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#11
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lenny fackler wrote:
Ericka Kammerer wrote: It's a really tough situation, and can even be a marriage-breaker in some cases. When the issue is 'kids' vs. 'no kids' maybe, but you think a woman would break up a marriage because her husband doesn't want a third? That seems insane to me. In my opinion, if a couple already has two healthy children and disagree about having a third, the partner not wanting another child clearly has the upper hand. Of course, because it's not ethical to force the other parent into parenting another child. However, there are certainly women (and men) who have felt such a strong desire for another child that they were unable to continue in a marriage where that could not happen. One hopes such decisions are made only after a best faith effort on both sides, and counseling, and so forth, but if after all that, the bottom line is that the desire for another child is paramount, it's likely to spell the end of the marriage. Best wishes, Ericka |
#12
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In article , Ericka Kammerer says...
lenny fackler wrote: Ericka Kammerer wrote: It's a really tough situation, and can even be a marriage-breaker in some cases. When the issue is 'kids' vs. 'no kids' maybe, but you think a woman would break up a marriage because her husband doesn't want a third? That seems insane to me. In my opinion, if a couple already has two healthy children and disagree about having a third, the partner not wanting another child clearly has the upper hand. Of course, because it's not ethical to force the other parent into parenting another child. Why, exactly, is it more ethical (or even not unethical at all) to force another into parenting a child than to force another not to have a child? I just don't see this clear-cut assymetry others seem to. (I'm not talking practicalities, I'm talking ethics.) Banty |
#13
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Ericka Kammerer wrote: lenny fackler wrote: Ericka Kammerer wrote: It's a really tough situation, and can even be a marriage-breaker in some cases. When the issue is 'kids' vs. 'no kids' maybe, but you think a woman would break up a marriage because her husband doesn't want a third? That seems insane to me. In my opinion, if a couple already has two healthy children and disagree about having a third, the partner not wanting another child clearly has the upper hand. Of course, because it's not ethical to force the other parent into parenting another child. However, there are certainly women (and men) who have felt such a strong desire for another child that they were unable to continue in a marriage where that could not happen. One hopes such decisions are made only after a best faith effort on both sides, and counseling, and so forth, but if after all that, the bottom line is that the desire for another child is paramount, it's likely to spell the end of the marriage. Maybe so, but if one person wants an additional child so badly that they would cause, or accept, or simply allow the destruction of their family, it would almost seem to me indicative of a mental illness or at least some serious underlying issues that having more kids isn't going to solve. |
#14
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"Scott" wrote in message ... My wife and I have an 8-year-old son, and a 5-year-old daughter. My wife would like a third. There are times when my wife accepts not having a third, but she'll frequently find herself wanting another. She is worried she'll regret not having another one, and the ones we have are growing some quickly. We had our third when dd#1 was 7 and dd#2 was 5. I asked dd#2 recently, and she said she did resent not being the 'baby' anymore when dd#3 came along. I haven't asked dd#1. We always intended to have 4 except that dh said if the first three were girls (which they were) we couldn't afford 4 girls. So if there was any disagreement between us, it would have been whether I wanted any children or not. It didn't occur to me to express that doubt, so I went on ahead and was happy to have children. There are some women however who really like babies. A friend of my mom was really a new baby person - she loved visiting people with new babies. My own mom said she'd like to have a 3 month old around all the time. I know another lady who had a hysterectomy who said her dh didn't like it when she held people's babies because she'd want one for herself. It sounds like that is your wife's situation because you say that she worries that she will regret not having another one because they grow up so quickly.. Maybe it is just that she really likes little babies/toddlers. I was not in that situation - I preferred the kids when they were older. I also don't know how much this has to do with your wife's age and perhaps approaching menopause. . Some women get quite broody, and lose confidence as this time approaches. I know two younger women - one wanted to have her first child before she was 30 (and she barely made the deadline), and the other got married at 40 so she could have a child. As much as I try, I can not come to terms with having a third. I try, but for a variety of reasons, I don't want another one, but I worry about my wife. Does your wife know what your concerns are? If they are monetary, something can always be worked out. If it is that you DON'T like little babies as much as you like the older kids, and your wife just loves little babies, maybe you could do as a friend of mine did - she took foster babies while the court was figuring out how to place them. (She had two older children, and then one that was about 10 years younger, and then she adopted one of the foster babies that was about the same age.) grandma Rosalie |
#15
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lenny fackler wrote:
Maybe so, but if one person wants an additional child so badly that they would cause, or accept, or simply allow the destruction of their family, it would almost seem to me indicative of a mental illness or at least some serious underlying issues that having more kids isn't going to solve. I don't think that's necessarily true. Your statement is predicated upon certain values assumptions which not everyone might share. Also, the decision about having more kids tends to involve more than just the presence or absence of a child. It's also about family values and lifestyle and so forth. The person who very much wants another child likely has different ideas about those other things all wrapped up in the decision as well. Best wishes, Ericka |
