Problem bottle feeding one of the twins

[[email protected]]

Hi there,

We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
has problems with the bottle.

Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
mouth or leak out.

We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
gaining good weight consistently.

Any ideas would be most appreciated.

Thanks.

[Anne Rogers[_4_]]

you don't say what's in the bottle, if it's formula then that might be
the problem, if it's breastmilk, then you probably need to look at
things like position and how you are holding the bottle - could she be
taking in air - it does sound like something about the feed is making
her uncomfortable after a period of time. Try to have her as upright as
possible and make sure the nipple is full of milk - unfortunately this
can mean a waste of milk as you can only manage this through the whole
feed if there is some left at the end. Another possibility is that maybe
you are overestimating how much milk she needs in a feed and that her
discomfort results from you encouraging her to take more when she's done
and her tummy becomes over full. You could also try burping her a few
minutes in.

Give your wife a pat on the back for breastfeeding premie twins...

cheers
Anne

[toypup]

On Wed, 26 Sep 2007 14:36:40 -0700, wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.

Some babies just never like bottles. We spent so much money on bottles and
nipples. I had a whole collection. DD would not take any of them.
Eventually, she just learned to wait for me to get home.

[Jeff]

wrote:
> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.
>
> Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> mouth or leak out.
>
> We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works.

yes, you found something that works. Breast milk.

She
> definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> gaining good weight consistently.
>
> Any ideas would be most appreciated.
>
> Thanks.

Talk to her doctor.

It could be many different things. If she is acting as if she is in
pain, that is a god sign that you should stop bottle feeding and talk to
your doctor before trying again, especially when you have a way that
works just fine.

Jeff

[JennP.]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.
>
> Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> mouth or leak out.
>
> We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
> definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> gaining good weight consistently.

So she's gaining well then? It sounds like the actual nursing is going
better now and her wieght is not an issue. I would suspect that she just has
a preference for the breast over the bottle. It's actually quite common but
I understand your concern given the fact that she is a preemie and that she
was slow to establish breastfeeding. I would watch her weight and let her
have the breast as much as possible. Maybe save the bottles for your other
twin to give your dw a break? HTH

JennP.

[[email protected]]

On Sep 27, 2:36 am, wrote:
> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.
>
> Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> mouth or leak out.
>
> We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
> definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> gaining good weight consistently.
>
> Any ideas would be most appreciated.
>
> Thanks.

ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,

[[email protected]]

On Sep 27, 6:35 am, "JennP." > wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi there,
>
> > We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> > is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> > give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> > has problems with the bottle.
>
> > Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> > she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> > stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> > it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> > If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> > fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> > mouth or leak out.
>
> > We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> > shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
> > definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> > has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> > very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> > take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> > gaining good weight consistently.
>
> So she's gaining well then? It sounds like the actual nursing is going
> better now and her wieght is not an issue. I would suspect that she just has
> a preference for the breast over the bottle. It's actually quite common but
> I understand your concern given the fact that she is a preemie and that she
> was slow to establish breastfeeding. I would watch her weight and let her
> have the breast as much as possible. Maybe save the bottles for your other
> twin to give your dw a break? HTH
>
> JennP.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula ,

[[email protected]]

On Sep 27, 6:35 am, "JennP." > wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Hi there,
>
> > We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> > is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> > give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> > has problems with the bottle.
>
> > Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> > she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> > stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> > it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> > If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> > fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> > mouth or leak out.
>
> > We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> > shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
> > definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> > has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> > very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> > take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> > gaining good weight consistently.
>
> So she's gaining well then? It sounds like the actual nursing is going
> better now and her wieght is not an issue. I would suspect that she just has
> a preference for the breast over the bottle. It's actually quite common but
> I understand your concern given the fact that she is a preemie and that she
> was slow to establish breastfeeding. I would watch her weight and let her
> have the breast as much as possible. Maybe save the bottles for your other
> twin to give your dw a break? HTH
>
> JennP.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,
ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula , ponnapula ,

[Frisbee®]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.
>
> Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> mouth or leak out.
>
> We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
> definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> gaining good weight consistently.
>
> Any ideas would be most appreciated.
>
> Thanks.

