A Parenting & kids forum. ParentingBanter.com

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » ParentingBanter.com forum » alt.support » Child Support
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Things to think of before you get married again..



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #161  
Old October 10th 06, 07:22 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Tracy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 97
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

"Fred" wrote in message
. net...
All I'm asking is that both men and women take responsibility for their
choices. What's wrong with that?


There is nothing wrong with asking both men and women to take responsibility
for their choices, and I'll add actions. It is no different then my s2bx
trying to place blaim on me for his drinking problem, and prior to me it was
his first ex-wife's fault. There are those who refuse to take
responsibility for their actions/choices and then there those who see they
are responsible for their actions/choices.

Tracy


  #162  
Old October 10th 06, 07:43 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Andre Lieven
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 80
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

"Tracy" ) writes:
"Fred" wrote in message
. net...
All I'm asking is that both men and women take responsibility for their
choices. What's wrong with that?


There is nothing wrong with asking both men and women to take
responsibility for their choices, and I'll add actions.


Since men get NO choices and are NOT allowed any *post-coital* actions,
trying to hold men responsible for women's SOLE actions and choices is...

SEXIST.

It is no different then my s2bx trying to place blaim on me for his
drinking problem, and prior to me it was his first ex-wife's fault.


Indeed. Just as it is for a woman to *choose to carry to term ALONE*,
and then demand free money for HER sole choices and actions.

There are those who refuse to take
responsibility for their actions/choices and then there those who see they
are responsible for their actions/choices.


The former group are called Feminists.

Andre

  #163  
Old October 10th 06, 09:00 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Moon Shyne
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 427
Default Things to think of before you get married again..


"teachrmama" wrote in message
...

"Moon Shyne" wrote in message
...

"Ken Chaddock" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Fred wrote:
Gini wrote:

"teachrmama" wrote
............................

And you, Fred, are totally *dismissing* WOMEN'S responsibilities! I
am a woman, and I find it demeaning that you keep harping on what MEN
should do, but not a hint about how WOMEN should handle their
responibilities in the same situation. Everything a woman does after
the sex act is a consequence of where that mean old man left his
semen. Nonsense! Or maybe I'm just reading you wrong--why don't you
clearly delineate what the woman's responsibilities are after the
consequence of pregnancy becomes an issue.

==
A ride to the CSE office? (Because she's *owed* it, of course.)


I guess that the matter is best explained by reference to the theme of
the game Fable: "For every choice, a consequence."

It's too bad that you seem to grasp the obvious fact that all post
conception choices are the woman's and therefore, in accordance with the
precepts of "Natural/Fundamental" Justice, all the consequences that
follow from those choices should also be hers.


So he chooses to spread his semen hither and yon, and she chooses to
let him spread it in her. And let's say that the consequence is
pregnancy.

But that's as far as the "consequence" of his "spreading his sperm
around" go. After that the woman has many options and CHOICES...even if
she decides (note the word "decides") not to abort the fetus, that to,
is a CHOICE, the consequence of which will most likely be the birth of a
child...


And if the child is born, how does that absolve the man from any
responsibility for or to the child?
Isn't it still 50% genetically his child, and legally his child as well?


Now there are other choices to be made, in this case by her, and from
those choices will spring consequences in turn.

Yes, as I noted above, but ALL post conception choices are HER choices,
to hold him responsible for the consequences that follow from HER
choices is fundamentally unfair, unjust and, on top of all that, most
likely unconstitutional...


So because she has choices that pertain strictly to undergoing (or not
undergoing) a medical and surgical procedure, you think this absolves the
man from any responsibility, even though it's still his child?


When the father legally has 50% of the rights to match his
responsibilities, the we can come back to his responsibilities toward the
child. Until he becomes an actual parent in the life of the child he
helped create--50/50 with the mother, he also should not be the bankroll.


So if one parent dumps all of the responsibility onto the other parent, the
parent shouldering the responsibility gets all the rights, and the parent
who dumped their responsibilities gets no rights?





  #164  
Old October 10th 06, 09:34 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Ken Chaddock
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 53
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

Moon Shyne wrote:

"teachrmama" wrote in message
...

"Moon Shyne" wrote in message
...

"Ken Chaddock" wrote in message
news:[email protected]

Fred wrote:

Gini wrote:


"teachrmama" wrote
............................


And you, Fred, are totally *dismissing* WOMEN'S responsibilities! I
am a woman, and I find it demeaning that you keep harping on what MEN
should do, but not a hint about how WOMEN should handle their
responibilities in the same situation. Everything a woman does after
the sex act is a consequence of where that mean old man left his
semen. Nonsense! Or maybe I'm just reading you wrong--why don't you
clearly delineate what the woman's responsibilities are after the
consequence of pregnancy becomes an issue.

==
A ride to the CSE office? (Because she's *owed* it, of course.)



I guess that the matter is best explained by reference to the theme of
the game Fable: "For every choice, a consequence."

It's too bad that you seem to grasp the obvious fact that all post
conception choices are the woman's and therefore, in accordance with the
precepts of "Natural/Fundamental" Justice, all the consequences that
follow from those choices should also be hers.



