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December 8th 05, 05:53 PM

Thanks for all the advice earlier! Makes me feel better that things seem
normal so far!
We do nurse to sleep almost exclusively, although sometimes she will nurse,
sleep for 15 min or so, then have the cute "awake" period. At the end of
that she either nurses to sleep again or falls asleep on her own.
We are back to sleeping in the bassinet, I moved it to a warmer side of the
room (I live in Maine, so external walls are cold).
Here are my current "problems":
1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake (1-1.5hrs)
and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every 2hrs or so.
Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed again. Even though
we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed by the LC and
visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore. No cracks, bleeding,
etc, just really tender. I use Lansinoh lanolin on them after allowing some
expressed BM to dry on them, but I do cringe when we first latch on. That
pain does go away after nursing for a few minutes. I think this is all
normal (she's 9 days old), but I really need to know if the latching on pain
goes away at some point! :) According to my reading, this pain was
supposed to peak already and it certainly hasn't.
2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full" feeling
anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I know I'm
being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number of pees and
poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running down her chin,
but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I thought there would
be a difference between "full" and "empty", otherwise why would people talk
about being off balance when they only feed from one side at a time?
3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts anymore in order to
give my nipples a longer break. Sometimes she does this on her own by
feeding for a longer time on the first and not waking up for the second, but
most of the time she feeds vigorously for 5min, sleepy sucks for 10min and
then pops off. I then change her diaper and she wakes up again, wanting the
breast again. If I put her back on the same breast, I'm thinking she'll get
more hindmilk that way and might last longer between feeds? Is that naive
of me?

Thanks for all the help....I thought I was pretty well prepared and informed
for this by all the reading I did while pregnant, but I'm finding that my
brain lost most of the info and what it did retain doesn't feel relevant to
the specialness that is my daughter! :)

Amy

MareCat

December 8th 05, 06:40 PM

Hi Amy! :)

"V." > wrote in message
...
>
> 1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake
> (1-1.5hrs) and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every
> 2hrs or so. Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed again.
> Even though we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed by
> the LC and visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore. No
> cracks, bleeding, etc, just really tender. I use Lansinoh lanolin on them
> after allowing some expressed BM to dry on them, but I do cringe when we
> first latch on. That pain does go away after nursing for a few minutes.
> I think this is all normal (she's 9 days old), but I really need to know
> if the latching on pain goes away at some point! :) According to my
> reading, this pain was supposed to peak already and it certainly hasn't.

It's totally normal. I had similar problems with sore nipples in the
beginning. I can't remember exactly when my nipples became "tougher" and
b/fing became less painful, but it was fairly early on (when my DD was a bit
older than your DD is). Hang in there! It DOES get better!

> 2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full"
> feeling anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I
> know I'm being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number of
> pees and poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running down
> her chin, but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I thought
> there would be a difference between "full" and "empty", otherwise why
> would people talk about being off balance when they only feed from one
> side at a time?

I experienced the same thing with soft breasts between feedings during the
first few months. My DD nursed so often, my breasts didn't have a chance to
totally "fill up" again (or at least feel full). And the only times I became
engorged were when she started sleeping 3-4 hours at a time during the
night, or after my DH and I would go out for a date and leave her (with a
bottle of EBM) with someone. I'd then end up with these big rock-hard bumps
on my chest. ;)

> Thanks for all the help....I thought I was pretty well prepared and
> informed for this by all the reading I did while pregnant, but I'm finding
> that my brain lost most of the info and what it did retain doesn't feel
> relevant to the specialness that is my daughter! :)

You are doing an AWESOME job, Amy!! I'm very impressed with your commitment
to b/fing. The newborn phase can be challenging for even the most
well-informed and well-prepared parents. Keep up the great work! :)

Mary
Mommy to (still b/fing 1x/day) Rayna 1/20/03

[email protected]

December 8th 05, 07:09 PM

V. > writes:

: 1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake (1-1.5hrs)
: and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every 2hrs or so.
: Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed again. Even though
: we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed by the LC and
: visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore. No cracks, bleeding,
: etc, just really tender. I use Lansinoh lanolin on them after allowing some
: expressed BM to dry on them, but I do cringe when we first latch on. That
: pain does go away after nursing for a few minutes. I think this is all
: normal (she's 9 days old), but I really need to know if the latching on pain
: goes away at some point! :) According to my reading, this pain was
: supposed to peak already and it certainly hasn't.

With Monika it was closer to 2 weeks to peak and I've heard up to 4.

