Are you living in the neighborhood hangout?

[chiam margalit]

Lately our house has become the neighborhood hangout for my son's
friends. While I LIKE that he has friends, they appear to have moved
in. Morning, noon, and night they're here. Every figgin' day they're
here. And I can't figure out why. I'm not particularly pleasant to
them, I don't offer them food if I can help it, we have no video
games, no plasma TV, and I don't let them near the internet computer.
But they don't seem to care.

Since I've never been the hangout mom before, I don't know what rules
I'm supposed to impose. I don't have to feed them, right? I can ask
them to clean up their messes, right? I can toss them out at
dinnertime.

But what else can I do or not do? Can I yell at them if they're
jumping off the porch railing? (I have, several times.) Can I make
them go home if they're playing on the roof? When I smell matches
burning, can I go ballistic?

I'm not trying to be the 'cool mom'. That's a lost cause. I just want
enough peace and quiet to be able to hear myself think. Man, boys are
LOUD.

Marjorie

[just me]

"chiam margalit" > wrote in message
...
> Lately our house has become the neighborhood hangout for my son's
> friends. While I LIKE that he has friends, they appear to have moved
> in. Morning, noon, and night they're here. Every figgin' day they're
> here. And I can't figure out why. I'm not particularly pleasant to
> them, I don't offer them food if I can help it, we have no video
> games, no plasma TV, and I don't let them near the internet computer.
> But they don't seem to care.
>
> Since I've never been the hangout mom before, I don't know what rules
> I'm supposed to impose. I don't have to feed them, right? I can ask
> them to clean up their messes, right? I can toss them out at
> dinnertime.
>
> But what else can I do or not do? Can I yell at them if they're
> jumping off the porch railing? (I have, several times.) Can I make
> them go home if they're playing on the roof? When I smell matches
> burning, can I go ballistic?
>
> I'm not trying to be the 'cool mom'. That's a lost cause. I just want
> enough peace and quiet to be able to hear myself think. Man, boys are
> LOUD.
>


Boy do I hear you! Boys are loud and gaggles of them are very very noisy!
Hang in there. In my opinion, the best type of neighborhood mom, or at
least mom as a host, is the one who sets reasonable limits and enforces
them, while being fair to all present. Be clear what the rules are, let
them know where the cold water is, as well as the bathroom, and insist
everything is straightened up reasonably before people go home. If you do
that, they will respect you, particularly if you take the occassional minute
to say "hi" and listen if one of them seems to need to vent or share
something. Ofcourse, that may well promote you to permament neighborhood
mom. Considering the benefit of knowing what your kid[s] are doing because
they are doing it at home, this might not be such a terrible thing, if you
can keep the volume reasonable most of the time.

/passes Marjorie the ear plugs and a great book.

-Aula

[Louise]

In article >,
(chiam margalit) wrote:

>Since I've never been the hangout mom before, I don't know what rules
>I'm supposed to impose. I don't have to feed them, right? I can ask
>them to clean up their messes, right? I can toss them out at
>dinnertime.
>
>But what else can I do or not do? Can I yell at them if they're
>jumping off the porch railing? (I have, several times.) Can I make
>them go home if they're playing on the roof? When I smell matches
>burning, can I go ballistic?

Whatever is getting on your nerves or is likely to, on any particular
day. You don't mention how your daughter is affected by all this - it
can get tricky if the other kid misses having a quiet house or
choosing the TV show, or if her brother's friends don't treat her
courteously.

Our experience is mostly with older teenagers, and probably the most
attractive factors for this local crowd are location and our
not-fancy, not-tidy house where kids can sprawl over the furniture and
sleep on the floor.

You will discover (if you haven't already) that some kids are good at
taking behaviour/courtesy hints, and more are not. Many of the ones
who didn't take hints a few years ago have actually learned a lot
about our house rules and expectations because we point them out
explicitly. ("Please be quiet in the hallway because the sound
carries up the stairs." "Could you please adjust your tongue jewelry
in the bathroom, not here where I'm eating breakfast?" "Actually, no,
she's in bed, you'd be more likely to catch her if you come before X
o'clock." "There's a garbage can for that right behind the door, and a
recycle bin under the sink." "Someone is asleep upstairs, so the TV
should be quiet and the door closed." )

The main advantage is getting to know a lot about the kids ours hang
out with. Our kids always introduce the new visitors to us and vice
versa (that's been an expectation for a long time) and we can't help
seeing and hearing a lot about what they're up to.