So he chooses to spread his semen hither and yon, and she chooses to
let him spread it in her. And let's say that the consequence is
pregnancy.

But that's as far as the "consequence" of his "spreading his sperm
around" go. After that the woman has many options and CHOICES...even if
she decides (note the word "decides") not to abort the fetus, that to,
is a CHOICE, the consequence of which will most likely be the birth of a
child...

And if the child is born, how does that absolve the man from any
responsibility for or to the child?
Isn't it still 50% genetically his child, and legally his child as well?


Now there are other choices to be made, in this case by her, and from
those choices will spring consequences in turn.

Yes, as I noted above, but ALL post conception choices are HER choices,
to hold him responsible for the consequences that follow from HER
choices is fundamentally unfair, unjust and, on top of all that, most
likely unconstitutional...

So because she has choices that pertain strictly to undergoing (or not
undergoing) a medical and surgical procedure, you think this absolves the
man from any responsibility, even though it's still his child?


When the father legally has 50% of the rights to match his
responsibilities, the we can come back to his responsibilities toward the
child. Until he becomes an actual parent in the life of the child he
helped create--50/50 with the mother, he also should not be the bankroll.



So if one parent dumps all of the responsibility onto the other parent, the
parent shouldering the responsibility gets all the rights, and the parent
who dumped their responsibilities gets no rights?


Exactly...as long as it was voluntary. Just as the father
shouldn't/doesn't have the right to force the mother to abort or not to
abort, the mother shouldn't/doesn't have the right to exclude the father
against his will...it's *ALL* about BOTH PARENTS having a *FREE* choice...

....Ken
  #165  
Old October 10th 06, 09:40 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Bob Whiteside
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 981
Default Things to think of before you get married again..


"Fred" wrote in message
. net...
Bob Whiteside wrote:
"Fred" wrote in message
. net...
Tripped over it again, did you?

Phil wrote:

You also raise another interesting problem: what if the mother
doesn't tell him about the pregnancy, does he STILL have
responsibilities and what are they?
It's still his semen, right? I mean, just because he doesn't know

that
he did something doesn't mean that he didn't do it. So yeah, he still
has a degree of moral accountability, and if the child is alive, he
definitely has legal accountability.
How so?
Because it's his semen.

"His semen, his choice, his responsibility."

What about the moral responsibility she should have to at least
inform him of the pregnancy?
You keep trying that sleazy trick, but it's not gonna work.

That she has such a moral responsibility does not serve to negate any
responsibility that he has.

What I'm asking you to do is to accept the responsibilities that *you*
have, and you respond by resisting that with every fiber of your being.

Disgusting.


Your little feminist biology lesson is based on wishful thinking and not
established biological information.


It's not his semen? Whose semen is it, hers? You're gonna tell us that
she impregnated herself? Or are you going for immaculate conception?


All of those questions are irrelevant. Despite your claims of being so
knowledgable about biology, not one woman has ever gotten pregnant from
semen. In fact, men who have had a vasectomy produce just as much semen as
men who have not.


How hard is it to understand eggs are a scarcer resource than sperm?


And how, exactly, does that negate the biological fact that it's his
semen, and that without his semen there's no pregnancy?


See above. It's not the semen - It's the presence of viable sperm that
cause pregnancies.


What y'all are all about is negating the male's responsibility by
pointing to the female's responsibility. Well, last time I read a
biology book, it took two to procreate, which makes both of them
responsible for the outcome.


That's a value judgment on your part that has nothing to do what me or other
men think.


To say men are responsible for women's bad choices in sperm is to

transfer
the biological misjudgments made by women to men.


So don't say that. I haven't, and you shouldn't, either.


I'll say whatever I want to say. Feminists can't accept their biological
destiny so they try to blame men for their poor choices in sperm providers.
If it were the other way around, women would pay men for getting them
pregnant to thank them for contributing their sperm.


The femwits who can't
accept their biological destiny want to have the state step in with

remedies
to cover up their biological mistakes. The state's solution is to use

men's
money to cover-up the lack of responsibility by women who don't select

good
mates.


And as always with y'all shirkers, it's all about the money.

At least you are honest enough to admit it, I'll give you that.

Problem is, the facts don't support your desired conclusions, so you're
forced to resort to falsehoods, spin, and assorted trickery.


Just making an accusation does not prove it is true. How about some
specifics?

But you
can't get past the essential facts:

"His semen, his choice, his responsibility."

"Her body, her choice, her responsibility."

"For every choice, a consequence."


So how about detailing what you believe are a woman's responsibilities since
you don't like my perspective?


  #166  
Old October 10th 06, 09:50 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Fred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 62
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

wrote:
Fred -

You are Fred aren't you, and not Cindy, Sharon, Luoise, or some other
feminist disguising yourself to make it look like you are chivalrous?


What kind of a stupid question is that?

[more abject stupidity deleted]
  #167  
Old October 10th 06, 10:01 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Fred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 62
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

Ken Chaddock wrote:
Fred wrote:

Ken Chaddock wrote:

Fred wrote:

Gini wrote:

"teachrmama" wrote
............................