: 2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full" feeling
: anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I know I'm
: being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number of pees and
: poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running down her chin,
: but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I thought there would
: be a difference between "full" and "empty", otherwise why would people talk
: about being off balance when they only feed from one side at a time?

Newborns nurse often and yours seems to be so that could be contributing
to the lack of engorgement. Wait until she sleeps 4 or 5 hours the first
time!

: 3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts anymore in order to
: give my nipples a longer break. Sometimes she does this on her own by
: feeding for a longer time on the first and not waking up for the second, but
: most of the time she feeds vigorously for 5min, sleepy sucks for 10min and
: then pops off. I then change her diaper and she wakes up again, wanting the
: breast again. If I put her back on the same breast, I'm thinking she'll get
: more hindmilk that way and might last longer between feeds? Is that naive
: of me?

Depends on what you mean by "not switching" and depends on how prolific
a milk producer you are. If you are a prolific milk producer, then you
could feed one side only each feed. Some really prolific producers have
gone two feeds on the same breast, but I would recommend against it.
If you are not sure, then nurse 30 minutes or so on one side before
switching. Since this is related to the soreness, I would suggest doing
it only as much as you have to unless the other reasons above apply.`

: Thanks for all the help....I thought I was pretty well prepared and informed
: for this by all the reading I did while pregnant, but I'm finding that my
: brain lost most of the info and what it did retain doesn't feel relevant to
: the specialness that is my daughter! :)

: Amy

A final word on the soreness. It is probably related to the new experience
and the frequent feeding of a newborn. If the pain become significant or
it hasn't gotten better by 4 weeks, look into the possibility of thrush.

Good luck,
Larry

PS: You seem to be doing everything right, including posting to mkb!
:-)

Emily

December 8th 05, 09:04 PM

Hi Amy!

It sounds like everything's going really well so far :-)

V. wrote:
> 1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake (1-1.5hrs)
> and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every 2hrs or so.
> Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed again. Even though
> we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed by the LC and
> visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore. No cracks, bleeding,
> etc, just really tender. I use Lansinoh lanolin on them after allowing some
> expressed BM to dry on them, but I do cringe when we first latch on. That
> pain does go away after nursing for a few minutes. I think this is all
> normal (she's 9 days old), but I really need to know if the latching on pain
> goes away at some point! :) According to my reading, this pain was
> supposed to peak already and it certainly hasn't.

It does get better. Be really vigilant about her latch (check that her
lips are flanged out), and with time her mouth will get bigger and your
nipples more used to it, and you'll be pain free. In the meantime, I
highly recommend Soothies. They're expensive, but they feel *so* good
on sore nipples. You can usually find them at bf clinics and high-end
maternity/baby shops.

> 2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full" feeling
> anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I know I'm
> being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number of pees and
> poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running down her chin,
> but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I thought there would
> be a difference between "full" and "empty", otherwise why would people talk
> about being off balance when they only feed from one side at a time?

I think this is one of those YMMV things, depending on your own body,
how old your child is, how often she feeds. Some folks leak all the
time, some never do, etc.

> 3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts anymore in order to
> give my nipples a longer break. Sometimes she does this on her own by
> feeding for a longer time on the first and not waking up for the second, but
> most of the time she feeds vigorously for 5min, sleepy sucks for 10min and
> then pops off. I then change her diaper and she wakes up again, wanting the
> breast again. If I put her back on the same breast, I'm thinking she'll get
> more hindmilk that way and might last longer between feeds? Is that naive
> of me?

I don't see any harm in trying --- as long as you're willing to feed
her again immediately if she still seems hungry. Which I'm guessing you
are, since you seem to be going with her cues in general.

Emily
--
DS1 5/02
DS2 9/05

Anne Rogers

December 8th 05, 10:16 PM

> Depends on what you mean by "not switching" and depends on how prolific
> a milk producer you are. If you are a prolific milk producer, then you
> could feed one side only each feed. Some really prolific producers have
> gone two feeds on the same breast, but I would recommend against it.

why in particular? I wouldn't call myself a prolific producer, but it is not
unusual for me to do 2 feeds on the same breast, for a wide variety of
reasons at many different times of day. I never have a problem doing this,
even if the breast feels completely empty.

Anne

Nikki

December 8th 05, 10:54 PM

V. wrote:
> Even though we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as
> assessed by the LC and visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty
> sore. No cracks, bleeding, etc, just really tender.

This is normal. It peaked for me at around 2 weeks and went away at around
3 weeks.