Louise

[chiam margalit]

"Ann Porter" > wrote in message >...
> "chiam margalit" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> > I'm not trying to be the 'cool mom'. That's a lost cause. I just want
> > enough peace and quiet to be able to hear myself think. Man, boys are
> > LOUD.
>
> M., I've nothing to say that will be remotely helpful, as I've never been
> the hangout house either. But this is the funniest thing I've read in days.
> I have this mental image of you, surrounded by hoards of bouncing boys, with
> a bewildered frown on your face...

Glad you found some humor in the situation. It's 2:01 am and one of
those boys is STILL up. I've separated them, I've got my two kids on
the floor in my bedroom, but this friend.... he appears to run on
rocket fuel. The kid sleeps all day and stays up all night. No wonder
he misses the bus every morning!

Today I had to yell "we do not rollerblade to the bathroom, boys", and
"WHY are you all locked in the basement?" and "If you scream out the
window on more time I'm going to call the police and have them have a
long chat with you about disturbing the peace." (This was about 3
minutes before our nutty neighbor came over to complain that the boys
were yelling phony phone call stuff out the window!)

I'm telling you, I am so not cool. My own kids are more than enough.
Who needs a bunch of jet fueled, testosterone laden preteens in my
house? Not me!

Marjorie
>
> I've had friends who have run the hangout house before, but they were always
> the cool moms. I never was, either.
>
> What a hoot. I guess it's a good thing (you know where they are and what
> they're doing, at least). But I hope you make it through the holiday
> weekend!
>
> Best,
> Ann

[Ann Porter]

"chiam margalit" > wrote in message
om...

> Glad you found some humor in the situation. It's 2:01 am and one of
> those boys is STILL up. I've separated them, I've got my two kids on
> the floor in my bedroom, but this friend.... he appears to run on
> rocket fuel. The kid sleeps all day and stays up all night. No wonder
> he misses the bus every morning!

Sorry, 'bout that. Some sitcoms are funny, too, but I wouldn't want to be
living one. Maybe, in the immortal words of Bruce Springsteen, "Someday
[you'll] look back on this and it will all seem funny."

But right now, if the weather is nice, perhaps you could shoo them outside
during the daytime? Set aside Saturday as a day of rest/no guests allowed?
Only permit overnights once a month?

It's still your house, and you can set boundaries. Maybe discuss them with
your kids.

I second the person who wanted to know how your daughter is dealing with all
this. I had three brothers, and they travelled in a "pack" with about eight
other guys. I spent a LOT of time in my room, reading.

Let us know what shakes out.

Best,
Ann

[Iowacookiemom]

Ann wrote:
>It's still your house, and you can set boundaries. Maybe discuss them with
>your kids

Yeah, sounds like family meeting time with me -- IME kids respond to rules
better (both in sticking to them and in doing so cheerfully) if they had a role
in setting them. I wonder if Marjorie set out the scenario ("I'm happy that
your friends want to be here, that says a lot about wht kind of friend you are
and I'm proud of that. The new situation is causing some problems and we need
to come up with some solutions together. What would you suggest?") and then
listened to proposed solutions. If her daughter is feeling affected, she could
be part of the meeting too (although I'd want to be sure that the son and more
importantly the friends are aware the rules idea was Mom's not daughter's).

As family problems go, this is a good problem to have, IME. No less
frustrating, but the flip -- child never goes out, appears to have no friends
and/or child is always over at someone else's house, doesn't seem to want to be
at home -- seem much worse to me.

Was it Erma Bombeck who wrote that litany of "why don't you grow up?"
statements, increasing in frustration, that ended with "and the silence
answered, 'I did.'"? Maybe a good time to remember that too.

TTSP. Congrats on raising a kid who seems to be a natural host, Marjorie!

-Dawn
Mom to Henry, 10

[Kevin Karplus]

In article >, just me wrote:
> "chiam margalit" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I'm not trying to be the 'cool mom'. That's a lost cause. I just want
>> enough peace and quiet to be able to hear myself think. Man, boys are
>> LOUD.

> Boy do I hear you! Boys are loud and gaggles of them are very very noisy!

Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud. My seven-year-old
son is one of the quiet ones---I generally have to look all over when
I want to find him, as his favorite reading place changes from time to
time.

