Pregnancy guilt (miscarriage mentioned)

[Engram]

I was going to post this in one of the pregnancy loss newgroups but seems
all of them have a readership of zero. At least on my news server they do. I
know that people here have been through similar predicaments. I hope this is
alright... So here it is:

A friend of mine was pregnant and due the same week as I am, first week of
October. Unfortunately, before her pregnancy reached 12 weeks she miscarried
and has not become pregnant since. We haven't really discussed my continuing
pregnancy or what the loss of hers means to her. At first I thought it was
all a bit raw for her so I stayed clear of the topic and now it seems kind
of late in the piece to be talking about it. But maybe not.

My friend suffers from clinical depression and has been taking
antidepressants for years. She was also a victim of crime (attempted sexual
assault) about 4 years ago. I'm kind of worried that the birth of my baby
will open up the wounds of her own loss. I know that in the long run she has
to be the one who deals with the pain but I'd like to be able to broach the
subject with her. And in the end (selfishly) the last thing I want is for
her to burst into tears when she finally gets to hold my baby. A baby born
when hers was due as well.

I guess I'm asking for ideas on how to approach this topic with her. A small
part of me feels kind of guilty about my incredible fortune of having a
great son and a daughter on the way, when this woman who has suffered so
much was also hit with the loss of an unborn child. I want to be able to
support her through this time like I have through other times when things
were very hard for her. I guess I'm just at a loss for words. I know I can't
make things better. But how to bring them out into the open now that the
silence has stretched for so long?

Kasia

--
Matthew 21 June 2005
Baby2 EDD 06 Oct 2006 (maybe)

[Jamie Clark]

Engram wrote:
> I was going to post this in one of the pregnancy loss newgroups but
> seems all of them have a readership of zero. At least on my news
> server they do. I know that people here have been through similar
> predicaments. I hope this is alright... So here it is:
>
> A friend of mine was pregnant and due the same week as I am, first
> week of October. Unfortunately, before her pregnancy reached 12 weeks
> she miscarried and has not become pregnant since. We haven't really
> discussed my continuing pregnancy or what the loss of hers means to
> her. At first I thought it was all a bit raw for her so I stayed
> clear of the topic and now it seems kind of late in the piece to be
> talking about it. But maybe not.
> My friend suffers from clinical depression and has been taking
> antidepressants for years. She was also a victim of crime (attempted
> sexual assault) about 4 years ago. I'm kind of worried that the birth
> of my baby will open up the wounds of her own loss. I know that in
> the long run she has to be the one who deals with the pain but I'd
> like to be able to broach the subject with her. And in the end
> (selfishly) the last thing I want is for her to burst into tears when
> she finally gets to hold my baby. A baby born when hers was due as
> well.
> I guess I'm asking for ideas on how to approach this topic with her.
> A small part of me feels kind of guilty about my incredible fortune
> of having a great son and a daughter on the way, when this woman who
> has suffered so much was also hit with the loss of an unborn child. I
> want to be able to support her through this time like I have through
> other times when things were very hard for her. I guess I'm just at a
> loss for words. I know I can't make things better. But how to bring
> them out into the open now that the silence has stretched for so long?
>
> Kasia

I've been on your friend's side of this coin. My first pregnancy ended at
23.5 weeks, and my best friend's pregnancy continued normally, and our due
date was the same. I then went on to be pregnant 8 more times, and during
all the next 5 years and all 8 losses, pretty much every one of our couple
friends went on to have babies, and some even have their second child. It
was excrutiating at times.

It may feel like it's been too long to broach the subject, but I'm willing
to bet that it's on her mind a lot, especially as your due date (and hers)
draws near. You could try writing it down, much like you have here, and
e-mailing her, even if she is a very close friend and someone you see daily.
That would allow her to think about her response and get back to you when
she's feeling ready to talk about it, whether via e-mail or in person.

I would say this -- although you may not want her to cry when she holds your
baby, as you said, for selfish reasons, that may be exactly what she wants,
needs, or is going to do. And, she may not want to see the baby right away,
because it may be too hard for her. Whatever you do, just be understanding.
Your joy is yours, and you have a right to it, but her pain is hers, and she
has a right to it as well. You cannot force your joy onto her, just as she
cannot force her pain onto you. You might see if she wants to come over to
the house when she's feeling ready, and ask her if she'd mind
holding/watching the baby while you take a nap or a shower -- that would
give her some one-on-one time with the baby to hold it and cry her eyes out,
if need be, while you are getting some much needed sleep or a shower. But
having her come to the hospital, or to your home when it's full of people
may be too much to ask. I remember holding my best friend's son when he was
a tiny newborn, and bawling my eyes out. And it felt good, and healing, and
like a release of some of that grief that I'd been carrying around for so
long.