#16
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Banty wrote:
In article , Ericka Kammerer says... Of course, because it's not ethical to force the other parent into parenting another child. Why, exactly, is it more ethical (or even not unethical at all) to force another into parenting a child than to force another not to have a child? I just don't see this clear-cut assymetry others seem to. (I'm not talking practicalities, I'm talking ethics.) I don't think *either* is ethical. If no compromise is possible, then the only alternative is for the person who wants children to have them solo or with someone else. One hopes, of course, that it's possible for the couple to negotiate some solution that works for both before it gets to that point. If it does get to that point, then I think *both* parties are equally responsible for the breakup--one for being unable to deal with more children and the other for being unable to deal with no more children. Best wishes, Ericka |
#17
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Ericka Kammerer wrote:
I don't think *either* is ethical. If no compromise is possible, then the only alternative is for the person who wants children to have them solo or with someone else. One hopes, of course, that it's possible for the couple to negotiate some solution that works for both before it gets to that point. Yes and if we are talking ethics it is no longer about the man and woman if you are talking about a '3rd' child. Ethically they should take the first two into account as well. -- Nikki |
#18
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Ericka Kammerer wrote: lenny fackler wrote: Maybe so, but if one person wants an additional child so badly that they would cause, or accept, or simply allow the destruction of their family, it would almost seem to me indicative of a mental illness or at least some serious underlying issues that having more kids isn't going to solve. I don't think that's necessarily true. Your statement is predicated upon certain values assumptions which not everyone might share. Also, the decision about having more kids tends to involve more than just the presence or absence of a child. It's also about family values and lifestyle and so forth. The person who very much wants another child likely has different ideas about those other things all wrapped up in the decision as well. Best wishes, Ericka I'm definitely bringing my own perpective in because it's the only one that I have the authority to speak about. I have 2 happy healthy kids and my relationship with my wife is good. I'm 100% sure I don't want any more kids. She's a little less sure. I'm trying to picture her being so insistent on having another baby that she would break up the marriage. It certainly would have nothing to do with any definition of family values that I can think of. Lifestyle is broad though. What type of lifestyle would this be consistent with? |
#19
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"lenny fackler" wrote in message
ups.com... Maybe so, but if one person wants an additional child so badly that they would cause, or accept, or simply allow the destruction of their family, it would almost seem to me indicative of a mental illness or at least some serious underlying issues that having more kids isn't going to solve. Would you say the same if the couple were childless and one wanted one or more children while the other didn't? The desire to have more children than one currently has isn't more or less valid because one either does or does not have a particular number of them at present. -- Be well, Barbara Mom to Mr. Congeniality (7), the Diva (5) and the Race Car Fanatic (3) I have PMS and ESP...I'm the bitch who knows everything! (T-shirt slogan) |
#20
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"lenny fackler" wrote in message
ups.com... I'm definitely bringing my own perpective in because it's the only one that I have the authority to speak about. I have 2 happy healthy kids and my relationship with my wife is good. I'm 100% sure I don't want any more kids. She's a little less sure. I'm trying to picture her being so insistent on having another baby that she would break up the marriage. Could you imagine her being so insistent on having the first or the second baby that she would have broken up the marriage over it? If you can, then you are deluding yourself to believe that just because you have two happy, healthy kids, her desire to have another child could not be just as overwhelming as her desire to have the first or the second. I'm not saying that it *is* that overwhelming, mind you, just that the fact that you already have two children doesn't have to play into the equation at all. It certainly would have nothing to do with any definition of family values that I can think of. Lifestyle is broad though. What type of lifestyle would this be consistent with? Some people have family values and/or lifestyles that involve having more than two children. In some cases, a *lot* more than two children. For some people, having a large number of children may be a religious imperative, as well. One would hope that a couple would both have the same desire for a large family and/or the same religious imperatives, of course, but people can and do change in the course of a marriage. I'll be honest: I have a far harder time understanding the position of the partner who is dead-set against having another child than the position of the partner who really wants that other child. Maybe that's because, even when my husband I decided we wouldn't be having any more children, we still want more children. But once you have children, having more children doesn't change anything essential: whether you have more or not, you're still parents with children! At the same time, I feel the wishes of the partner who doesn't want another child take precedence over the wishes of the partner who does. But I can see how the views of a spouse who wants more children and a spouse who does not could collide and result in what is commonly called, in the industry, "irreconcilable differences". IOW, it winds up being more a matter of the world views of the partners no longer meshing than about having a another child. -- Be well, Barbara Mom to Mr. Congeniality (7), the Diva (5) and the Race Car Fanatic (3) I have PMS and ESP...I'm the bitch who knows everything! (T-shirt slogan) |
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