These may be way too obvious to be the answer, but perhaps she needs
burping?
Perhaps a different formula?

[Donna Metler]

"toypup" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 13:28:24 -0700, wrote:
>
>> I'm going back to work soon and my wife was hoping that she might
>> exclusively pump and bottle both girls with the breastmilk rather then
>> nurse them one at a time as it would be far quicker. Unfortunately,
>> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either and until
>> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
>> do it. Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
>> really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
>> decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
>> pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...
>
> I personally don't think it saves time to pump and feed rather than just
> BF; but then again, I don't have twins. I know that if I had to pump
> exclusively for either child, I would have given up completely and
> switched
> entirely to bottle. It's just too hard.
>
I'd just like to say, as someone who EPd a preemie who couldn't nurse and
pumped until age 2, EPing is not as bad as people make it sound. You do
eventually get into a rhythm of it. If you can combo pump and BF, it should
be even more doable.

Is she pumping one side while nursing on the other? Single pumping takes
more than 2x as long as double pumping, IME, because stimulation on one side
aides letdown on the other, and I'd expect the same thing to apply to
nursing/single pumping.

Does she have a hospital-grade pump at home and at work and a good
hands-free bra? If she's pumping and nursing simultaneously, does she have
one which can be opened to nurse on one side while pumping the other?

For me, the first 6-8 weeks were really hard. I wasn't producing much milk
(my milk didn't really even come in for several weeks, and I had very yellow
colostrummy milk for about the first 2 months-which, given DD's prematurity
was probably exactly what she needed). Then, all of a sudden, it shifted.
For quite awhile, I was producing about 2 litres a day, and that was for one
baby. I was able to drop back the frequency of pumps at that point and stay
more than equal to my DD's needs, and really didn't have problems until she
was about 12 months old, at which point supply started to decline, down to
almost nothing at 2.

So, it can work. Yes, it's frustrating as all get out, but it can work-and
since she's able to combine nursing and pumping, it should be even more
doable.

It really bothers me to hear people make it sound like it's breastfeeding or
nothing, and that pumping is a major obstacle. Maybe if I'd ever been able
to breastfeed a baby and seen how easy it was, I might feel that way, but
having EPd, I know it can work, even in a worst case scenerio where
breastfeeding just isn't working at all.

[[email protected]]

Hi again,

Thank you for all the great info. Just to clarify, I was talking
about breastmilk in the bottle. As for burping, she does burp well
(finally) but burping her makes no difference in her fighting the
bottle when she starts to do that. She had taken the bottle perfectly
earlier on but maybe now it is just a preference to the breast. I
don't think we're trying to overfeed her because she starts fighting
the bottle sometimes after only taking 1 oz. Typically, we try to
give both of them 4-5 oz per feed when we bottle them (they are each
just under 12 lbs and feed 5-6 times per day). I do feed her sitting
upright and have also tried feeding her by putting her in her bumbo
chair but it doesn't seem to make a difference. The doctor says it is
the reflux and that's where the Prevacid comes in.

I'm going back to work soon and my wife was hoping that she might
exclusively pump and bottle both girls with the breastmilk rather then
nurse them one at a time as it would be far quicker. Unfortunately,
Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either and until
they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
do it. Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...

[Anne Rogers[_4_]]

> I'm going back to work soon and my wife was hoping that she might
> exclusively pump and bottle both girls with the breastmilk rather then
> nurse them one at a time as it would be far quicker. Unfortunately,
> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either and until
> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
> do it. Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
> really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
> decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
> pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...

I really don't think the logic follows, a bottle shouldn't be consumed
much faster if at all than a feed at the breast, if there is a
significant difference in time taken, then either the bottle nipple is
too fast (which could be yet another reason for the problems one of the
is having), or there is time at the breast which is comfort sucking
which it may be possible to reduce, maybe with the aid of a pacifier.
Even if she bottle feeds them at the same time - which isn't all that
easy and leaves you with no hands free, the time spent pumping, washing
cleaning etc probably negates it. It sounds like it would really help
her to learn to nurse the twins together, at least for some feeds, I
know there are a lot of ways of doing it, but not being a mother of
twins I don't know where to point for the best help or information.

