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  #571  
Old June 4th 04, 08:12 PM
Bob LeChevalier
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Holger Dansk wrote:
On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 11:34:41 GMT, "Fletch F. Fletch"
wrote:
-------------------
You need a course in linguistics - written vowels were merely written
first by the Indians and Greeks, and before that written language was
merely a form of consonantal shorthand for speech. It doesn't mean
people didn't SAY the vowels!!!
Steve

Eureka!!!!!!!!!!!! There you go!!!!!!!!!! The Greeks were the first
to put the vowels in the alphabet!!!!! You finally got it!!!!!!!


Yet another tread-worn forensic device: declare victory while being
slaughtered.

But did you finally get the idea that the conclusions you were drawing were
based on a complete misunderstanding of this whole subject?


I understand the subject. Just as I said in my post of 6/2, a copy of
which is below :

I'm not claiming anything. I'm stating the fact that the Greeks were
the first people to put vowels in language.


False statement.

Prior to that time, it was all consonants in all languages.


False statement.

With vowels, they could make more words


False statement.

and do more thinking.


False statement.

(We think with words.)


Partially true statement.

This gave them an advantage over other civilizations.


Partially true statement.

This meant, of course, that they put them in their alphabet because
that's what their language was written with.


Backpedaling statement.

lojbab
--
lojbab
Bob LeChevalier, Founder, The Logical Language Group
(Opinions are my own; I do not speak for the organization.)
Artificial language Loglan/Lojban:
http://www.lojban.org
  #572  
Old June 4th 04, 08:14 PM
toto
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On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 09:32:34 GMT, wrote:

I'd like to check that out. Got a URL for any good Nubian DAFNfotoz ??
The leaders, not the slaves imported from sub-Sahara...


http://www.homestead.com/wysinger/kingtaharqa.html

http://oi.uchicago.edu/OI/PROJ/NUB/N..._brochure.html

The earliest of the Nubian cultures (the A-Group and C-Group)
were located in northern Nubia. Until recently it was thought that
A-Group people were semi-nomadic herdsmen. However, new
research suggests that a line of kings 1ived in Qustul in northern
Nubia as early as, or perhaps even earlier than, the first
pharaohs of Egypt. The people of these early cultures buried
their dead in stone-lined pit graves, accompanied by pottery
and cosmetic articles. At this time, Nubia was known to the
Egyptians as "Ta Sety," the "Land of the Bow," because of the
fame of Nubian archers.

By 1550 B.C. kings at Kerma were ruling Nubia. They were
buried in huge round tombs, accompanied by hundreds of
sacrificed retainers. People of the Kerma culture were
accomplished metal workers, and they also made thin-walled
pottery on a wheel. This was a time of increased contact
between Egypt and "Kush," as Nubia was then called.

Egypt dominated parts of Nubia from about 1950 to 1000 B.C.
Forts, trading posts and Egyptianstyle temples were built in
Kush, and the Nubian elite adopted the worship of Egyptian
gods and even the Egyptian hieroglyphic writing system. The
gold, ebony and ivory of Nubia contributed to the material
wealth of Egypt, and many of the famed treasures of the
Egyptian kings were made of products from Nubia.

By 800 B.C., Egypt had fragmented into rival states. In 747
B.C., the city of Thebes in southern Egypt was threatened by
northerners, and the Egyptians called upon the Nubian king
for protection. The Ku****e king, Piye, marched north from
hiscapitalatNapata,rescuedThebesandreunified Egypt. For
the next 100 years, Ku****e kings ruled both Nubia and Egypt.
This era was brought to a close by the invasion of Assyrian
armies in 663 B.C., and the Nubian king fled south to his
capital at Napata.

By 200 B.C., the capital had shifted yet farther south to
Meroe, where the kings continued to be buried in pyramid
tombs and to build temples to Nubian and Egyptian gods in
a hybrid EgyptianRoman-African style. Roman historians
record the skirmishes and treaties which marked the relation
ship of Roman Egypt and Nubia.


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..

The Outer Limits
  #573  
Old June 4th 04, 08:41 PM
[email protected]
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toto wrote:

On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 09:32:34 GMT, wrote:

I'd like to check that out. Got a URL for any good Nubian DAFNfotoz ??
The leaders, not the slaves imported from sub-Sahara...


http://www.homestead.com/wysinger/kingtaharqa.html


Those sculptures are obviously all the IQ-65 DAFN_slavez, servantz,
and concubinez the Nubians imported from CongoBongo...
  #574  
Old June 4th 04, 09:42 PM
toto
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On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 19:41:36 GMT, wrote:



toto wrote:

On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 09:32:34 GMT,
wrote:

I'd like to check that out. Got a URL for any good Nubian DAFNfotoz ??
The leaders, not the slaves imported from sub-Sahara...


http://www.homestead.com/wysinger/kingtaharqa.html


Those sculptures are obviously all the IQ-65 DAFN_slavez, servantz,
and concubinez the Nubians imported from CongoBongo...


LOL. Yeah, *sure.* They made huge statues of slaves not of the
pharoahs. That makes lots of sense.

Aside from that if you have ever actually been to Egypt and visited
the various pyramids in person, you will see that many of the pharoahs
in Egypt itself had what you would consider *negroid* features.
Racial mixing was quite common in Ancient Egypt.


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..

The Outer Limits
  #575  
Old June 5th 04, 12:57 AM
Holger Dansk
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On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 15:06:07 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:

Holger Dansk wrote:
Where were they doing this? Who was doing it? You real sure there was
anyone in that location 3,000 years ago?


Yes.