And you, Fred, are totally *dismissing* WOMEN'S responsibilities!
I am a woman, and I find it demeaning that you keep harping on
what MEN should do, but not a hint about how WOMEN should handle
their responibilities in the same situation. Everything a woman
does after the sex act is a consequence of where that mean old man
left his semen. Nonsense! Or maybe I'm just reading you
wrong--why don't you clearly delineate what the woman's
responsibilities are after the consequence of pregnancy becomes an
issue.


==
A ride to the CSE office? (Because she's *owed* it, of course.)


I guess that the matter is best explained by reference to the theme
of the game Fable: "For every choice, a consequence."


It's too bad that you seem to grasp the obvious fact that all
post conception choices are the woman's and therefore, in accordance
with the precepts of "Natural/Fundamental" Justice, all the
consequences that follow from those choices should also be hers.



I am aware of what Canada's notion of "natural justice". I know that
it allows Canada to declare age discrimination to be legal even though
it is unconstitutional; see McKinney v. University of Guelph. So if
you expect me to buy any argument based on that concept, you are
swimming upstream.

I read your entire message. What it boils down to is yet another
attempt to evade your responsibilities by ignoring the doctrine of
informed consent. Sorry, but men can't just spread their semen hither
and yon and walk away from the consequences thereof because those
consequences are ... *inconvenient*. That's "inconvenient" as in
financially inconvenient, because at the end of the day it's always
about the money with y'all.


Yes, it's easier to cut the article and make some unrelated,
self-serving comments when you can't rebut the points made...


I did rebut your crap, in whole. More efficient to do it that way than
in pieces, and the result is the same.

All you want to do is to be able to walk away from the mess you make
when you spread your sperm hither and yon, because being responsible is
so *inconvenient*, mostly to your wallet, which is the bottom line with
you boys anyway. Y'all deny informed consent, y'all deny fairness and
equity, y'all deny the child itself. It is the ultimate selfishness.

Disgusting.
  #168  
Old October 10th 06, 10:10 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Fred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 62
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

Gini wrote:
"Fred" wrote
.........................
I read your entire message. What it boils down to is yet another attempt
to evade your responsibilities by ignoring the doctrine of informed
consent. Sorry, but men can't just spread their semen hither and yon and
walk away from the consequences thereof because those consequences are ...
*inconvenient*. That's "inconvenient" as in financially inconvenient,
because at the end of the day it's always about the money with y'all.

It's disgusting, really.

==
Then I presume you find it equally disgusting when the mother does the same,
such as abortion, baby dropoff?


What's "baby dropoff"?

  #169  
Old October 10th 06, 10:12 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Fred
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 62
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

Gini wrote:
wrote
Fred -

You are Fred aren't you, and not Cindy, Sharon, Luoise, or some other
feminist disguising yourself to make it look like you are chivalrous?

==
We frequently get the male feminists when they are the second husband and
resent the
bio dad's boat, car, food, etc. They all seem to think bio dad owes them a
higher standard of living.
Really, they do.


Bio dad owes second husband nothing.

Bio dad owes his kids. He is, after all, bio dad.

  #170  
Old October 10th 06, 10:43 PM posted to alt.mens-rights,alt.child-support,alt.support.divorce
Andre Lieven
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 80
Default Things to think of before you get married again..

Fred ([email protected]*******) proves that Feminism IS brain rot:
Gini wrote:
"Fred" whined and fled refutations of his
misandry:
.........................
I read your entire message. What it boils down to is yet another attempt
to evade your responsibilities by ignoring the doctrine of informed
consent. Sorry, but men can't just spread their semen hither and yon and
walk away from the consequences thereof because those consequences are ...
*inconvenient*. That's "inconvenient" as in financially inconvenient,
because at the end of the day it's always about the money with y'all.

It's disgusting, really.

==
Then I presume you find it equally disgusting when the mother does the
same, such as abortion, baby dropoff?


What's "baby dropoff"?


Gads, are you clueless ! Google " Legal Abandon Laws ". 40 states have
them, which are NON medical and NON biolical LEGAL means by which a
mother of an infant can LEGALLY relinquish said infant with NO further
legal obligations to said child, EVER.

Its pure misandrous sexism to offer this to women, when they *already
have ALL the other post-coital choices*, while denying EQUAL legal
rights to men.

You're a Festering Femmeroid, the lowest of all life. You further
prove it by knowing NOTHING about the Real World in all this.

Ptui.

Andre



 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
misc.kids FAQ on Good things about having kids [email protected] Info and FAQ's 0 February 28th 05 06:27 AM
Parent-Child Negotiations Nathan A. Barclay Spanking 623 January 28th 05 05:24 AM
misc.kids FAQ on Good things about having kids [email protected] Info and FAQ's 0 December 29th 04 06:26 AM
misc.kids FAQ on Good things about having kids [email protected] Info and FAQ's 0 November 28th 04 06:16 AM
misc.kids FAQ on Good things about having kids [email protected] Info and FAQ's 0 June 28th 04 07:42 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:08 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2021 ParentingBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.