Cheers
Anne

[toypup]

On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 13:28:24 -0700, wrote:

> I'm going back to work soon and my wife was hoping that she might
> exclusively pump and bottle both girls with the breastmilk rather then
> nurse them one at a time as it would be far quicker. Unfortunately,
> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either and until
> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
> do it. Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
> really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
> decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
> pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...

I personally don't think it saves time to pump and feed rather than just
BF; but then again, I don't have twins. I know that if I had to pump
exclusively for either child, I would have given up completely and switched
entirely to bottle. It's just too hard.

Maybe if she could keep it up for just awhile longer until they are good at
BF'ing, she'll just keep BF'ing. It's hard with a physician's job, but
then maybe you could hire a nanny who will bring the baby to the office at
lunchtime to BF. My DD, who wouldn't take a bottle, would wait until I
came home to BF. I worked a split shift just to accomodate her.

[toypup]

On Fri, 28 Sep 2007 05:19:42 -0500, Donna Metler wrote:


> It really bothers me to hear people make it sound like it's breastfeeding or
> nothing, and that pumping is a major obstacle. Maybe if I'd ever been able
> to breastfeed a baby and seen how easy it was, I might feel that way, but
> having EPd, I know it can work, even in a worst case scenerio where
> breastfeeding just isn't working at all.

I was speaking for myself. I did pump for more than a year for DS and we
combined EBM, formula, BF so I could work. I also pumped for DD until I
finally gave up, since she just wouldn't take a bottle. I hated pumping
with a passion, found it labor intensive and would give it up if I had to
do it full-time. It takes double the work of BF'ing or FF'ing; since in
addition to feeding, one must pump and clean the pump. My friend pumped
exclusively and my hat was off to her (and to you).

[Jeff]

wrote:
> Hi again,
>
> Thank you for all the great info. Just to clarify, I was talking
> about breastmilk in the bottle. As for burping, she does burp well
> (finally) but burping her makes no difference in her fighting the
> bottle when she starts to do that. She had taken the bottle perfectly
> earlier on but maybe now it is just a preference to the breast. I
> don't think we're trying to overfeed her because she starts fighting
> the bottle sometimes after only taking 1 oz. Typically, we try to
> give both of them 4-5 oz per feed when we bottle them (they are each
> just under 12 lbs and feed 5-6 times per day). I do feed her sitting
> upright and have also tried feeding her by putting her in her bumbo
> chair but it doesn't seem to make a difference. The doctor says it is
> the reflux and that's where the Prevacid comes in.
>
> I'm going back to work soon and my wife was hoping that she might
> exclusively pump and bottle both girls with the breastmilk rather then
> nurse them one at a time as it would be far quicker. Unfortunately,
> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either and until
> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
> do it. Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
> really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
> decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
> pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...

One thing is that sometimes kids won't drink mom's breastmilk when mom
is around, but will drink it when she isn't around. I mean why use the
bottle when the tap is around the corner? It's like drinking Sam Adams
dark beer from a bottle when the bar has it on tap (ok, different types
of bottles, but you get the idea). It could be that when she is not
around (and kids will smell her if she is in the next room) or your out
of the house without mom, both kids will suck it down like a sump pump
in a flood.

Jeff

[Anne Rogers[_4_]]

> It really bothers me to hear people make it sound like it's breastfeeding or
> nothing, and that pumping is a major obstacle. Maybe if I'd ever been able
> to breastfeed a baby and seen how easy it was, I might feel that way, but
> having EPd, I know it can work, even in a worst case scenerio where
> breastfeeding just isn't working at all.

