lead hazard in apparently all Christmas lights

[andrea baker]

Hi folks,

For those of you who were around in misc.kids back before
misc.kids.moderated was formed, I had posted a few times about
commercialism at Christmas. This post is not about that, but I would
like to do a little prefacing here for anyone who might wonder why I,
of all people (given my prior postings), was going to be buying
Christmas tree lights <grin>.

Through the years, as I've aged and become more moderate (as seems to
happen to many people; I no longer have all the answers as I did a
decade ago ;-)) I've become less adamant regarding no commercialism of
Christmas, and this year, for the first year ever, I got a tree. I
went to Shopko to get some Christmas lights, but every single package
had a lead warning on it, telling people that the lights contained
lead, and that one should wash one's hands after putting them up.
Needless to say, I went without.

I started thinking about whether the lights we used when I was a kid
also had lead, and eventually decided that the only reasonable
conclusion is that in the bad old days, the lights also had lead, but
just weren't labeled. So when you go to put up those lights, think
twice! Lead can be absorbed through the skin. If you can have lead
absorbed through your skin handling the lights when putting them up,
it seems to me that if children touch the lights, they are also being
exposed to a potential hazard.

-Andrea Baker

[Tom Farley]

In article >,
(andrea baker) wrote:

> I went to Shopko to get some Christmas lights, but every single package
> had a lead warning on it, telling people that the lights contained
> lead, and that one should wash one's hands after putting them up.
> Needless to say, I went without.

At least the strings of lights are a seasonal use with two major
contact times: put-up & take-down. I gather from a parents of kids
with disabilities list that the same warning is now appearing on
flexible power cords of many small appliances including kitchen
counter top items.

Tom

--
Tom Farley
Spontaneous Combustion Storytellers
Sleepwetting Forum - http://www.spont.com/sleepwetting.html
EnuresisKids [moderated] and EnuresisParents e-mail lists
one of the moderators for the newsgroup news:misc.kids.moderated

[Name_Suppressed]

Most 'cheap' plastic items are made of PVC and have some amount of lead.
The lead comes from the plasticizer used in the PVC. Items like power
cords, inflatable beach balls, garden hoses, to name a few common items, all
have some amount of lead. A while back there were several reports on the
dangers of drinking water from garden hoses; some of the lead leaches in to
the water. Better PVC formulations have little or no plasticizer. If the
item has strong 'plastic' smell it is probably made of the cheaper PVC
formulation and hence, higher lead content

-Ken
"Tom Farley" > wrote in message
]...
> In article >,
> (andrea baker) wrote:
>
> > I went to Shopko to get some Christmas lights, but every single package
> > had a lead warning on it, telling people that the lights contained
> > lead, and that one should wash one's hands after putting them up.
> > Needless to say, I went without.
>
> At least the strings of lights are a seasonal use with two major
> contact times: put-up & take-down. I gather from a parents of kids
> with disabilities list that the same warning is now appearing on
> flexible power cords of many small appliances including kitchen
> counter top items.
>
> Tom
>
> --
> Tom Farley
> Spontaneous Combustion Storytellers
> Sleepwetting Forum - http://www.spont.com/sleepwetting.html
> EnuresisKids [moderated] and EnuresisParents e-mail lists
> one of the moderators for the newsgroup news:misc.kids.moderated
>

[Christopher Biow]

(andrea baker) wrote:

>I went to Shopko to get some Christmas lights, but every single package
>had a lead warning on it, telling people that the lights contained
>lead, and that one should wash one's hands after putting them up.
>Needless to say, I went without.

If enough consumers have such a reaction, the manufacturers may be
motivated to replace the lead in the wiring, resulting in an alloy that is
more prone to cracks. So instead of an essentially nonexistent toxic risk
(per CPSC <http://www.sunherald.com/mld/sunherald/living/7484872.htm>) that
in any case could be eliminated by hand-washing, we may get an increase in
fire risk. The net result of the decision to require warning labels could
well be an overall result of some lost lives.

Manufacturers tend to resist such warning labels for exactly this reason.
When theoretical risks are publicizeed in such absolute terms, too many
consumers--most particularly parents considering their childrens'
safety--react as if there were some "perfectly safe" option to simply avoid
all risk:

>I started thinking about whether the lights we used when I was a kid
>also had lead, and eventually decided that the only reasonable
>conclusion is that in the bad old days, the lights also had lead, but
>just weren't labeled. So when you go to put up those lights, think
>twice! Lead can be absorbed through the skin. If you can have lead
>absorbed through your skin handling the lights when putting them up,
>it seems to me that if children touch the lights, they are also being
>exposed to a potential hazard.

