"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

I realize this may not be the exact best newsgroup for this, but I
couldn't
find one dedicated just to father's rights, specifically dealing with
child
support.

I'm in Texas and have been paying (overpaying, actually) for the last 5.5
years. However, I have been making these payments directly to my ex as
we
agreed to that in the beginning. However, due to some recent events I
filed
with the Attorney General's office to have them start garnishing my wages
so everything would be "by the book", and to get it reduced to what it
rightly
should be. Now, of course they have established a case and show that I
owe
$45,000 because nothing shows up "in the system".

They are telling me I have to go back and get copies of all those checks.
Yes, I know I should have kept them...but, I can get them it's just that
it will take time and probably $200-$300 by the time it's all said and
done.

If you're familiar with child support options in Texas, is there another
possible solution? They mentioned that she could come in and sign an
"Affadavit
of Direct Payment" stating that I was current and had been paying her
directly,
but they said she would have to provide the dates, $$$, etc...and I know
she doesn't have that either.

Help!!!

"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

"JSW" wrote in message
...

I realize this may not be the exact best newsgroup for this, but I
couldn't
find one dedicated just to father's rights, specifically dealing with
child
support.

I'm in Texas and have been paying (overpaying, actually) for the last
5.5
years. However, I have been making these payments directly to my ex as
we
agreed to that in the beginning. However, due to some recent events I
filed
with the Attorney General's office to have them start garnishing my
wages
so everything would be "by the book", and to get it reduced to what it
rightly
should be. Now, of course they have established a case and show that I
owe
$45,000 because nothing shows up "in the system".
==
Arggh...You should have come to this group before you got the AG involved.
You would have been advised to NOT, NOT, NOT do that because this
exact thing will happen.
We were in a similar situation of paying the ex directly per the divorce
decree. We lost 7k
of child support when we *had receipts* because the ex signed an affidavit
saying we were behind.
She does not have to prove you are behind--all she needs to do is say you
are. In Florida
the CP's signed affidavit stating you are current would be enough. In our
case, the judge called the 7k
a "gift" because it wasn't paid through DOR but directly to the CP per the
divorce decree. If you have been paying
the fixed amount regularly, I see no reason why she wouldn't have the
dates/amounts. Also,
I don't understand why it would cost you $200-300 to get copies of the
checks.
I usually only advise this in routine family law matters when there is a
significant amount of money involved:
You are in a serious legal/financial dilemma and need to contact a attorney
who is father's rights saavy
(this will take research).
==
==

They are telling me I have to go back and get copies of all those
checks.
Yes, I know I should have kept them...but, I can get them it's just that
it will take time and probably $200-$300 by the time it's all said and
done.

If you're familiar with child support options in Texas, is there another
possible solution? They mentioned that she could come in and sign an
"Affadavit
of Direct Payment" stating that I was current and had been paying her
directly,
but they said she would have to provide the dates, $$$, etc...and I know
she doesn't have that either.

Help!!!

"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

"gini52" wrote
She does not have to prove you are behind--all she
needs to do is say you are. In Florida the CP's signed
affidavit stating you are current would be enough. In
our case, the judge called the 7k a "gift" because it
wasn't paid through DOR but directly to the CP per
the divorce decree.

Getting a bit OT from the original poster's question, but does this mean
that if someone is starting completely from scratch, that the NCP should get
the DOR involved? Just to make sure they can't pull this "gift" payment
**** in the future? My situation didn't turn out bad, but I was considering
doing so. That way, if there were any problems I could say "I don't know,
call the county". I fully understand and agree that mature adults should
work things out for themselves, but how many times do otherwise mature
adults pull dumb-ass **** like this? Too often, and that's part of the
problem.

"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

"gini52" wrote in message
...

In our
case, the judge called the 7k
a "gift" because it wasn't paid through DOR but directly to the CP per the
divorce decree.

ARGH! I just don't understand that!

But, from reading on this board I have heard of this before. (It boggles me
though how that happens, especially if it says IN your divorce decree that X
amount will be paid... and then X amount IS paid... but it is still
considered a "GIFT"???