2) My breasts are soft all the
> time now. I don't have that "full" feeling anymore between feeds and
> they don't get harder between feeds.

Again this is normal. That is probably because she is feeding so often.

3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts
> anymore in order to give my nipples a longer break.

I'd do whatever feels best. I super switched Hunter because that felt
better to me but if nursing one breast per sessions feels better to you then
I'd do that. I didn't super switch with Luke but then I wasn't sore with
him either. I don't know if it made any difference but super switching
seemed to lead a bit of a super supply and over active let down. I didn't
have the same problem with Luke but then he was my second and my body might
have been smarter. He also didn't comfort nurse nearly as much.

I thought I was pretty well prepared and
> informed for this by all the reading I did while pregnant, but I'm
> finding that my brain lost most of the info and what it did retain
> doesn't feel relevant to the specialness that is my daughter! :)

Aww, well you are doing fabulously. Enjoy!!

--
Nikki
Hunter 4/99
Luke 4/01
Thing One and Thing Two :-) EDD 4/06

Sidheag McCormack

December 8th 05, 10:58 PM

V writes:
> 1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake
> (1-1.5hrs) and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every
> 2hrs or so. Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed
> again.

So far, so normal...

> Even though we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed
> by the LC and visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore.

.... but that's a problem. I think it's worth trying things to see if they
help rather than just putting up with it, in case what you're doing is
setting yourself up for a crack. (By this stage, though, both my nipples
*were* very cracked, so you're doing better than me :-) I second the advice
to try the gel pad thingies, Soothies or equivalent, they're good. I think
your plan to switch less often to give each nipple a break is probably also
worth a try, though of course you'll need to watch her output carefully and
consider switching back if there's any sign it's impacting your supply.

> 2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full"
> feeling anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I
> know I'm being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number
> of pees and poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running
> down her chin, but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I
> thought there would be a difference between "full" and "empty",
> otherwise why would people talk about being off balance when they only
> feed from one side at a time?

My theory is that that applies to people whose babies leave 3 or 4 hours
between feeds, not to those of us with normal babies :-)

> If I put her back on the same breast, I'm thinking she'll get more hindmilk
> that way and might last longer between feeds? Is that naive of me?

Well, it might or might not work that way, but it's worth a try!

Good luck,

Sidheag
DS Colin Oct 27 2003

Amy

December 9th 05, 01:32 AM

V. wrote:

> 1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake (1-1.5hrs)
> and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every 2hrs or so.
> Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed again. Even though
> we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed by the LC and
> visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore. No cracks, bleeding,
> etc, just really tender. I use Lansinoh lanolin on them after allowing some
> expressed BM to dry on them, but I do cringe when we first latch on. That
> pain does go away after nursing for a few minutes. I think this is all
> normal (she's 9 days old), but I really need to know if the latching on pain
> goes away at some point! :) According to my reading, this pain was
> supposed to peak already and it certainly hasn't.

That sounds totally normal to me. I had pain for a couple weeks, but
it gradually tapered off. I remember that Mom and DH could tell when
she got latched on, because I'd make this hissing noise as I sucked in
my breath and tried really hard not to jump/yell/cry or do anything
else that would startle her and cause her to pull off and look at me
(thus, necessitating a re-latch - whimper). It does go away. My DD
will be 4 months old Saturday, and I recently (within the last 2 weeks
or so) realized that I actually like nursing. It's about freaking
time! :) Don't worry, there was a long period in there where I was
indifferent.

> 2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full" feeling
> anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I know I'm
> being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number of pees and
> poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running down her chin,
> but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I thought there would
> be a difference between "full" and "empty", otherwise why would people talk
> about being off balance when they only feed from one side at a time?

Normal normal normal. You might start to notice a difference between
"full soft" and "empty soft," but they're likely going to stay soft,
now. Mine never did get hard. The baby is nursing on you ALL the time
right now, they don't have time to get hard. Mine took a 4 hour nap
today (my baby, not my boobs) and I finally had to pump because they
were starting to feel full (and I'd rather have that dribble in the
freezer than down my shirt), but they were still soft. It felt similar
to the pressure of a full bladder today, right before I pumped... Kind
of an achey, ouchy feeling... Hard to explain, but you'll know what I
mean when you feel it, which won't be for a while, probably, unless she
starts taking long naps.