We had packs of kids running through our house BEFORE we had any kids
of our own, but that stopped after the neighborhood kids grew up a
bit. Now we generally only have one kid over at time, though random
arrivals occasional give us a fuller house (we've had as many as 5
kids without prearrangement, but it's rare). Things do get a bit
noisier when certain friends visit, but for the most part my son
prefers relatively quiet activities (board games and card games, for
example) and chooses friends who like them also.

You can set reasonable rules in the house. If you've become the
"hangout house", you really have to set some rules (like quiet-hour,
curfew, homework, and clean-up rules). If I remember right, Marjorie
is Jewish, so it might be appropriate to set stricter rules for the
Sabbath. You can negotiate these rules with your kids (at a time when
there is not a lot of neighborhood kids in the house), but you should
think about your position on various behaviors before starting the
negotiation, so you know where you are willing to compromise and where
not.

--
Kevin Karplus http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus
life member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)
Professor of Computer Engineering, University of California, Santa Cruz
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics
Affiliations for identification only.

[chiam margalit]

"Ann Porter" > wrote in message >...
> "chiam margalit" > wrote in message
> om...
>
> > Glad you found some humor in the situation. It's 2:01 am and one of
> > those boys is STILL up. I've separated them, I've got my two kids on
> > the floor in my bedroom, but this friend.... he appears to run on
> > rocket fuel. The kid sleeps all day and stays up all night. No wonder
> > he misses the bus every morning!
>
> Sorry, 'bout that. Some sitcoms are funny, too, but I wouldn't want to be
> living one. Maybe, in the immortal words of Bruce Springsteen, "Someday
> [you'll] look back on this and it will all seem funny."
>
> But right now, if the weather is nice, perhaps you could shoo them outside
> during the daytime? Set aside Saturday as a day of rest/no guests allowed?
> Only permit overnights once a month?
>

They were out rollerblading all afternoon (didn't wake up till noon!).
I couldn't take any more time with them. I shooed one kid home and he
came back an hour later. I pointedly told him he HAS a home, go and
renew his aquaintance with it! :-)

> It's still your house, and you can set boundaries. Maybe discuss them with
> your kids.
>
> I second the person who wanted to know how your daughter is dealing with all
> this. I had three brothers, and they travelled in a "pack" with about eight
> other guys. I spent a LOT of time in my room, reading.

She's the same age as her brother, and she's one of the pack if
allowed. She loves hanging out with boys anyhow, she has more in
common with the wild guy thing than the girly girl thing. BUT...and
this is a huge issue for me, one of the boys has a big crush on her,
and I'm not clear that she knows how to say "no". He has already
kissed her once, which both kids duly reported within seconds. Talk
about trying to keep my anger in check and NOT kill this boy. I did
talk to him about respect, but it's a lost cause. Like many kids
today, he's got no active parent watching over him and he's got little
impluse control. He's not a "bad" kid, but his behaviour leaves a lot
to be desired. I know it's the teen thing. I get all of that and I'm
trying really hard to put up with it, but what I really want to do,
deep down, is KILL THIS KID. :-) :-)

There, I've said it! :-)

Boarding school is looking better and better all the time. I've check
out a couple, and man... I'm liking what I see. :-)

Marjorie
>
> Let us know what shakes out.
>
> Best,
> Ann

[just me]

"chiam margalit" > wrote in message
om...
> Yup, that's pretty much what I'm going to do. I've got a short list,
> but I'm sure I'm forgetting a bunch. What would YOUR rules be for a
> bunch of 12-13 yo boys, besides the obvious no smoking, drugs, or
> alcohol?


I'd make it pretty clear what the rules about raiding the kitchen were so
diner was not accidentally eaten two days early for snack. Depending on my
children I might also continue with my current rule: the doors all stay
open except the bathroom when in use. Oh, yes, and everyone shares in the
pick up of the mess, not the abandoned host.

-Aula

[Rosalie B.]

"just me" > wrote:

>
>"chiam margalit" > wrote in message
om...
>> Yup, that's pretty much what I'm going to do. I've got a short list,
>> but I'm sure I'm forgetting a bunch. What would YOUR rules be for a
>> bunch of 12-13 yo boys, besides the obvious no smoking, drugs, or
>> alcohol?
>
>
>I'd make it pretty clear what the rules about raiding the kitchen were so
>diner was not accidentally eaten two days early for snack. Depending on my
>children I might also continue with my current rule: the doors all stay
>open except the bathroom when in use. Oh, yes, and everyone shares in the
>pick up of the mess, not the abandoned host.
>
Except your daughter's door which she can close and no male person is
allowed in there.