You are right, you can't make it better. But you can understand, you can be
there, you can listen.

Good luck.
--

Jamie
Earth Angels:
Taylor Marlys, 1/3/03
Addison Grace, 9/30/04

Check out the family! -- www.MyFamily.com, User ID: Clarkguest1,
Password: Guest Become a member for free - go to Add Member to set up
your own User ID and Password

[Engram]

"Jamie Clark" > wrote in message
...
> I've been on your friend's side of this coin. My first pregnancy ended at
> 23.5 weeks, and my best friend's pregnancy continued normally, and our due
> date was the same. I then went on to be pregnant 8 more times, and during
> all the next 5 years and all 8 losses, pretty much every one of our couple
> friends went on to have babies, and some even have their second child. It
> was excrutiating at times.
>
> It may feel like it's been too long to broach the subject, but I'm willing
> to bet that it's on her mind a lot, especially as your due date (and hers)
> draws near. You could try writing it down, much like you have here, and
> e-mailing her, even if she is a very close friend and someone you see
> daily. That would allow her to think about her response and get back to
> you when she's feeling ready to talk about it, whether via e-mail or in
> person.
>
> I would say this -- although you may not want her to cry when she holds
> your baby, as you said, for selfish reasons, that may be exactly what she
> wants, needs, or is going to do. And, she may not want to see the baby
> right away, because it may be too hard for her. Whatever you do, just be
> understanding. Your joy is yours, and you have a right to it, but her pain
> is hers, and she has a right to it as well. You cannot force your joy
> onto her, just as she cannot force her pain onto you. You might see if
> she wants to come over to the house when she's feeling ready, and ask her
> if she'd mind holding/watching the baby while you take a nap or a
> shower -- that would give her some one-on-one time with the baby to hold
> it and cry her eyes out, if need be, while you are getting some much
> needed sleep or a shower. But having her come to the hospital, or to your
> home when it's full of people may be too much to ask. I remember holding
> my best friend's son when he was a tiny newborn, and bawling my eyes out.
> And it felt good, and healing, and like a release of some of that grief
> that I'd been carrying around for so long.
>
> You are right, you can't make it better. But you can understand, you can
> be there, you can listen.
>
> Good luck.

Thanks Jamie. I think that's what I needed and wanted to hear. I expect that
seeing the baby will be hard for her. The suggestion of giving her some
one-on-one time with my daughter while I disappear sounds great. I don't
want her to feel like she has to hold it together just because she's around
people but to have that time to grieve her loss and if providing time with
my child gives her even a little bit of healing, I'd be more than happy to
do it.

[Jamie Clark]

Engram wrote:
> "Jamie Clark" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I've been on your friend's side of this coin. My first pregnancy
>> ended at 23.5 weeks, and my best friend's pregnancy continued normally,
>> and
>> our due date was the same. I then went on to be pregnant 8 more
>> times, and during all the next 5 years and all 8 losses, pretty much
>> every one of our couple friends went on to have babies, and some
>> even have their second child. It was excrutiating at times.
>>
>> It may feel like it's been too long to broach the subject, but I'm
>> willing to bet that it's on her mind a lot, especially as your due
>> date (and hers) draws near. You could try writing it down, much like
>> you have here, and e-mailing her, even if she is a very close friend
>> and someone you see daily. That would allow her to think about her
>> response and get back to you when she's feeling ready to talk about
>> it, whether via e-mail or in person.
>>
>> I would say this -- although you may not want her to cry when she
>> holds your baby, as you said, for selfish reasons, that may be
>> exactly what she wants, needs, or is going to do. And, she may not
>> want to see the baby right away, because it may be too hard for her.
>> Whatever you do, just be understanding. Your joy is yours, and you
>> have a right to it, but her pain is hers, and she has a right to it
>> as well. You cannot force your joy onto her, just as she cannot
>> force her pain onto you. You might see if she wants to come over to
>> the house when she's feeling ready, and ask her if she'd mind
>> holding/watching the baby while you take a nap or a shower -- that would
>> give her some one-on-one time with the baby to
>> hold it and cry her eyes out, if need be, while you are getting some
>> much needed sleep or a shower. But having her come to the hospital,
>> or to your home when it's full of people may be too much to ask. I
>> remember holding my best friend's son when he was a tiny newborn,
>> and bawling my eyes out. And it felt good, and healing, and like a
>> release of some of that grief that I'd been carrying around for so
>> long. You are right, you can't make it better. But you can understand,
>> you can be there, you can listen.
>>
>> Good luck.
>
> Thanks Jamie. I think that's what I needed and wanted to hear. I
> expect that seeing the baby will be hard for her. The suggestion of
> giving her some one-on-one time with my daughter while I disappear
> sounds great. I don't want her to feel like she has to hold it
> together just because she's around people but to have that time to
> grieve her loss and if providing time with my child gives her even a
> little bit of healing, I'd be more than happy to do it.

