early September are usually perfect for sprinkler parties
> and cook-outs. :-)

Sounds like another good plan. Gonna be a busy year next year. :-))

<snip>

> >>>Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
> >>>can get.
> >>
> >>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give
yourself
> >>credit for.
> >
> > <sigh> At the risk of embarassing myself, this has been drilled into me
by my
> > friends who are honest enough to send me home to re-coordinate my
colors.
> > Whoda thunk Flourescent Orange and plum purple would create such a
scene. 0;-D
>
> Hey, at least you wear COLORS. I usually get sent home - if my friends
> can find me - because I'm wearing such blah colors that I fade into the
> background scenery. :-)

Spent much time in Special Forces have you?


--
Paul Griffiths

[Paul Griffiths]

"Cele" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 07:51:59 +0100, "Paul Griffiths"
> > wrote:
> >"Purchgdss" > wrote in message
> ...

<snip>

> >> >As a kid I used to think secrets were fun. These days I'm not so
sure.
> >> >Seems I grew up and got boring.
> >>
> >> Well get back to your roots MAN!
> >
> >I'll try and my roots aren't grey so maybe that'll make it easier.
>
> Show off!

You complaining?

> >> Being Child-LIKE is what keeps us from premature "oldness".
> >
> >I agree but how would you define premature?
>
> Before death.

I knew there was *some* reason that I like you so much.

> >> Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at
the
> >> neighbors (or even your own!)
> >
> >Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>
> Hold up a sec while I get my camera....

Can we stop holding now?

> ><snip>
> >
> >> >Hot pink waders? At the risk of talking stereotypes here, I think you
> >> >maybe looking for a gay fishing store. ;-)
> >>
> >> Well that could very well work..... I DO have a thing for the men ya
know.
> >> ;-D
> >
> >Which thing would that be exactly?
>
> Yes...do tell....

I'm still waiting. Are you still waiting, Cele?

> >> Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
> >> can get.
> >
> >We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give
yourself
> >credit for.
>
> You could post a pic, for general discussion....

Yeah we're good at that here.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Istara]

Paul Griffiths wrote:

> "Istara" > wrote in message
> . ..
>
>>Purchgdss wrote:
>
>
> <snip>
>
>>>>>Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at
>
> the
>
>>>>>neighbors (or even your own!)
>>>>
>>>>Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>>>
>>>Sure! My backyard swing and sprinkler are always open to all! Heh,
>
> maybe
>
>>>instead of a meeting somewhere in the middle of North America where it's
>
> cold,
>
>>>we should all meet in the south in the summer for a swinging and
>
> sprinkler
>
>>>party. Embarass our teenagers and thrill our younger ones!.......
>>>
>>>Hey that could work! Someone loan me a younger child for a week so I
>
> can
>
>>>torment my Teen....
>>
>>Hmm... We live in The South - in Georgia, USA - in a semi-sub-tropical
>>sort of climate. We have a swingset... A sprinkler... A 3-foot snap-set
>>swimming pool... A dog to run with... and an acre-plus back yard. We do
>>hay-rides with the lawn tractor and utility trailer, around Halloween.
>
>
> So far so good.
>
>
>>You can borrow my nine-year-old (as long as you have him back by
>>bed-time)... And we ALWAYS have bubble stuff under the kitchen sink. :-)
>>You wouldn't want to be here in high summer - temps run around 100
>>degrees with 90+ % humidity during most of July and August - but April
>>thru June and early September are usually perfect for sprinkler parties
>>and cook-outs. :-)
>
>
> Sounds like another good plan. Gonna be a busy year next year. :-))
>
> <snip>
>
>>>>>Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help I
>>>>>can get.
>>>>
>>>>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give
>
> yourself
>
>>>>credit for.
>>>
>>><sigh> At the risk of embarassing myself, this has been drilled into me
>
> by my
>
>>>friends who are honest enough to send me home to re-coordinate my
>
> colors.
>
>>>Whoda thunk Flourescent Orange and plum purple would create such a
>
> scene. 0;-D
>
>>Hey, at least you wear COLORS. I usually get sent home - if my friends
>>can find me - because I'm wearing such blah colors that I fade into the
>>background scenery. :-)
>
>
> Spent much time in Special Forces have you?
>
>
(grin) Nah... Used to be a jail officer. When you're a 5-foot 4-inch
female, dealing mainly with 6-foot-plus drunken males, with an
occasional violent offender coming along for variety, the ability to do
a quick-fade becomes a survival mechanism - they can't hit you if they
can't see you, but you can sure drop them if you can catch them by
surprise. Unfortunately, wearing a uniform so much of the time plays
hell with a person's off-duty fashion sense, especially when they didn't
have much to start with. :-) Which I didn't.