A requirement that all boys check in with you and be introduced at
least the first time they visit you, giving you home phone numbers,
etc.

I might add curfew times - i.e. times when they are allowed to be
there. So that they go home at night. Possibly also telephone hours.

And maybe also a load restriction as to the number of non-related
persons allowed in the house at one time. But that's kind of an iffy
one.


grandma Rosalie

[dragonlady]

In article >,
"Ann Porter" > wrote:

> "chiam margalit" > wrote in message
> > Yup, that's pretty much what I'm going to do. I've got a short list,
> > but I'm sure I'm forgetting a bunch. What would YOUR rules be for a
> > bunch of 12-13 yo boys, besides the obvious no smoking, drugs, or
> > alcohol?
>
> No running in the house.
>
> No yelling in the house.
>
> Pick up your mess before you leave.
>
> Dinner time is family only - they need to go home unless I've approved a
> dinner invitation beforehand.
>

My rule on this one is different: if you are in our house at dinner
time, you are expected to sit down and have dinner with us.

Obviously, I expect kids to call home to make sure it's OK with their
parents, but it's been amazing how much better I've been able to get to
know some of my kids' friends as my kids have moved through their teen
years with this particular rule.

Sometimes, kids have told me they aren't hungry, so they'll just wait in
the bedroom while we eat. I let them know that I don't really care if
they eat -- but not sitting down to the dinner table with us is NOT an
option.

> Here are the "help yourself" snacks and there is the faucet. Anything else,
> ask first.
>
> Say "please" and "thank you."
>
> Best,
> Ann
>
>
>
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

[Jeff]

"Kevin Karplus" > wrote in message
...

(...)

>
> Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
> hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud.

You obviously have not met my 6-year old neice and her friends. They can be
VERT LOUD.

Jeff

[Scott Lindstrom]

Jeff wrote:
> "Kevin Karplus" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> (...)
>
>
>>Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
>>hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud.
>
>
> You obviously have not met my 6-year old neice and her friends. They can be
> VERY LOUD.

I was also going to mention this. My 10-yo and her friends
can easily out-decibel any group of boys just on squealing
alone ;)

Scott DD 10 and DS 7

[Louise]

In article >, "Jeff"
> wrote:

>
>"Kevin Karplus" > wrote in message
...
>
>(...)
>
>>
>> Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
>> hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud.
>
>You obviously have not met my 6-year old neice and her friends. They can be
>VERT LOUD

I don't think that Kevin was saying "girls aren't loud" or "boys are
louder than girls" -- and I don't think Marjorie was either,
necessarily.

It's funny how easy it is to assume statements about boys are meant
"... in comparison to girls..." instead of "in comparison to adults"
or "in comparison to me" or "in comparison to my kid".

It's like saying "Canadians are X.". A friend demonstrated to me that
if she says "Canadians are X" to a bunch of Canadians, most of them/us
assume she means "Canadians are X in comparison to Americans".


Louise

[Jayne Kulikauskas]

"Louise" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, "Jeff"
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >"Kevin Karplus" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> >(...)
> >
> >>
> >> Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
> >> hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud.
> >
> >You obviously have not met my 6-year old neice and her friends. They can
be
> >VERT LOUD
>
> I don't think that Kevin was saying "girls aren't loud" or "boys are
> louder than girls" -- and I don't think Marjorie was either,
> necessarily.
>
> It's funny how easy it is to assume statements about boys are meant
> "... in comparison to girls..." instead of "in comparison to adults"
> or "in comparison to me" or "in comparison to my kid".
>
> It's like saying "Canadians are X.". A friend demonstrated to me that
> if she says "Canadians are X" to a bunch of Canadians, most of them/us
> assume she means "Canadians are X in comparison to Americans".

But that is just the nature of being Canadian. Our national identity is
based on comparing ourselves to Americans. Do you really think the boy/girl
thing is as extreme as that?