I kick back half of the CS my ex pays me while the kids are with him for the
summer. He pays the full amount through the courts and then I write him a
personal check for half of the amount. I mark each check "CS Payment - NOT
A GIFT". I sure hope that is enough if this ever comes back to haunt me....

Gini - weren't you able to argue that somehow? Why does it have to go
through the state in order to be considered CS????

"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 13:42:47 -0000, "JSW"
wrote:


I realize this may not be the exact best newsgroup for this, but I
couldn't
find one dedicated just to father's rights, specifically dealing with
child
support.

I'm in Texas and have been paying (overpaying, actually) for the last 5.5
years. However, I have been making these payments directly to my ex as
we
agreed to that in the beginning. However, due to some recent events I
filed
with the Attorney General's office to have them start garnishing my wages
so everything would be "by the book", and to get it reduced to what it
rightly
should be. Now, of course they have established a case and show that I
owe
$45,000 because nothing shows up "in the system".

They are telling me I have to go back and get copies of all those checks.
Yes, I know I should have kept them...but, I can get them it's just that
it will take time and probably $200-$300 by the time it's all said and
done.

If you're familiar with child support options in Texas, is there another
possible solution? They mentioned that she could come in and sign an
"Affadavit
of Direct Payment" stating that I was current and had been paying her
directly,
but they said she would have to provide the dates, $$$, etc...and I know
she doesn't have that either.

Help!!!


There's a better way to do it. Look in your state's civil code under
"request for admissions." Follow that up with a motion for summary
judgment under the same code. Meantime learn your federal rights and
reserve them in as much detail as possible. End of state's case.

Do NOT let them bully you! You have good tools in the law, tools that
most lawyers, strangely, refuse to take advantage of ... maybe because
they're too easy and too dispositive. Use 'em!

Layne

"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

Good luck is all I can tell you!
I too live in Texas, and my child support was modified last fall, which I
expected to happen, and didn't have a problem with that.
The problem that I have is that my divorce was final in May of 1995; the
judge did not sign the divorce decree until the first week of July 1995.
There was a period of 5 weeks of child support that I did pay; my lawyer had
me to send the checks to her office, where my ex wife picked them up and
signed for them.
I was never given credit for those 5 weeks, after arguing all of this time
and providing proof of the checks (front and back) to the Texas Attorney
General's office. So, when we went to court for the modification last fall,
my lawyer explained it all once again, gave them all the proof. My ex does
not deny that she received the money; the AG agreed to give me credit for
the payments, as well as to remove all accrued interest, (which now has the
arreage up to around $1000); Now, 9 months later, I have still not been
given credit, the AG's office treats me like I'm crazy, they have no record
(once again) of the proof of payments that I gave them. They tell me
different stories; they tell me to wait, it takes time; they tell me I have
no business calling about this matter, that only my lawyer can handle this.
Instead they are still charging me interest each month, and also entered a
judgement that I have to pay an extra $30 per month toward arrearages.
Now, my check has been garnished since December 1995, and I have worked for
the same company all of this time. I have been given credit by the state
for everything from the second week of July 1995 through the point in
December 1995 that my company began making the payments. All of the payments
have been made by the company I work for although there are a few payments
that were made late, though, which is beyond my control. The AG's office
says there is nothing they can do about that; even though they have
garnished my pay, and required my employer to withhold the cs $, and make
the payments, it is still my problem, and they can't / won't do anything
about that either.
So, good luck if you're paying child support in Texas!
"JSW" wrote in message
...

I realize this may not be the exact best newsgroup for this, but I
couldn't
find one dedicated just to father's rights, specifically dealing with
child
support.

I'm in Texas and have been paying (overpaying, actually) for the last
5.5
years. However, I have been making these payments directly to my ex as
we
agreed to that in the beginning. However, due to some recent events I
filed
with the Attorney General's office to have them start garnishing my
wages
so everything would be "by the book", and to get it reduced to what it
rightly
should be. Now, of course they have established a case and show that I
owe
$45,000 because nothing shows up "in the system".