Now I get to wear hospital scrubs in bright colors and patterns,
starting next week... And am probably going to have to take someone
along shopping to avoid getting plain blah green. :-) Anybody wanna
going scrub shopping?

~ Dor

[Betsy]

"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
>
>
> Paul Griffiths wrote:
>
>> "Istara" > wrote in message
>> . ..
>>
>>>Purchgdss wrote:
>>
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>>>>Nothing better than a good swing at the park or a great sprinkler at
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>>>neighbors (or even your own!)
>>>>>
>>>>>Agreed again but is that an invitation?
>>>>
>>>>Sure! My backyard swing and sprinkler are always open to all! Heh,
>>
>> maybe
>>
>>>>instead of a meeting somewhere in the middle of North America where it's
>>
>> cold,
>>
>>>>we should all meet in the south in the summer for a swinging and
>>
>> sprinkler
>>
>>>>party. Embarass our teenagers and thrill our younger ones!.......
>>>>
>>>>Hey that could work! Someone loan me a younger child for a week so I
>>
>> can
>>
>>>>torment my Teen....
>>>
>>>Hmm... We live in The South - in Georgia, USA - in a semi-sub-tropical
>>>sort of climate. We have a swingset... A sprinkler... A 3-foot snap-set
>>>swimming pool... A dog to run with... and an acre-plus back yard. We do
>>>hay-rides with the lawn tractor and utility trailer, around Halloween.
>>
>>
>> So far so good.
>>
>>
>>>You can borrow my nine-year-old (as long as you have him back by
>>>bed-time)... And we ALWAYS have bubble stuff under the kitchen sink. :-)
>>>You wouldn't want to be here in high summer - temps run around 100
>>>degrees with 90+ % humidity during most of July and August - but April
>>>thru June and early September are usually perfect for sprinkler parties
>>>and cook-outs. :-)
>>
>>
>> Sounds like another good plan. Gonna be a busy year next year. :-))
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>>>>>Lord knows a ROCK has more fashion sense than I. I need all the help
>>>>>>I
>>>>>>can get.
>>>>>
>>>>>We only have your word for this. Maybe you're better than you give
>>
>> yourself
>>
>>>>>credit for.
>>>>
>>>><sigh> At the risk of embarassing myself, this has been drilled into me
>>
>> by my
>>
>>>>friends who are honest enough to send me home to re-coordinate my
>>
>> colors.
>>
>>>>Whoda thunk Flourescent Orange and plum purple would create such a
>>
>> scene. 0;-D
>>
>>>Hey, at least you wear COLORS. I usually get sent home - if my friends
>>>can find me - because I'm wearing such blah colors that I fade into the
>>>background scenery. :-)
>>
>>
>> Spent much time in Special Forces have you?
>>
>>
> (grin) Nah... Used to be a jail officer. When you're a 5-foot 4-inch
> female, dealing mainly with 6-foot-plus drunken males, with an occasional
> violent offender coming along for variety, the ability to do a quick-fade
> becomes a survival mechanism - they can't hit you if they can't see you,
> but you can sure drop them if you can catch them by surprise.
> Unfortunately, wearing a uniform so much of the time plays hell with a
> person's off-duty fashion sense, especially when they didn't have much to
> start with. :-) Which I didn't.
>
> Now I get to wear hospital scrubs in bright colors and patterns, starting
> next week... And am probably going to have to take someone along shopping
> to avoid getting plain blah green. :-) Anybody wanna going scrub shopping?
>
> ~ Dor
>

I will gladly lend you my expertise in this area. Being a nurse, having had
to wear "whites" during school, I went hog wild once I was allowed to wear
'anything that makes your patients smile.' My advice...stick with pastels;
lavender, teal, light blue. I wear plain colored slacks and multi
patterened tops. What type of office will you be working in? Helps to sort
what type of atmosphere to the kind of tops you wear. Being in Pediatric
homecare now, Scooby doo and pooh bear fit quite well. Lucky me!!