Jayne

[Scott Lindstrom]

Jayne Kulikauskas wrote:
> "Louise" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>In article >, "Jeff"
> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Kevin Karplus" > wrote in message
...
>>>
>>>(...)
>>>
>>>
>>>>Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
>>>>hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud.
>>>
>>>You obviously have not met my 6-year old neice and her friends. They can
>
> be
>
>>>VERT LOUD
>>
>>I don't think that Kevin was saying "girls aren't loud" or "boys are
>>louder than girls" -- and I don't think Marjorie was either,
>>necessarily.
>>
>>It's funny how easy it is to assume statements about boys are meant
>>"... in comparison to girls..." instead of "in comparison to adults"
>>or "in comparison to me" or "in comparison to my kid".
>>
>>It's like saying "Canadians are X.". A friend demonstrated to me that
>>if she says "Canadians are X" to a bunch of Canadians, most of them/us
>>assume she means "Canadians are X in comparison to Americans".
>
>
> But that is just the nature of being Canadian. Our national identity is
> based on comparing ourselves to Americans. Do you really think the boy/girl
> thing is as extreme as that?


I've only been glancing through this thread, but somewhere
I also picked up a definite Boys compared to Girls slant
to a post, author unknown.

As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
in my observations.

Scott DD 10 and DS 7

[dragonlady]

In article >,
David desJardins > wrote:

> Scott Lindstrom writes:
> > As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
> > parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
> > There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
> > in my observations.
>
> I think parents of children of the same sex, even twins, often find
> there's a "world of difference" between them, too. People are all
> different.
>
> I also think it's interesting that several people have remarked on their
> boys having other boys over, and their girls having other girls over.
> Is there more of this sort of sex segregation than when I was young, or
> is it a cultural thing? I don't think I was particularly more likely to
> have boys as friends than girls.
>
> David desJardins
>

The extent to which some parents encourage only same-sex friendships
from a very early age has both surprised and discouraged me. As a
parent of b/g twins, it was extremely obvious: even at the age of 3,
when a neighbor girl -- someone they both played with -- had a birthday
party, only my daughter was invited. I don't think the mother even
realized that she discouraged her daughter from having male friends --
it was just the way she did things. (She was somewhat apologetic, but
"knew" I'd understand, since my son would obviously not be comfortable
in a party with only girls. It was not the first time I had to decide
how to handle something like that!)

Many parents put a "romantic" tilt to opposite sex friendships; even
when my oldest was still a toddler, when she and a little boy were
obviously glad to see each other and hugged the way toddlers do, the
other parents said, "isn't that cute -- his first girl friend!" (I
wanted to throw up.)

I'm not so sure that it has changed that much, though. I know when I
was in elementary school, friendships with boys were discouraged:
sometimes, we weren't even allowed to play in the same area of the
playground, and most kids played only with other kids the same sex they
were. OTOH, I think you are much younger than I am (I'm 51) and there
may have been a brief, shining moment when people were more enlightened!

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

[Scott Lindstrom]

David desJardins wrote:
> Scott Lindstrom writes:
>
>>As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
>>parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
>>There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
>>in my observations.
>
>
> I think parents of children of the same sex, even twins, often find
> there's a "world of difference" between them, too. People are all
> different.
>
> I also think it's interesting that several people have remarked on their
> boys having other boys over, and their girls having other girls over.
> Is there more of this sort of sex segregation than when I was young, or
> is it a cultural thing? I don't think I was particularly more likely to
> have boys as friends than girls.

DD had boys over once or twice -- in kindergarten
a boy classmate lived across the street. The
vast majority of friends over was girls. I think
the boy/girl distinction for DD became very clear
in 1st grade. Her bday party after kindergarten
(she's a summer b-day) included boys. That was the
last one.

DS is about split boy/girl for friends coming
over, but the only one girl who comes over
(very frequently) is quite the tom-boy. He
invites a variety of boys over. DS has a winter
b-day, and I expect he'll invite girls to it,
although some of his friends have had girls-only
birthdays.