Northern Europe prehistory goes back as far as 8000 years:
http://www.comp-archaeology.org/Cent...Chronology.htm

http://www.angelfire.com/me/ij/britishBA.html#chr
is a chronology of prehistoric Britain going back almost 5000 years.


Well, you didn't say where and who you were talking about.

lojbab


Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm
  #577  
Old June 5th 04, 01:06 AM
Holger Dansk
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On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 15:08:51 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:

Holger Dansk wrote:
There were some Nubians scattered around, and a lot of different tribes,
but the pharaohs were Copts.


You mission, should you decide to accept it, is to prove that the
pharaohs were "white".


Why are you so interested in skin color?

The Copts were not Negroes.

All of the black savages back then were below the Sahara desert.

lojbab


Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm
  #578  
Old June 5th 04, 01:09 AM
Bob LeChevalier
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Holger Dansk wrote:
On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 15:08:51 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:
Holger Dansk wrote:
There were some Nubians scattered around, and a lot of different tribes,
but the pharaohs were Copts.


You mission, should you decide to accept it, is to prove that the
pharaohs were "white".


Why are you so interested in skin color?


I'm not. But this discussion started with a claim about what was done
by "whites and Asians".

The Copts were not Negroes.


Your evidence?

All of the black savages back then were below the Sahara desert.


Your evidence?

lojbab
--
lojbab
Bob LeChevalier, Founder, The Logical Language Group
(Opinions are my own; I do not speak for the organization.)
Artificial language Loglan/Lojban:
http://www.lojban.org
  #579  
Old June 5th 04, 02:28 AM
Circe
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Holger Dansk wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jun 2004 12:10:10 -0700, "Circe"
wrote:
Holger Dansk wrote:
On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 02:31:45 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:
wrote:
Bob LeChevalier wrote:
Guess those people in Upper Egypt weren't reading and writing.

Mediterranean types were essentially white (as opposed to DAFN).

No. The people of Upper Egypt were also called Nubians. They
conquered and ruled Egypt for a millennium or so.

The pharaohs were Copts.


*Some* of the pharoahs were Copts--after the invention of
Christianity, anyway. In view of the fact that the flowering of
Egyptian civilization preceded the birth of Christianity by
several thousand years, I think it is quite safe to say that the
rulers of upper Egypts between 3500 BCE and about 100 AD were most
certainly *not* Copts or, in fact, Christians of any kind.


The Copts were not Christians when they were pharaohs.


Ah, then you are using Copt in the older, less typical sense. And in that
case, it just means they "Egyptian". The word "Copt" tells us nothing about
skin color or any other features, especially when applied to ancient
Egyptians. Given that the ancient Egyptians represented the skin color of
their pharoahs in art using colors ranging from light brown to black, we
cannot use their artistic representations as any sort of guide. And since
none of us were living at the time, there's no way to tell for certain what
"color" the ancient Egyptian pharaohs were. Most experts believe the ancient
Egyptians were mixed ethnically with a strong strain of sub-Saharan
influence.

Moreover, of course, being a Christian (Coptic or otherwise) does
not say anything at all about one's ethnicity or skin color.


I don't know what color has to do with it, but I can assure you that
they were not the black-Sub-Saharan-Savages.

I agree. Of course, I reject the entire concept of there being any groups of
people who are "savages" in the first place, whatever their skin color may
happen to be, so I'm pretty easy to assure on that premise.
--
Be well, Barbara

All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful.
Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its
other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin' for a
fight. -- with apologies to Michael Feldman


  #580  
Old June 5th 04, 07:34 AM
Holger Dansk
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On Fri, 4 Jun 2004 18:28:10 -0700, "Circe" wrote:

Holger Dansk wrote:
On Fri, 4 Jun 2004 12:10:10 -0700, "Circe"
wrote:
Holger Dansk wrote:
On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 02:31:45 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:
wrote:
Bob LeChevalier wrote:
Guess those people in Upper Egypt weren't reading and writing.

Mediterranean types were essentially white (as opposed to DAFN).

No. The people of Upper Egypt were also called Nubians. They
conquered and ruled Egypt for a millennium or so.

The pharaohs were Copts.

*Some* of the pharoahs were Copts--after the invention of
Christianity, anyway. In view of the fact that the flowering of
Egyptian civilization preceded the birth of Christianity by
several thousand years, I think it is quite safe to say that the
rulers of upper Egypts between 3500 BCE and about 100 AD were most
certainly *not* Copts or, in fact, Christians of any kind.


The Copts were not Christians when they were pharaohs.


Ah, then you are using Copt in the older, less typical sense. And in that
case, it just means they "Egyptian". The word "Copt" tells us nothing about
skin color or any other features, especially when applied to ancient
Egyptians. Given that the ancient Egyptians represented the skin color of
their pharoahs in art using colors ranging from light brown to black, we
cannot use their artistic representations as any sort of guide. And since
none of us were living at the time, there's no way to tell for certain what
"color" the ancient Egyptian pharaohs were. Most experts believe the ancient
Egyptians were mixed ethnically with a strong strain of sub-Saharan
influence.


The black savages of Sub-Saharan-Africa had nothing to do with the
civilization north of the Sahara. The blacks were uncivilized living in
the bush/jungle running around naked or in loin cloths, not just at one
period, but for thousands of years. Most are still savages, and they
own and abuse slaves in the Sudan, and commit all kinds of atrocities.
They never created anything of any importance. As I said before, they
carved some ugly figures out of wood. Can you imagine living that way
for thousands and thousands of years?

Moreover, of course, being a Christian (Coptic or otherwise) does
not say anything at all about one's ethnicity or skin color.


I don't know what color has to do with it, but I can assure you that
they were not the black-Sub-Saharan-Savages.

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm
 




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