Betsy

[Istara]

Betsy wrote:
> "Istara" > wrote in message
> . ..
>
>>
>>Paul Griffiths wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
>>>
>>>
>>>>Purchgdss wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>><snip>
>>>
>>>
>>>Spent much time in Special Forces have you?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>(grin) Nah... Used to be a jail officer. When you're a 5-foot 4-inch
>>female, dealing mainly with 6-foot-plus drunken males, with an occasional
>>violent offender coming along for variety, the ability to do a quick-fade
>>becomes a survival mechanism - they can't hit you if they can't see you,
>>but you can sure drop them if you can catch them by surprise.
>>Unfortunately, wearing a uniform so much of the time plays hell with a
>>person's off-duty fashion sense, especially when they didn't have much to
>>start with. :-) Which I didn't.
>>
>>Now I get to wear hospital scrubs in bright colors and patterns, starting
>>next week... And am probably going to have to take someone along shopping
>>to avoid getting plain blah green. :-) Anybody wanna going scrub shopping?
>>
>>~ Dor
>>
>
>
> I will gladly lend you my expertise in this area. Being a nurse, having had
> to wear "whites" during school, I went hog wild once I was allowed to wear
> 'anything that makes your patients smile.' My advice...stick with pastels;
> lavender, teal, light blue. I wear plain colored slacks and multi
> patterened tops. What type of office will you be working in? Helps to sort
> what type of atmosphere to the kind of tops you wear. Being in Pediatric
> homecare now, Scooby doo and pooh bear fit quite well. Lucky me!!
>
> Betsy
>
>
I'll be in a satellite surgical center (say that six times fast!),
employed as Med Records Coordinator. I'll get to bounce around,
multi-task, cross-train and help out elsewhere as needed, I'm sure, but
my primary contact should be with staff more than patients. Make sure
notes are transcribed correctly; transcribe if someone hasn't already
done it. Check the lab sheets, check the pre-op notes, check that
insurance verification is done, check the schedule, get it all together
in proper order and ready to go first thing on surgery day... That sort
of stuff. I'm told it will be my happy privelege to politely request the
doctors please turn their notes in on time, so that transcription can be
done sometime before the patient kicks off from old age... :-) I'm a
non-threatening, fairly inoffensive-looking type, physically, more like
someone's favorite aunt that bakes cookies than anything else... I
should be good at this, right? :-) I was thinking darker bottoms with
light or patterned tops. The center is supposed to supply a jacket with
my name on it. (fancy, huh? :D) I'm gonna feel like such a fraud! :D But
it should be fun. Clogs, or sneakers?

~ Dor

[Betsy]

"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
>
>
> Betsy wrote:
>> "Istara" > wrote in message
>> . ..
>>
>>>
>>>Paul Griffiths wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Purchgdss wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>><snip>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Spent much time in Special Forces have you?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>(grin) Nah... Used to be a jail officer. When you're a 5-foot 4-inch
>>>female, dealing mainly with 6-foot-plus drunken males, with an occasional
>>>violent offender coming along for variety, the ability to do a quick-fade
>>>becomes a survival mechanism - they can't hit you if they can't see you,
>>>but you can sure drop them if you can catch them by surprise.
>>>Unfortunately, wearing a uniform so much of the time plays hell with a
>>>person's off-duty fashion sense, especially when they didn't have much to
>>>start with. :-) Which I didn't.
>>>
>>>Now I get to wear hospital scrubs in bright colors and patterns, starting
>>>next week... And am probably going to have to take someone along shopping
>>>to avoid getting plain blah green. :-) Anybody wanna going scrub
>>>shopping?
>>>
>>>~ Dor
>>>
>>
>>
>> I will gladly lend you my expertise in this area. Being a nurse, having
>> had to wear "whites" during school, I went hog wild once I was allowed to
>> wear 'anything that makes your patients smile.' My advice...stick with
>> pastels; lavender, teal, light blue. I wear plain colored slacks and
>> multi patterened tops. What type of office will you be working in?
>> Helps to sort what type of atmosphere to the kind of tops you wear.
>> Being in Pediatric homecare now, Scooby doo and pooh bear fit quite well.
>> Lucky me!!
>>
>> Betsy
> I'll be in a satellite surgical center (say that six times fast!),
> employed as Med Records Coordinator. I'll get to bounce around,
> multi-task, cross-train and help out elsewhere as needed, I'm sure, but my
> primary contact should be with staff more than patients. Make sure notes
> are transcribed correctly; transcribe if someone hasn't already done it.
> Check the lab sheets, check the pre-op notes, check that insurance
> verification is done, check the schedule, get it all together in proper
> order and ready to go first thing on surgery day... That sort of stuff.
> I'm told it will be my happy privelege to politely request the doctors
> please turn their notes in on time, so that transcription can be done
> sometime before the patient kicks off from old age... :-) I'm a
> non-threatening, fairly inoffensive-looking type, physically, more like
> someone's favorite aunt that bakes cookies than anything else... I should
> be good at this, right? :-) I was thinking darker bottoms with light or
> patterned tops. The center is supposed to supply a jacket with my name on
> it. (fancy, huh? :D) I'm gonna feel like such a fraud! :D But it should be
> fun. Clogs, or sneakers?
>
> ~ Dor
>