> 3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts anymore in order to
> give my nipples a longer break. Sometimes she does this on her own by
> feeding for a longer time on the first and not waking up for the second, but
> most of the time she feeds vigorously for 5min, sleepy sucks for 10min and
> then pops off. I then change her diaper and she wakes up again, wanting the
> breast again. If I put her back on the same breast, I'm thinking she'll get
> more hindmilk that way and might last longer between feeds? Is that naive
> of me?

You might try it for a day and see what happens. My doctor (who is
definitely NOT a breastfeeding expert) said that the whole
foremilk/hindmilk thing isn't as well defined as you'd think, and that
the baby gets a mix of both throughout the feed. I don't know for
sure. With as frequently as you're feeding now, though, you probably
won't get engorged if you don't switch it up. Later on, it might start
to become a problem.

> Thanks for all the help....I thought I was pretty well prepared and informed
> for this by all the reading I did while pregnant, but I'm finding that my
> brain lost most of the info and what it did retain doesn't feel relevant to
> the specialness that is my daughter! :)

Awwww... I know how you feel. There's a big difference between theory
and practice, too, and a tendency to think "Am I doing this right?" or
"Is this normal?" every 10 seconds.

It sounds to me like you two are doing great!! You should be extra
proud of yourself!!

Other Amy

Mum of Two

December 9th 05, 10:19 AM

"V." > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for all the advice earlier! Makes me feel better that things seem
> normal so far!
> We do nurse to sleep almost exclusively, although sometimes she will
> nurse, sleep for 15 min or so, then have the cute "awake" period. At the
> end of that she either nurses to sleep again or falls asleep on her own.
> We are back to sleeping in the bassinet, I moved it to a warmer side of
> the room (I live in Maine, so external walls are cold).
> Here are my current "problems":
> 1. She is on a 2 hr cycle of wake-feed (30-45min)-sleep or awake
> (1-1.5hrs) and so on. This means that I'm nursing 45min out of every
> 2hrs or so. Plus, she sometimes sleeps for 30 min and wants to feed again.
> Even though we have a good latch (as far as I can tell and as assessed by
> the LC and visiting nurse), my nipples are getting pretty sore. No
> cracks, bleeding, etc, just really tender. I use Lansinoh lanolin on them
> after allowing some expressed BM to dry on them, but I do cringe when we
> first latch on. That pain does go away after nursing for a few minutes.
> I think this is all normal (she's 9 days old), but I really need to know
> if the latching on pain goes away at some point! :)

Oh heck yes! It will have gone before you realise it. Her behaviour sounds
very normal for her age. Expect a growth spurt at about 2-3 weeks of age and
another at 5-6 weeks. After that, it will get much, much easier. Especially
after about 3 months when your milk supply will regulate and she'll feed
less often and engorgement will become a thing of the past. It seems a long
way off right now, but it'll be gone before you know it.
If you have extreme pain, redness, hotness or fever, or white spots -
anything that could be mastitis or thrush, get it checked and don't put up
with the pain. But what you're experiencing sounds very familiar, I went
through something similar with DD at that age.

According to my reading, this pain was
> supposed to peak already and it certainly hasn't.
> 2) My breasts are soft all the time now. I don't have that "full"
> feeling anymore between feeds and they don't get harder between feeds. I
> know I'm being textbook paranoid because she is having the right number of
> pees and poops and when she does finally unlatch she has milk running down
> her chin, but I do wonder if the soft breast feeling is normal. I thought
> there would be a difference between "full" and "empty", otherwise why
> would people talk about being off balance when they only feed from one
> side at a time?

You're making milk constantly, and it sounds like she's drinking it
constantly. That's a good thing. Engorgement signals the breasts to produce
less milk, but if it is severe and goes on for a long time it can cause
other problems. Sooner or later, she'll sleep for 5 or more hours and you'll
be aware of just how much milk you've been making ;-) I bet you're hungrier
and thirstier now than when you were pregnant, and that's because whether
you're aware of it or not, your body is working pretty hard right now to
meet Madeline's demands.

> 3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts anymore in order to
> give my nipples a longer break. Sometimes she does this on her own by
> feeding for a longer time on the first and not waking up for the second,
> but most of the time she feeds vigorously for 5min, sleepy sucks for 10min
> and then pops off. I then change her diaper and she wakes up again,
> wanting the breast again. If I put her back on the same breast, I'm
> thinking she'll get more hindmilk that way and might last longer between
> feeds? Is that naive of me?

I don't see why you shouldn't. That's what I did with DD early on. Madeline
will let you know if she really is done on that side, because she'll just
comfort suck or come off again, or cry for the other side. You may find by
doing that though that the other side gets a little engorged. If the breast
becomes too hard for her to get a proper latch, just express a little by
hand so that she can latch properly - a poor latch will just hurt you more.

