'Kate wrote:
On 18 Jul 2006 12:26:01 -0700, "miri" the
following was posted in blue dry erase marker:


'Kate wrote:

Of course you worry about their care. But... you can't protect them 24/7
or shelter them from the hurts of the world. They have to learn how to
comfort themselves, avoid trouble, and avoid harm all on their own. I'm
not suggesting not to protect them. I'm simply saying that no matter how
hard we try to avoid them, bad things happen. They happen even if you do
everything right. It's better to teach kids how to take care of their
own needs, physical, emotional, educational, mental... than to raise
whusses, tarts, and others who lack the ability to care for themselves
and wind up turning to drugs/drinking to soothe their hurts.

This is true, but how far is reasonable? I'm strict about drink and
drugs
anywhere near the children, but if they don't have some exposure to
people who drink then theres a risk that it will become a novelty to
them when they're older - (maybe taking them into the city on sunday
morning to see the amounts of naked vomit there is doorways may
be a deterrant? thinks? - better in hot weather....more flies about

A good party atmosphere is a must, but its what it could degenerate
into that freaks me.

There's no sure thing with pre-teens, teens, and the choices that they
make. They will not always make the right choice. It won't be because no
one ever told them if you tell them. Scare tactics don't work. They make
kids think they're invincible because whatever you scared them with
doesn't happen the first time... except on the rare occasion.

I sometimes see kids who started doing drugs at age 8 or 9.


I don't know how you manage. I have enough taking care of myself and my
family... but to be concerned about ex's, ex's cousins, and strange
girlfriends.

I'm fond of them, but I don't get out to socialize very often. If my
friendship wasn't so reasonable - I'd be feeling like a caged rat.
Whatever, its always nice to know that someone important in my
life is doing OK. - even if they don't give a s**t about me. Geeze
I'd have been out and it would have all been forgotten if we'd never
met - I wanted a fresh start and adore the results even tho I also
have to tolerate16 years of him with it. I might not like it, but its
the
way things have to be, and he is a good man. I had a laugh at the
Simpsons, one of Marges sisters was complaining about Homer
"Gee Marge, once you've planted the seeds you throw away the
packet don't you!"

Ok, I could be wrong but here's the standard lecture anyway. You are not
something thrown away. You deserve more than you're getting from your
friendships. It's like... you got angry and didn't know what to do with
it because you couldn't be angry and be liked (or nice) so you shut
down... every once in awhile, you take the hurt and anger out and it
reinforces what other people do to you. I don't know you and how you are
from day to day but I know hurt and pain when I read it. Somewhere in
there, the truth, reality, what is happening today is lost. You are
allowed to tell people what you really do think. That's being respectful
of others. The people you love deserve the chance to take it. They may
even improve how they treat you and learn to value you more. Who knows
where that would eventually lead.


I can imagine you are weary! Ok, I know... 6 hours later than here.
Seriously, though, does worry control you sometimes?

nothing that a good nights rest won't put right, sometimes I give
myself time to go through some photos, old music, old favorite things
that remind me of who I am...NOT the stuff that makes me nostalgic
but stuff like addresses and phone numbers, to help remind me that
there are other people out there.

Ah. So ok.... Try this on for a bit. Imagine working hard to make
everything right for everyone else to the point of having put your needs
aside.... something women often do when they dive into motherhood. Then
your support system deserts you. You're hurt but life goes on... so you
double your efforts to make things right and you succeed - somewhat.
You've still left your needs behind out of necessity... no one could do
both and what the heck, you're good at doing without the emotional
things - someone who cares, someone you can confide in totally, someone
who sees you as you are and is totally accepting. Imagine if that person
wants nothing from you but who you are. Not sex. Not to have children.
Not to clean. Not to provide income... just you. Maybe that idea makes
you so sad that you can't look at it right now... it's not possible to
even touch it without feeling pain. That would be a crisis. It's too
lonely to go through life without being known. And if that's true, then
you're on the edge of a wonderful time of life. You get to look through
what was, figure out what still is, and become what you were meant to
become. That's the only way to survive. It's the only way to live - to
give yourself permission to be who you are - a person with needs, a
person who needs other people, someone who isn't perfect and cannot do
it all, someone who makes mistakes and you know what... doesn't mind one
bit because mistakes don't define who you are anymore than the outside
defines what's inside of a person. You have so much going for you!
You're articulate. You think deeply about issues. You care about others.
You love your child with all your heart. You work hard. You have a keen
sense of right and wrong. And all of that is wonderful.


And you know, angry is ok. It's best to address it with the person that
you're angry at and get it all out so that it doesn't become bigger than
life itself.

I think your ex needs some practice saying no. He absolutely has a ton
of self control.... maybe too much. I wonder what he gets out of being
so self-sacrificing that he'd risk his daughter's safety.

I wonder somehow, does he try to make my loneliness worse? what
benefit to him to tell me about the party invites he's had, so and so's
wedding, who shagged who?

Yeah... why is that? If you don't want to hear about the parties and the
wedding and the shagging, then tell him you don't want to hear about it.
Let him deal with it. He's a grown up. And if not, then that's his
problem, not yours.

Long lecture... sorry 'bout that.

Yeh its my fault too, I'm in the mommy daddy mindset....but he is
equally to blame, there again thats right because the kids know
who their parents are & we're not fighting. Guys love the idea that
mom's still close, the nursery's clean and she will always be there
to forgive, listen and virtuously await to serve the next meal.

In actuality I think it goes more like this, your parents never had
sex,
sex was dirty. The day comes when you have a baby, he wants to
make sure that you're not exposed to anything that might put the
baby at risk of filth, he could be mistaken for wanting his mom
back, (what a depressing scenario) & women are often tucked tidily
away with their children, freaking out being told how dreadful people
are behaving, when they damned well understand if he cast his mind
back a little, both of you actually made little poopypants upon using
similar formulas.

The porn industry has a lot to offer the lonely guy, but the stuff
they're exposed to and the manner in which its presented turns
natural human experience into filth. I think if it widens the gap any
further between womanhood and fertility, moms will be 'baby
making machines' with no self-respect regards their own
sexuality. My family were fairly broad minded, with no readers
but his attitude considering he reads that stuff (equivalent most
men) is so strange, he's the very first person to complain about it!
Talk about dual standards! Anyway, that'll maybe make another
thread.

The thing is Kate, if my best friend came round for a chat and
a cup of tea to gossip I'd turn a deaf ear to most of it, because
she wouldn't be my best friend. My best friend would be asking
me what time I could arrange a babysitter so we could both go
out and party. She might have thought about asking if she could
bring a friend along to a wedding between people we both knew,
or ask me if I'd like to send them a congratulations card and gift.
He's a F****** B******, an theres no way out. I'm not his mother
superior, or our blessed virgin or some kinda confessor. It is
impossible for me to live according to B's template of his perfect
woman. Could anyone here do it? He's a man and I'm a woman,
it works while the children are young, but heck I've got to.....
get out of the house more often.

Phew! Time I thought of something else, I'll mow the lawn and
relax in the heat, scrub out the pool and turn a sprinkler on the
kids before they dry out,

Best,

Miri