The point is not the existence of a hazard, but its magnitude! Without
knowing something about the magnitude of this risk, relative to other risks
that we commonly choose to accept, we can't make any rational decision. "No
risk" is simply not an option. A meteor strike could happen without any
notice! And in avoiding risks, we often create others.

--
Warning: Pregnant women, the elderly and children under 10 should avoid
prolonged exposure to Happy Fun Ball. Caution: Happy Fun Ball may suddenly
accelerate to dangerous speeds. If Happy Fun Ball begins to smoke, get away
immediately. Seek shelter and cover head. Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
Sat. Nite Live

[Robyn Kozierok]

In article >,
Christopher Biow > wrote:

>Manufacturers tend to resist such warning labels for exactly this reason.
>When theoretical risks are publicizeed in such absolute terms, too many
>consumers--most particularly parents considering their childrens'
>safety--react as if there were some "perfectly safe" option to simply avoid
>all risk.

Well, in this case, I think Andrea's decision *does* avoid all risk,
to her family, from Xmas lights. She simply chooses not to bring that
risk into her home. Of course, if I understand correctly, she may already
unknowingly have many other electrical cords in her home that contain
lead, some of which she probably handles much more often than she would
handle the lights.

Chris, I agree with you about assessing magnitude of risk, and about
unwise trade-offs that may occur due to ignorance, but in some cases
you can avoid all risk *from a particular hazard* if you make it your
priority.

--Robyn

[Splanche]

>Well, in this case, I think Andrea's decision *does* avoid all risk,
>to her family, from Xmas lights. She simply chooses not to bring that
>risk into her home. Of course, if I understand correctly, she may already
>unknowingly have many other electrical cords in her home that contain
>lead, some of which she probably handles much more often than she would
>handle the lights.
>
>Chris, I agree with you about assessing magnitude of risk, and about
>unwise trade-offs that may occur due to ignorance, but in some cases
>you can avoid all risk *from a particular hazard* if you make it your
>priority.
>
>--Robyn
>
>
The amount of lead in Christmas lights is probably the same or less than the
amount in a computer keyboard or a joystick....
so I guess we should all wash our hands right now!!! (and get those fingers
out of your mouth!)

[Scott]

Splanche wrote:

>
> The amount of lead in Christmas lights is probably the same or less than the
> amount in a computer keyboard or a joystick....
> so I guess we should all wash our hands right now!!! (and get those fingers
> out of your mouth!)


Everyone should be washing their hands a lot anyway, to
avoid the 'flu ;) (Which has entered the neighborhood)


Scott DD 10.5 & DS 7.8 at 43N 89.5W

[Robyn Kozierok]

In article >,
Scott > wrote:
>
>Everyone should be washing their hands a lot anyway, to
>avoid the 'flu ;) (Which has entered the neighborhood)
>

This really seems to work. Our school has taken up a strong
handwashing policy this year, and so far it seems to be working
really well. The kids have to wash their hands upon arrival at
school, before snack and lunch, after using the bathroom, and
after sneezing or wiping their noses. It's a *lot* of handwashing
(they have sinks in the room) but the kids have so far been much
healthier, and things that hit one kid don't seem to "go around"
like they used to. There is currently *one* child in their group
of 30 out with the flu.

--Robyn

[chiam margalit]

(Robyn Kozierok) wrote in message >...
> In article >,
> Scott > wrote:
> >
> >Everyone should be washing their hands a lot anyway, to
> >avoid the 'flu ;) (Which has entered the neighborhood)
> >
>
> This really seems to work. Our school has taken up a strong
> handwashing policy this year, and so far it seems to be working
> really well. The kids have to wash their hands upon arrival at
> school, before snack and lunch, after using the bathroom, and
> after sneezing or wiping their noses. It's a *lot* of handwashing
> (they have sinks in the room) but the kids have so far been much
> healthier, and things that hit one kid don't seem to "go around"
> like they used to. There is currently *one* child in their group
> of 30 out with the flu.

How does the school handle kids with excema who can't wash their hands
that often? Or kids with allergies to soap products?