> Thanks for all the help....I thought I was pretty well prepared and
> informed for this by all the reading I did while pregnant, but I'm finding
> that my brain lost most of the info and what it did retain doesn't feel
> relevant to the specialness that is my daughter! :)

There is basic information that you can read up on, but I think even if you
know 'A Womanly Art' from cover to cover, BF really is about on the job
training - for both of you. You don't stop learning either, toddler nursing
is a whole other experience.

--
Amy
Mum to Carlos born sleeping 20/11/02,
& Ana born screaming 30/06/04
http://www.freewebs.com/carlos2002/
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/a/ana%5Fj%5F2004/
My blog: http://spaces.msn.com/members/querer-hijo-querer-hija/

Chookie

December 9th 05, 10:36 AM

In article >,
"V." > wrote:

> 3) I'm thinking about not switching between breasts anymore in order to
> give my nipples a longer break. Sometimes she does this on her own by
> feeding for a longer time on the first and not waking up for the second, but
> most of the time she feeds vigorously for 5min, sleepy sucks for 10min and
> then pops off. I then change her diaper and she wakes up again, wanting the
> breast again. If I put her back on the same breast, I'm thinking she'll get
> more hindmilk that way and might last longer between feeds? Is that naive
> of me?

Probably, but it's always worth experimenting! BTW there is no need to change
her unless she has pooed or you want her to stay awake.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"In Melbourne there is plenty of vigour and eagerness, but there is
nothing worth being eager or vigorous about."
Francis Adams, The Australians, 1893.

Sue

December 9th 05, 11:59 AM

"Sidheag McCormack" > wrote in message
> My theory is that that applies to people whose babies leave 3 or 4 hours
> between feeds, not to those of us with normal babies :-)

Hmm, babies who feed 3-4 hours are normal too. :o)
--
Sue (mom to three girls)

Sidheag McCormack

December 9th 05, 12:19 PM

Sue writes:

> "Sidheag McCormack" > wrote in message
>> My theory is that that applies to people whose babies leave 3 or 4 hours
>> between feeds, not to those of us with normal babies :-)

> Hmm, babies who feed 3-4 hours are normal too. :o)

I did put a smiley in - and the baby in question was 9 days old, IIRC. I
certainly don't think it's *common* for a 9 day old baby to voluntarily go
3 or 4 hours between feedings - do you?

Sidheag
DS Colin Oct 27 2003

Sue

December 9th 05, 12:30 PM

"Sidheag McCormack" > wrote in message
> I did put a smiley in

I know, that's why I put the smiley in there too because there are lurkers
who might be worried that their babies go longer.

- and the baby in question was 9 days old, IIRC. I
> certainly don't think it's *common* for a 9 day old baby to voluntarily go
> 3 or 4 hours between feedings - do you?

It might not be common, but it does happen. DD3 would go at least 3-4 hours
when she was that little, not all the time mind you, but in those first few
days she did. I seem to recall DD1 sleeping 4 hours straight the first few
nights home.
--
Sue (mom to three girls)

Rebecca Jo

December 9th 05, 02:04 PM

"Emily" > wrote

> In the meantime, I
> highly recommend Soothies. They're expensive, but they feel *so* good
> on sore nipples. You can usually find them at bf clinics and high-end
> maternity/baby shops.

I also found them at my local Walgreens in the baby aisle.

rj

Patagonia

December 10th 05, 02:06 AM

"Sue" > wrote in message
...
> "Sidheag McCormack" > wrote in message
>> I did put a smiley in
>
> I know, that's why I put the smiley in there too because there are lurkers
> who might be worried that their babies go longer.
>
> - and the baby in question was 9 days old, IIRC. I
>> certainly don't think it's *common* for a 9 day old baby to voluntarily
>> go
>> 3 or 4 hours between feedings - do you?
>
> It might not be common, but it does happen. DD3 would go at least 3-4
> hours
> when she was that little, not all the time mind you, but in those first
> few
> days she did. I seem to recall DD1 sleeping 4 hours straight the first few
> nights home.

Both of mine have slept 5 hours straight at night from early on (3-4 days
old) and dd (now 4 months) has regularly had at least one 3-4 hour stretch
during the days. Can't remember what ds did during the days at this age
(nights were more memorable if we did/didn't get sleep!). :-)

Patagonia

December 10th 05, 02:12 AM