but this isn't a situation where breastfeeding isn't working at all,
it's the opposite, breastfeeding seems to be fine and giving bottles is
the issue, a lot of people offered multiple suggestions to solve the
bottle feeding problems. Deciding to EP when breastfeeding is working is
a totally different ball game to deciding to do it when it isn't, you
pretty much had no option, it was give bottles of breastmilk or give
bottles of formula, you committed to the smart choice of pumping for her
- but unfortunately that means you haven't experienced a normal
breastfeeding relationship. Mixed pumping and breastfeeding can work out
great, most of us have done it and I imagine with twins that it could be
a helpful tool. EPing can apparently go pretty well at first, I've seen
it happen many many times, life revolves around baby anyway, you always
have to take a bottle out etc, you just do it, but as time passes it can
get harder and harder to keep the milk supply up, then once they are on
solids they can get a bit more unpredictable, do you take a bottle out
with you or not? will you need to pump on this trip or not? the
convenience of breastfeeding really increases at this point. It all
depends what your goals are - you really are very rare in providing some
ebm through to 2 years, which is the WHO recommendation for
breastfeeding, even 1 year is pretty unusual, so it depends what your
goals are, it's going to look different if you're wanting to make it
another month or another 6 months. The vast majority of the time fixing
a breastfeeding problem is going to get better results than moving to EPing.

Anne

[betsy]

On Sep 28, 1:28 pm, wrote:
Unfortunately,
> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either

Does this seem to be because the milk comes out too fast during tandem
nursing? If so, one option might be to latch on the other baby first,
wait until after the fastest part of the first letdown is done, then
switch the first baby to the other side and latch Hannah on to the
first side. Later in the nursing session switching sides again would
be an option. Since this would change the foremilk/hind milk ratio
each would receive, you would want to pay attention to how this
affects their dispositions and growth.


Another thing that might help would be to work on finding a tandem
nursing postion that keeps Hannah more upright. As they grow in the
next weeks, tandem nursing is likely to get a lot easier.


and until
> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
> do it.

It is really hard when they are still at the point where it takes her
full concentration and effort just to keep one latched on. Very good
propping can help but it can be difficult to even get the second one
latched on without loosing the first one's latch. A good tandem
nursing pillow can be especially helpful when they are so small.

Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
> really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
> decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
> pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...

Despite the fact that it has been a while since their births, they are
still at a stage where nursing them together is a challenge. Does
your wife have any local support from other women who have nursed
twins and made it through the difficult early stages? If not, your
local La Leche League leader might be able to put you in touch with
some.

--Betsy

[Rosalie B.]

betsy > wrote:

>On Sep 28, 1:28 pm, wrote:
> Unfortunately,
>> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either

I had two children (not twins but born at separate times) who would
only nurse on the right breast. One of them was quite adamant about
it, and would scream in anger any time I tried the left. (This was
when she was 3 weeks.) I was told (after the fact) that the right
side usually drew down easier if the mom was right handed. So it
wasn't because the milk came out too fast, but the reverse.

So maybe Hannah prefers one breast over the other, and you are trying
to nurse her tandem on her non-preferred side.
>
>Does this seem to be because the milk comes out too fast during tandem
>nursing? If so, one option might be to latch on the other baby first,
>wait until after the fastest part of the first letdown is done, then
>switch the first baby to the other side and latch Hannah on to the
>first side. Later in the nursing session switching sides again would
>be an option. Since this would change the foremilk/hind milk ratio
>each would receive, you would want to pay attention to how this
>affects their dispositions and growth.
>
> Another thing that might help would be to work on finding a tandem
>nursing postion that keeps Hannah more upright. As they grow in the
>next weeks, tandem nursing is likely to get a lot easier.
>
>
>and until
>> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
>> do it.
>
>It is really hard when they are still at the point where it takes her
>full concentration and effort just to keep one latched on. Very good
>propping can help but it can be difficult to even get the second one
>latched on without loosing the first one's latch. A good tandem
>nursing pillow can be especially helpful when they are so small.
>
>Bottling one, nursing the other and then pumping doesn't
>> really buy her any more time so I guess we'll have to make the
>> decision on going to formula or not. She's just putting so much
>> pressure on herself to keep them on breastmilk only...
>
>Despite the fact that it has been a while since their births, they are
>still at a stage where nursing them together is a challenge. Does
>your wife have any local support from other women who have nursed
>twins and made it through the difficult early stages? If not, your
>local La Leche League leader might be able to put you in touch with
>some.
>
>--Betsy

[NL]

Rosalie B. schrieb:
> betsy > wrote:
>
>> On Sep 28, 1:28 pm, wrote:
>> Unfortunately,
>>> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either
>
> I had two children (not twins but born at separate times) who would
> only nurse on the right breast. One of them was quite adamant about
> it, and would scream in anger any time I tried the left. (This was
> when she was 3 weeks.) I was told (after the fact) that the right
> side usually drew down easier if the mom was right handed. So it
> wasn't because the milk came out too fast, but the reverse.