Exactly. Or she may be fine. But for you to broach the subject just shows
her that you love her and care about her and are thinking of her feelings
amidst the rest of the joy that you have going on in your life, and that's a
good thing.

I also held lots of babies after we lost our son, and it brought me so much
joy and hope. It didn't make me cry every time, but that one time was
definately hard, since our due dates were the same. We did go visit them in
the hospital after the baby had been born, and we walked into their hospital
room, which was filled with well wishers, family, flowers, etc, and I
couldn't help but think -- that should be me, or at least I should be down
the hall. So it was hard, but that's life. It goes on. But having my
friend be understanding and supportive to me helped me through it.
--

Jamie
Earth Angels:
Taylor Marlys, 1/3/03
Addison Grace, 9/30/04

Check out the family! -- www.MyFamily.com, User ID: Clarkguest1,
Password: Guest Become a member for free - go to Add Member to set up
your own User ID and Password

[cjra]

>
> My friend suffers from clinical depression and has been taking
> antidepressants for years. She was also a victim of crime (attempted sexual
> assault) about 4 years ago. I'm kind of worried that the birth of my baby
> will open up the wounds of her own loss. I know that in the long run she has
> to be the one who deals with the pain but I'd like to be able to broach the
> subject with her. And in the end (selfishly) the last thing I want is for
> her to burst into tears when she finally gets to hold my baby. A baby born
> when hers was due as well.

FWIW - she may do that, and she may not. I had *just* miscarried at
11weeks, hadn't yet had the D&E, in fact that day was finally having
heavy bleeding, when we went to go see our friends' new baby. Now, our
due dates weren't the same, but I really didn't know how I'd handle it
and worried I'd burst into tears (they didn't know of the pg or m/c, we
were just about to tell everyone when the m/c happened). Instead of
losing it, I was the opposite, I held onto that baby all day, loved
holding it, cooing over it, and the mom was happy for some rest. It was
incredibly cathartic, exactly what I needed and what I least expected.

Not friends, but two people from a non-pg chat group I was on were also
pg and due the same time, one of whom had had 3 m/c's prior. Honestly,
we didn't really like each other much ;-), but I was happy for her pg,
and when I miscarried, all the happier for her. Weird I know.....it
seemed all the more important to me that she get that baby to term, and
celebrate it for both of us (and she did).

I realise both scenarios are a little bit different than your friend's,
and we all react differently so you can't predict how she'll feel. But
I *would* broach the subject. If she backs off immediately then she's
not ready to talk, but maybe she's anxious to share her thoughts and
just hesitant to bring up a 'bad' topic with you.

[Pologirl]

Engram wrote:
> We haven't really discussed my continuing
> pregnancy or what the loss of hers means to her. At first I thought it was
> all a bit raw for her so I stayed clear of the topic and now it seems kind
> of late in the piece to be talking about it. But maybe not.

Reading your post, I get the distinct impression that in some way you
see your pregancy success (so far) and your friend's loss are *ONE
TOPIC*. How about separating them, and simply tell your friend you how
much you are thinking about her and ask if she would like to talk about
her MC etc.? Can you talk about her issues without talking about
yours?

[Engram]

"Pologirl" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Reading your post, I get the distinct impression that in some way you
> see your pregancy success (so far) and your friend's loss are *ONE
> TOPIC*. How about separating them, and simply tell your friend you how
> much you are thinking about her and ask if she would like to talk about
> her MC etc.? Can you talk about her issues without talking about
> yours?

I don't see them as one topic, but as both of them having an impact on her
emotionally. I was simply trying to get across that me turning up with a big
baby belly or a baby the same age as her's would have been, would have an
effect on her. What I am asking for here is how to best bring the topic of
her miscarriage into the open when we haven't talked about it and how I
could make it easier for her when the time comes for her to meet my baby.

And yes, I am quite capable of talking to her just about her issues without
bringing myself into it. I don't plan on barging in and saying "you lost
yours, I've kept mine, so how about we talk about it". I had hoped that in
my post I had come across as slightly more tactful than that :(