They are telling me I have to go back and get copies of all those
checks.
Yes, I know I should have kept them...but, I can get them it's just that
it will take time and probably $200-$300 by the time it's all said and
done.

If you're familiar with child support options in Texas, is there another
possible solution? They mentioned that she could come in and sign an
"Affadavit
of Direct Payment" stating that I was current and had been paying her
directly,
but they said she would have to provide the dates, $$$, etc...and I know
she doesn't have that either.

Help!!!

"Proof" of payments in Texas
 

--
The natural liberty of man is to be free from any superior power on earth,
and not to be under the will or legislative authority of man,
but only to have the law of nature for his rule.
-Samuel Adams


"Bob Whiteside" wrote in message
thlink.net...

"JSW" wrote in message
...

I realize this may not be the exact best newsgroup for this, but I
couldn't
find one dedicated just to father's rights, specifically dealing with
child
support.

I'm in Texas and have been paying (overpaying, actually) for the last
5.5
years. However, I have been making these payments directly to my ex as
we
agreed to that in the beginning. However, due to some recent events I
filed
with the Attorney General's office to have them start garnishing my
wages
so everything would be "by the book", and to get it reduced to what it
rightly
should be. Now, of course they have established a case and show that I
owe
$45,000 because nothing shows up "in the system".

They are telling me I have to go back and get copies of all those
checks.
Yes, I know I should have kept them...but, I can get them it's just
that
it will take time and probably $200-$300 by the time it's all said and
done.

If you're familiar with child support options in Texas, is there
another
possible solution? They mentioned that she could come in and sign an
"Affadavit
of Direct Payment" stating that I was current and had been paying her
directly,
but they said she would have to provide the dates, $$$, etc...and I
know
she doesn't have that either.

Help!!!

You are faced with the "game" CSE plays all the time. When they start a
case file they plug in prior CS payments retroactively as "previously
billed." They then plug in amounts for "previously paid" and "previously
satisfied." What they are doing is including amounts already accrued and
paid so they can take credit for collecting the money.

The problem you have is CSE has placed the burden of proof onto you to
show
you don't owe the erroneous amount they have plugged into your file as the
"previously billed" amount. It's BS, but that's how they do it. By
providing proof of your payment history you will be giving them the amount
to use for "previously paid." If the child's mother provides the
affidavit
she will be providing the amount to use for "previously satisfied."

You may be able to shorten up the time frame you need to go back to prove
your payments. If the $45,000 represents CS accruals from the original
order, and you have had a modification since the original order, you can
show no arrearages were alleged at the time of modification and just show
your payment history from that point forward.

Also, I would challenge CSE to justify how they came up with the $45,000
"previously billed" amount for time periods before they actually set up
the
case file. Ask for their legal authority to use this accounting practice
to
establish erroneous "amounts billed" before they took on the file.

Here's how this played out in my case several years ago. CSE plugged in
an
amount "previously billed" at over $23,000. (I have no idea how they came
up with that amount.) They plugged in over $17,000 for the amount
"previously paid." (I have no idea how they came up with that amount.)
They plugged in $5,500 as the amount "previously satisfied" because I
produced a "partial satisfaction of judgment" for that amount. So CSE
took
credit for collecting $23,000 they really didn't collect to pad their
results and rip off the Federal CSE for added collection-to-cost bonus
money
for an amount they really never collected.


Hey! Sounds like they have a better scam than Enron had. Does Arthur
Anderson do their books?;-)
But seriously, something similar happened to me.
JSW, did your ex collect any Public Assistance? If she did, they might be
charging you with repaying those monies. You should probably go ahead and
get the checks copied for your own protection. I know it's expensive, but it
may save your posterior when all is said and done. Me? I initially paid $230
in check-copying fees to exonerate myself from a $5000 arrearage amount, but
I managed to get some of that back by telling them the copies were to be
entered as evidence.
Good luck!