Sara prefers the left, as did Sam. However (!) I went to the doc with
Sara last week to get her neck checked and sure enough she did have one
"blocked" disc (?) in her spine, I think it was the first or second one.
The doc fixed that by basically giving it a push from both sides at
once, and she's a lot better, she turns her head to both sides now and
when she's laying on her back her head's not turned to the side all the
time anymore. She's still no good at nursing on the right breast though
:-/ I think let down is too fast for her there, she latches on fine but
pulls away frequently.

So, if your twin also has some neck issues (doesn't turn her head to one
side, or does so very reluctantly; lays like a banana when her head's
turned to the non preferred side,...) see your doc about it and get a
referral to a "specialist". It's very common for newborn babies to have
this, I'm sure Sam did, too but we didn't find a doc prepared to
check/treat him because they weren't experienced with babies...

cu
nicole (nak, yay!)

[betsy]

On Sep 29, 8:29 am, NL > wrote:
> when she's laying on her back her head's not turned to the side all the
> time anymore. She's still no good at nursing on the right breast though
> :-/ I think let down is too fast for her there, she latches on fine but
> pulls away frequently.
>

When mine were newborns, they preferred my less productive side. As
they got bigger and more able to handle the more forceful letdown,
they switched to liking the more productive side better.

--Betsy

[NL]

betsy schrieb:
> On Sep 29, 8:29 am, NL > wrote:
>> when she's laying on her back her head's not turned to the side all the
>> time anymore. She's still no good at nursing on the right breast though
>> :-/ I think let down is too fast for her there, she latches on fine but
>> pulls away frequently.
>>
>
> When mine were newborns, they preferred my less productive side. As
> they got bigger and more able to handle the more forceful letdown,
> they switched to liking the more productive side better.

Sara is 4 weeks today, but she's wearing 2-4month size clothing! She
spits up a fair bit (Sam never spit up except if he had a crappy day)
and I put her into one of Sams outfits, which fit him well when he was
about 6-8 weeks old. I swear, if she'd stretch out all the way she'd
make the buttons fly off.
So to me she's not exactly a newborn ;-) She's _huge_! *lol* It's so
strange, she's asleep in my bed with Sam right now and I look at her and
think "There's no way you could have ever fit into my belly. You're so
big already!" the pair of pants I had with me for taking her home from
hospital were practically capri-pants on her! I knit her a really warm
sweater, which is nearly too small already, she's worn it once so far...

But yes, she's definitely still a newborn nursing wise, though I noticed
when I nursed her "to sleep" (overtired, screaming, fussing, no-fun
baby, we need to take our walk earlier tomorrow..) she nursed fine on my
right side, apparently let down isn't such a big problem when we're
laying down so I'm on my right side. I have no clue why though..
Whatever, as long as it works ;-)

To the OP:
So yeah, try different nursing positions! My midwife told us about a
mother of twins who nursed both, she had them in bed with her, one on
the foot end one on the head end and she'd "flip over" whenever one was
crying. It worked fine for her.
I know it doesn't "cut down on time" because you'd be nursing one at a
time, but if you can do it without really waking up it doesn't really
matter, right? And for the day time, relax, it's not a race. Yes, we've
all got chores and things to do and we don't like to sit there nursing
24/7 either, but this time will pass, and it will do so quickly even
though it doesn't seem like it today.
I thought I'd be sitting there nursing my now 7 year old until I'm old
and gray and I'd have sipderwebs all over me because when he was really
little he'd nurse 30 min on the left, 30 min on the right, 30 on the
left again and then sleep for 30 minutes, but _only in my arms and I was
not allowed to move_ or he'd wake up and scream... It passed. I'm not
nursing him 24/7 anymore and I don't have gray hair (just don't look too
closely, those few in the back don't count! No, I don't want you to
count them for me either!) well, at least there's no cobwebs!