Scott DD 10 and DS 7

[Rosalie B.]

dragonlady > wrote:

>In article >,
> David desJardins > wrote:
>
>> Scott Lindstrom writes:
>> > As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
>> > parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
>> > There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
>> > in my observations.
>>
>> I think parents of children of the same sex, even twins, often find
>> there's a "world of difference" between them, too. People are all
>> different.
>>
>> I also think it's interesting that several people have remarked on their
>> boys having other boys over, and their girls having other girls over.
>> Is there more of this sort of sex segregation than when I was young, or
>> is it a cultural thing? I don't think I was particularly more likely to
>> have boys as friends than girls.
>>
>> David desJardins
>>
>
>The extent to which some parents encourage only same-sex friendships
>from a very early age has both surprised and discouraged me. As a
>parent of b/g twins, it was extremely obvious: even at the age of 3,
>when a neighbor girl -- someone they both played with -- had a birthday
>party, only my daughter was invited. I don't think the mother even
>realized that she discouraged her daughter from having male friends --
>it was just the way she did things. (She was somewhat apologetic, but
>"knew" I'd understand, since my son would obviously not be comfortable
>in a party with only girls. It was not the first time I had to decide
>how to handle something like that!)
>
>Many parents put a "romantic" tilt to opposite sex friendships; even
>when my oldest was still a toddler, when she and a little boy were
>obviously glad to see each other and hugged the way toddlers do, the
>other parents said, "isn't that cute -- his first girl friend!" (I
>wanted to throw up.)

When I was in elementary school, my mom would tell me that the boys
who would hit me with their book bags really liked me. It always
seemed a funny way to show it though. On the playground, we girls did
hopscotch and jump rope and AFAI remember, none of the boys did that.
I did have a boy who declared himself my 'boyfriend' in third grade,
which I thought was a bit silly of him, and I really didn't know how
to react to it.

By the time I was 12, I was being 'stalked' by the boy down the street
who had a complete list of my entire wardrobe (he'd hide and make
notes when I left the house) but he was best friends with my tomboy
friend and would give her notes to give to me. [One of them started
out "Big Brother is Watching You" - this was c 1949.
>
>I'm not so sure that it has changed that much, though. I know when I
>was in elementary school, friendships with boys were discouraged:
>sometimes, we weren't even allowed to play in the same area of the
>playground, and most kids played only with other kids the same sex they
>were. OTOH, I think you are much younger than I am (I'm 51) and there
>may have been a brief, shining moment when people were more enlightened!

In my day (I'm 65) there were girls that played with the boys - they
were called tomboys. I had a best friend who was really into sports,
and she was a bit of a tomboy. I never was as I was pretty much a
klutz although I thought a lot of girls were pretty silly about things
like spiders etc.

When my kids were pre-school children, they played with whoever lived
close by or with children of friends regardless of sex. It was boys
as often as girls.

When we lived in Key West (dd#1 age 5-7 and dd#2 age 3-5) dd#2 played
with the little boy down the street and dd#1 played with a girl on the
street. Neither of those children went to school with my kids, and
dd#1 did NOT play with the older sister of the playmate of dd#2
because Amber just wasn't her kind of kid - just as I was better
friends with dd#1's playmate than I was of Amber's mom.

DD#3 OTOH had a good friend all the way through school from K on that
was a boy - never romantic - just a friend. It happened though, that
he was one of the children where we kept our horses, and they rode and
competed together all the way through grade school. His older sisters
were also friends of the older girls.


grandma Rosalie

[Penny Gaines]

David desJardins wrote in >:
[snip]
> I also think it's interesting that several people have remarked on their
> boys having other boys over, and their girls having other girls over.
> Is there more of this sort of sex segregation than when I was young, or
> is it a cultural thing? I don't think I was particularly more likely to
> have boys as friends than girls.

Really? I think by the time I was 7yo, I definately had more girls as
friends then boys.

--
Penny Gaines
UK mum to three

[H Schinske]

wrote:

>As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
>parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
>There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
>in my observations.

But if you had a second of either sex who happened to be of a different
temperament than its same-sex sibling, you might feel differently. I have a boy
and two girls, and it seems to me that the differences between the two girls
are at least as great as between either girl and the boy.

I'm willing to admit there may possibly be a different *average* point for
various behaviors in male and female children (that *more* boys than girls do
A, *more* girls than boys do B, etc.). I just think the overlap of behaviors
normal in either sex is enormously greater than most people seem to think.

--Helen

[just me]

"David desJardins" > wrote in message
...
> I think parents of children of the same sex, even twins, often find
> there's a "world of difference" between them, too. People are all
> different.
>
> I also think it's interesting that several people have remarked on their
> boys having other boys over, and their girls having other girls over.
> Is there more of this sort of sex segregation than when I was young, or
> is it a cultural thing? I don't think I was particularly more likely to
> have boys as friends than girls.