Marjorie

[Donna Metler]

"chiam margalit" > wrote in message
om...
> (Robyn Kozierok) wrote in message
>...
> > In article >,
> > Scott > wrote:
> > >
> > >Everyone should be washing their hands a lot anyway, to
> > >avoid the 'flu ;) (Which has entered the neighborhood)
> > >
> >
> > This really seems to work. Our school has taken up a strong
> > handwashing policy this year, and so far it seems to be working
> > really well. The kids have to wash their hands upon arrival at
> > school, before snack and lunch, after using the bathroom, and
> > after sneezing or wiping their noses. It's a *lot* of handwashing
> > (they have sinks in the room) but the kids have so far been much
> > healthier, and things that hit one kid don't seem to "go around"
> > like they used to. There is currently *one* child in their group
> > of 30 out with the flu.
>
> How does the school handle kids with excema who can't wash their hands
> that often? Or kids with allergies to soap products?
>
> Marjorie
>
I've been using the waterless gel stuff after sneezing this past few weeks,
and so far, my hands are holding up to it well-I can't use soap too often
because my skin WILL react, and there's no sink in my classroom at school
anyway. So maybe that would be an option.

[Robyn Kozierok]

In article >,
chiam margalit > wrote:
>
>How does the school handle kids with excema who can't wash their hands
>that often? Or kids with allergies to soap products?

It hasn't come up, but I'm sure they'd work something out. Even if one
child didn't wash their hands as often, the general culture of
handwashing should minimize the spread of germs. Presumably kids with
allergies to soap products have some alternative they can use. With
excema, wouldn't using a eucerin or similar cream afterwards counteract
the negative effects of frequent washing? They're very good about
dealing with kids' individual needs at this school, so they'd come
up with something mutually agreeable.

--Robyn

[Iowacookiemom]

I love the notion of a school-wide handwashing initiative! While I can
certainly understand there may be some for whom skin problems would require
accommodations, I think the overall life skill lesson would be wonderful... and
potentially a life-long benefit.

We're very careful about handwashing in our house (I'm borderline fanatical
about it) and my son routinely tells me how horrifying it is that virtually no
other boys wash their hand after using the restroom. He's smart enough to know
he'd be branded a nerd if he reminded them... he's trying to lead by example.

This leads me to a not-so-endearing "lead by example" Henry story. He's a bit
ahead physically and has had several of the puberty things happening for a
while now. He's self-conscious about body odor and had a discrete container of
deoderant in his locker. Then, through some marketing scam that I must find
and destroy, he decided he simply must, must, must have Axe deoderant -- a
weird mix of spray-on deoderant and men's cologne. He would not be dissuaded,
and my dh, remembering the woes of puberty himself, bought some for Henry.

Soon afterward, Henry was out and needed more. I chalked it up
-Dawn
Mom to Henry, 11

[Iowacookiemom]

Sorry to follow up on my own post but I hit "send" inadvertently and didn't
finish my story... repeating it below for those who may have missed the first
part...the end is below the quote.

>This leads me to a not-so-endearing "lead by example" Henry story. He's a
>bit
>ahead physically and has had several of the puberty things happening for a
>while now. He's self-conscious about body odor and had a discrete container
>of
>deoderant in his locker. Then, through some marketing scam that I must find
>and destroy, he decided he simply must, must, must have Axe deoderant -- a
>weird mix of spray-on deoderant and men's cologne. He would not be
>dissuaded,
>and my dh, remembering the woes of puberty himself, bought some for Henry.
>
>Soon afterward, Henry was out and needed more. I chalked it up

....to using too much the first few days because it was new. So we bought more.
Eventually he admitted to my husband that he'd taken the first can to school.
I shook my head in disbelief and let the men of the house handle it -- I
figured it was a guy thing. I did worry a bit that, rather than discretely
keeping Henry from standing out as one who had body odor, it would instead make
him stand out as the kid who smelled like bad, cheap men's cologne. But
whatever, right?

So I was in his classroom for the first time in a few weeks last week, and I
noticed his can of Axe was sitting right on his desk --- I was a embarassed for
him until I glanced around more and saw that virtually every boy in class had a
can of Axe on his desk. Apparently puberty has set in in a few other cases and
the rest are going along with the crowd... I'm told Henry was the trendsetter
;-)
-Dawn
Mom to Henry, 11