Is there any way you can help your wife out in a different way, like
having someone come in once a week and clean the house? Can you take
care of the laundry in the evenings? What about your/her parents, can
they maybe cook and freeze some food for you so she doesn't have to cook
every night and you're not living on take out either?

cu
nicole

[xkatx]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.
>
> Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain. If I try and continue,
> it's as if she can no longer get a good latch on the bottle nipple.
> If I do get it above her tongue she will try to suck but quickly
> fights it off or sucks but it most seems to spray out of the side her
> mouth or leak out.
>
> We've tried all manner of nipples (using different brands, flows,
> shapes and textures) but can't find anything that works. She
> definitely has reflux and is on Previcid for it. Putting her on it
> has allowed my wife to nurse her where before she would not even nurse
> very well. Nursing still isn't perfect with her as she sometimes will
> take very little but she must make up for it at other times as she's
> gaining good weight consistently.
>
> Any ideas would be most appreciated.
>
> Thanks.

I haven't read the massive replies already given, so I don't know if this
has been suggested, but try vanilla extract. It kind of worked for DD2, who
still, to this day, outright refuses bottles. She has had the odd bottle of
EBM only. Never had even a tiny drop of formula, and with EBM in a bottle,
she would still refuse it.

A friend suggested trying vanilla extract. I thought she was on glue or
worse. She said that she had the same bottle issue with one of her boys as
I had with DD2. Her story was the same as mine - every type of bottle and
nipple and then some and nothing worked, and, eventually, she just gave up
on trying to force a bottle for a rare occasion, just as I had. Then she
heard to try vanilla extract.

The best bottles for this to use are ones that are wider. Something like a
Playtex nurser or similar with a very wide opening and nipple. Put a bit of
vanilla extract on your finger or Q-tip and just wipe a bit of the extract
around that ring part that the nipple goes in then screws on to the bottle.
Just put it around there where it can be smelled but not eaten or tasted.
Friend told me that she heard somewhere that to a nursling, their mother's
milk has a slight vanilla scent to it.

After this suggestion, I really did think she was sniffing the glue and had
gone insane, but I tried it out anyways. Oddly enough, this way and with
one of the bottles and nipples I had previously tried, DD2 took the bottle.
She took it very reluctantly, but there was none of the screaming, crying,
back arching, freaking out, spitting the nipple out. DD2 clearly did NOT
like the bottle with the vanilla around it, but she did take it and she took
it just fine (although didn't seem to stop letting us all know she wasn't
all too impressed!)

I was able to leave her with a bottle on an occasion or two - I had planned
to begin going back to my once a month meetings that required 'Daddy Time'
for the kids, and I was able to go back to that when DD2 was about 4 months
old and we figured the vanilla trick.

No idea if that will work for you, but it definitely worked for us over here
and also for a friend who suggested it and tried it on an occasion.

The friend also used EBM in a bottle as well, not formula, and you didn't
mention if it's formula or breast milk in the bottle, so if it is formula,
the baby just might not like the taste of it and fight it and in this case,
I don't think that the vanilla trick would work at all. It might, though,
if it's breast milk in the bottle. Who knows? It might be worth a shot!

[dejablues[_2_]]

On Mon, 2008-01-28 at 23:09 -0600, Nikki wrote:


Argh! Fix your computer clock. You're posting from random dates in the
future!
>
self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
> > do it.
>
> I have twins that I am nursing. I promise that it will get a lot easier
> when they get just a little older and are better able to stay latched on.
> She should continue to work with tandeming them and it will happen. They
> are very close to being good at it. Does she have a twins nursing pillow?
> I used the EZ-2-Nurse twins nursing pillow and it was a life savor. It made
> tandeming possible. We found that it was much easier for me to nurse them
> at the same time then it was for dh to bottle them at the same time. He had
> to bottle them individually for a long time.
>
> I'm wishing you the best of luck!!
>

[Nikki]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi there,
>
> We have twins who are 3 months old (1.5 months corrected) that my wife
> is currently breastfeeding. Occasionally I bottlefeed one of them to
> give her a break but our problem is with the other one (Hannah) who
> has problems with the bottle.
>
> Hannah will start to take the bottle fine but after several minutes
> she will try and spit the nipple out, start crying, arching,
> stretching and looks to be in a lot of pain.