I've noticed that when DS has only male friends over the noise level is more
constant. I've also noticed that when it is a mixed group, even just Ds and
a girl visitor, the boys tend to be louder *longer*, but the girls have
shriller loud sounds, which can be grating to me. Good thing we just have
one child, so I can get some peace and quite at least once a year! lol

-Aula

[Jayne Kulikauskas]

"H Schinske" > wrote in message
...
> wrote:
>
> >As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
> >parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
> >There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
> >in my observations.
>
> But if you had a second of either sex who happened to be of a different
> temperament than its same-sex sibling, you might feel differently. I have
a boy
> and two girls, and it seems to me that the differences between the two
girls
> are at least as great as between either girl and the boy.
>
> I'm willing to admit there may possibly be a different *average* point for
> various behaviors in male and female children (that *more* boys than girls
do
> A, *more* girls than boys do B, etc.). I just think the overlap of
behaviors
> normal in either sex is enormously greater than most people seem to think.

Exactly. I've noticed that people with a boy and a girl tend to attribute
the differences between their children to gender. I have seven children and
I can't think of any gender-based patterns among my children. I have
extroverted, introverted, loud, quiet, athletic, artistic, sensitive, brave,
etc. children and I can't see any relationship to whether they are boys or
girls.

Jayne

[chiam margalit]

Louise > wrote in message >...
> In article >, "Jeff"
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >"Kevin Karplus" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> >(...)
> >
> >>
> >> Not all boys are loud---though some certainly are, and the ones that
> >> hang out in big packs seem more likely to be loud.
> >
> >You obviously have not met my 6-year old neice and her friends. They can be
> >VERT LOUD
>
> I don't think that Kevin was saying "girls aren't loud" or "boys are
> louder than girls" -- and I don't think Marjorie was either,
> necessarily.


No, I couldn't possibly. BOTH of my kids have only one volume,
screaming. They don't talk...they just yell. But they are *nothing*
compared to one of my son's friends, who is so loud that you can hear
him in the very back of a store the second you walk in the front. He's
amazingly loud. Absolutely no volume control whatsoever.

I think I'd amend my statements to say all preteens are very loud.
It's the nature of the 'notice me' behaviour that is so rampant at
this age. Anyone who has spent time working with middle school kids
can attest they are really unbelievably loud.

Marjorie

[chiam margalit]

Elizabeth Gardner > wrote in message >...
> In article >,
> David desJardins > wrote:
>
> > Scott Lindstrom writes:
> > > As the parent of a boy and a girl, I do find sometimes that
> > > parents of children of only one sex have very limited views ;)
> > > There is a WORLD of difference between the two, at least
> > > in my observations.
> >
> > I think parents of children of the same sex, even twins, often find
> > there's a "world of difference" between them, too. People are all
> > different.
> >
> > I also think it's interesting that several people have remarked on their
> > boys having other boys over, and their girls having other girls over.
> > Is there more of this sort of sex segregation than when I was young, or
> > is it a cultural thing? I don't think I was particularly more likely to
> > have boys as friends than girls.
> >
>
>
> I think it's an age thing. Your kids may not have hit the opposite sex
> cooties stage yet, but IME more kids do than don't, round about K or
> first grade. My daughter is in second grade, and it's very pronounced.
> She has friends who are boys, but they're either kids she's known since
> the cradle (ergo, more brotherlike) or kids who aren't in her class at
> school (they're older, or go to different schools, and she knows them
> through us or through outside activities). Making new "pal-around" type
> friends of the opposite sex within the school social group seems to be
> against the unwritten law, at least at this age. It was so when I was
> in first grade also. I lost my best friend because he was a boy and
> wouldn't play with me anymore, lest the other boys give him a hard time.
> By fourth grade, there was some boy-girl interaction.

I don't know if it's an age thing, or just a thing that certain kids
choose to do. The daughter of a good friend of mine has just entered
4th grade. She's 9. EVERY time our families get together she wants my
daughter to play "chase the boys" and every time my daughter complains
vociferously about the stupidity of this game. They were just over
last weekend and it happened again and my daughter said, "I haven't
chased boys since I was in kindergarten. You're TOO OLD for this kind
of game." I highly doubt it will stop this girl, since this seems to
be the essence of her existance, but I did think it rather amazing
that my daughter insisted on not getting into it, since it just
antagonizes the two boys.

So, I do think that it is more rampant in a certain personality trait,
and not really an 'all girls/all boys' kind of thing.

Marjorie