Surgery...the one place I never worked. LOL! I think you have the scrubs
figured out OK. As for the shoes...whatever you feel comfortable in, you
should wear. No sense wearing shoes that hurt your feet. Some places
prefer you wear white shoes...others don't have a preference. Good Luck to
you!

Betsy

[Paul Griffiths]

"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
> Paul Griffiths wrote:
> > "Istara" > wrote in message
> > . ..

<snip>

> >>Hey, at least you wear COLORS. I usually get sent home - if my friends
> >>can find me - because I'm wearing such blah colors that I fade into the
> >>background scenery. :-)
> >
> > Spent much time in Special Forces have you?
> >
> (grin) Nah... Used to be a jail officer. When you're a 5-foot 4-inch
> female, dealing mainly with 6-foot-plus drunken males, with an
> occasional violent offender coming along for variety, the ability to do
> a quick-fade becomes a survival mechanism - they can't hit you if they
> can't see you, but you can sure drop them if you can catch them by
> surprise.

Ooeer!

I'll just make a note of that for possible future reference, if you don't
mind.

> Unfortunately, wearing a uniform so much of the time plays hell with
> a person's off-duty fashion sense, especially when they didn't have
> much to start with. :-) Which I didn't.

Yeah I can see how that would work.

> Now I get to wear hospital scrubs in bright colors and patterns,
> starting next week... And am probably going to have to take someone
> along shopping to avoid getting plain blah green. :-) Anybody wanna
> going scrub shopping?

No thanks. Nothing personal but I have more than enough memories of
hospitals as it is.

Bright colours and patterns sounds like fun though.


--
Paul Griffiths

[Istara]

Paul Griffiths wrote:
> "Istara" > wrote in message
> . ..
>
>>Paul Griffiths wrote:
>>
>>>"Istara" > wrote in message
. ..
>
>
> <snip>
>
>>>>Hey, at least you wear COLORS. I usually get sent home - if my friends
>>>>can find me - because I'm wearing such blah colors that I fade into the
>>>>background scenery. :-)
>>>
>>>Spent much time in Special Forces have you?
>>>
>>
>>(grin) Nah... Used to be a jail officer. When you're a 5-foot 4-inch
>>female, dealing mainly with 6-foot-plus drunken males, with an
>>occasional violent offender coming along for variety, the ability to do
>>a quick-fade becomes a survival mechanism - they can't hit you if they
>>can't see you, but you can sure drop them if you can catch them by
>>surprise.
>
>
> Ooeer!
>
> I'll just make a note of that for possible future reference, if you don't
> mind.
>

Hehehehe... What I used to tell inmates, during in-processing - "You'll
find that I am just as nice as you will let me be. Behave, and we'll get
along just fine. Give me trouble and you'll wish you'd never met me." :-)

I generally had less trouble out of people than any of the other
jailers, though, barring our sergeant - who also was a short,
"Mom"-looking sort of person.

>
>>Unfortunately, wearing a uniform so much of the time plays hell with
>>a person's off-duty fashion sense, especially when they didn't have
>>much to start with. :-) Which I didn't.
>
>
> Yeah I can see how that would work.
>
>
>>Now I get to wear hospital scrubs in bright colors and patterns,
>>starting next week... And am probably going to have to take someone
>>along shopping to avoid getting plain blah green. :-) Anybody wanna
>>going scrub shopping?
>
>
> No thanks. Nothing personal but I have more than enough memories of
> hospitals as it is.
>
> Bright colours and patterns sounds like fun though.
>
I've had my share of time spent in hospitals, too. Never in but once for
myself (and that was childbirth, what can I say?), but I've spent more
nights than I care to count sitting watch in the cardiac unit, and the
ER, and such. I'd probably have some trouble adjusting if I had to work
in the main hospital itself, but this is a satellite clinic, day-surgery
unit with no extended care facility on premises.

And the colors and stuff DO sound fun, don't they? I talked to my
supervisor yesterday - she said the don't coordinate uniform, anymore,
so get whatever I liked.