How many ounces is she taking? She just sounds full to me. Be sure she
burps frequently.

Is this one bottle a day or more? If it is just one bottle a day or less I
wouldn't worry about how much she takes. She is gaining fine so is getting
plenty with the nursing. Even if that one bottle feed is small, she'll make
up for it at the breast.

If this is multiple bottles a day then I'd consult the ped. I don't know a
thing about reflux but if she is sucking for several minutes before she
starts fussing it makes me think that she is either full or miserable. IME
nipple preference issues caused problems at the very beginning of a feed,
not several minutes later.

Congratulations to you and your wife. Assure her that it will get easier!
You can help out in many ways besides giving a bottle. I found it extremely
helpful for someone to take the babies right before and after a feed - to
change and comfort them. We did do bottles too. I needed to top off a
bit in the beginning and then we kept up the one bottle a day to keep them
in practice for when I returned to work. The bottles were a pain IMO, and
other kinds of help benefited me more. Everyone is different though! Hang
in there - it is going to get really fun really soon when their
personalities and interactions begin :)


--
Nikki, mama to
Hunter 4/99
Luke 4/01
Brock 4/06
Ben 4/06

[Nikki]

> wrote in message
oups.com...

She had taken the bottle perfectly
> earlier on but maybe now it is just a preference to the breast. I
> don't think we're trying to overfeed her because she starts fighting
> the bottle sometimes after only taking 1 oz.

Babies, especially primarily breastfed ones, will take varying amounts from
the bottle because they are used to getting varying amounts at the breast.
If the baby is showing a preference then she may always take just enough to
get by on from the bottle. Don't worry about it. She'll make up the
difference at the breast. Especially if you are talking about just one or
two bottles a day. This situation has been true for all of my babies and
it was never a problem for us. I will say that I never gave my babies a
bottle. I usually tried to leave the area. It is hard to imagine right
now, in the thick of things, but really - nursing directly will be easier
for your wife then nursing, pumping, fiddling with bottles etc.

> I'm going back to work soon and my wife was hoping that she might
> exclusively pump and bottle both girls with the breastmilk rather then
> nurse them one at a time as it would be far quicker. Unfortunately,
> Hannah doesn't take to the tandem nursing very well either and until
> they can self latch and hold my wife literally needs an extra hand to
> do it.

I have twins that I am nursing. I promise that it will get a lot easier
when they get just a little older and are better able to stay latched on.
She should continue to work with tandeming them and it will happen. They
are very close to being good at it. Does she have a twins nursing pillow?
I used the EZ-2-Nurse twins nursing pillow and it was a life savor. It made
tandeming possible. We found that it was much easier for me to nurse them
at the same time then it was for dh to bottle them at the same time. He had
to bottle them individually for a long time.

I'm wishing you the best of luck!!

--
Nikki, mama to
Hunter 4/99
Luke 4/01
Brock 4/06
Ben 4/06

[Nikki]

"Donna Metler" > wrote in message
. ..

> I'd just like to say, as someone who EPd a preemie who couldn't nurse and
> pumped until age 2, EPing is not as bad as people make it sound. You do
> eventually get into a rhythm of it. If you can combo pump and BF, it
> should be even more doable.

Breastfeeding until two is rare and to pump until two is exceptional. You
did such a great job and have a lot of commitment!

I think the biggest obstacle is the unknown factor of how well someone is
going to respond to the pump. Not everyone does long term and you don't
really know that until the baby is older. It is a very real risk that a
baby would need more then a person could pump.

I detest pumping though and so I'm biased ;) I also experienced pump
resistance the last two times.
--
Nikki, mama to
Hunter 4/99
Luke 4/01
Brock 4/06
Ben 4/06