Bill Cosby - NAACP leaders stunned by remarks of prominent comedian

On Mon, 7 Jun 2004 14:33:17 -0700, "Circe" wrote:

Holger Dansk wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jun 2004 13:05:21 -0700, "Circe"
wrote:
Holger Dansk wrote:
On Mon, 7 Jun 2004 09:35:26 -0700, "Circe"
wrote:
Holger Dansk wrote:
So what? "High" cultures the world over (and particularly in
Europe) had slavery (and children slaves) for thousands of years.

Well, we are talking about now. (today)

And that matters why, exactly?

Well, some cultures have learned that slavery is not a good thing.

And some have also learned that racism is not a good thing. You, apparently,
have not. So much for advancement, I guess.

Who else still has slavery
other than the blacks in Sudan and Mauritania?

People all over the world, hon. Legally or illegally, slavery
exists on every part of the globe. Deal with it.

So, you don't know of any other countries and/or cultures.

The US, as I've already stated, for starters:
======================
During 2001, at least 700,000 and potentially as many as 4 million men,
women and children worldwide were bought, sold, transported and held against
their will in slave-like conditions, according to the U.S. State Department.
In it's Second Annual Trafficking in Persons Report, the Department of State
finds that modern slave traders, or "person-traffickers" use threats,
intimidation and violence to force victims to engage in sex acts or to work
under conditions comparable to slavery for the traffickers' financial gain.

According to the report, women and children make up the overwhelming
majority of victims, typically being sold into the international sex trade
for prostitution, sex tourism and other commercial sexual services, and into
forced labor situations in sweatshops, construction sites and agricultural
settings. In other forms of servitude, children are abducted and forced to
fight for government military forces or rebel armies, and to act as domestic
servants and street beggars.

"Traffickers prey on the most vulnerable members of our human family,
violating their most basic rights, subjecting them to degradation and
misery," stated Secretary of State Colin Powell in presenting the report he
said displayed "the resolve of the entire US Government to stop this
appalling assault on the dignity of men, women and children."

While the report focuses on person-trafficking in eighty-nine other
countries, Secretary Powell reported that some 50,000 women and children are
trafficked annually for sexual exploitation into the United States. "Here
and abroad," said Powell, "the victims of trafficking toil under inhuman
conditions -- in brothels, sweatshops, fields and even in private homes."
====================
You can find the list of 89 countries at
http://usgovinfo.about.com/gi/dynami...www.state.gov/
g/tip/rls/tiprpt/2002/10678.htm. The list includes many European nations, as
well as the US and Canada.

Deal with it.

You don't understand. That's called trafficking. Sudan and Mauritania
have the real thing where people are bought and sold as slaves.

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm

On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 18:07:31 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:

Her point is that the Greeks would not have done any of these things
without slavery, which gave them the wealth and free time to engage in
such endeavors.

That's absolutely ridiculous. You could give the black savages all of
the money in the world and they wouldn't create anything. Wake up.

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm

On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 18:18:59 -0500, toto wrote:

Today, slavery avoids the lable by not asserting legal ownership
of the slaves, but millions of economically and socially vulnerable
people are potential slaves creating a surplus of slave labor.

In Sudan and Mauritania they assert ownership. Just like in the past
ages that everyone else has abandoned.

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm

On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 18:16:27 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:

Holger Dansk wrote:
That's horrible. She has to show where someone else wrote it down for
people to believe her?

You also have to show references for people to believe you.

Never. You either believe me or you don't.

You don't.

Most of the time I don't.

Therefore we don't believe you.

I'm not concerned about whether you believe me or not. Why would I care
what you believe about me?

If you don't believe me, it is your loss.

lojbab

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm

On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 18:09:29 -0500, toto wrote:

On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 21:25:22 GMT, Holger Dansk
wrote:


I had about the best parents and some of the best teachers in the world.
My parents were absolutely wonderful. My teachers in High School at
Darlington School in Rome, GA were magnificent and my professors at
Emory University and University of Georgia were very good. (For
instance, Roger Mudd, director of the History Channel, was my American
History professor at Darlington.)

The fact that your parents and teachers were wonderful people doesn't
mean they actually were correct in their opinions of the world,
however.

I know many good people with whom I disagree on various issues.

It's a matter of questioning authority and making your own judgements.

Also, I have known and know a lot of wonderful people.

So have I, what is your point?

These people were wonderful in what they knew about the world.

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm

On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 18:18:33 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:

Holger Dansk wrote:
On Mon, 07 Jun 2004 15:09:32 -0400, Bob LeChevalier
wrote:

It's easy to see why Bill Cosby is disgusted because after
several generations many blacks have not learned how to pronounce
"police" and "President", etc.,

I await your evidence that Bill Cosby has any problem with how blacks
pronounce words.

whereas Hispanics and Asians learn in just a few seconds.

I await your evidence of this.

It's not just the pronouncing of the words but the terrible grammar.

Then don't say it's the pronunciation of "police" and "president",
which are YOUR bugaboos, and not Cosby's.

I'm sure Cosby dislikes the bad pronunciations as much as the poor
grammar. Those wrong pronunciations are just the tip of the iceberg.

lojbab

Holger

http://www.mindspring.com/~holger1/holger1.htm

Circe wrote:

So what? "High" cultures the world over (and particularly in Europe) had
slavery (and children slaves) for thousands of years. One of the reasons
that the wealthy in the Greek and Roman culture (who produced most of the
art and literature that we admire today) *were* wealthy was because they
relied on slave labor to produce surplus goods and earn their money for
them. Wow, what a wonderful achievement, eh?
----------------
Actually no, they bred horrible sadness by the thousands of lives.

Those people's labor for themselves would have done such incredible
good that it cannot even be fathomed.

Instead it fed and clothed and pampered vain plutocrats and sycophants
who made war to steal from all of Europe.

Our rich do the same thing today!!!
Steve



But, that's about all the savages in Africa have produced for
thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of years.

Nonsense. From http://www.worldbank.org/afr/finding...sh/find11.htm:
"Africa's rich and varied cultural heritage finds expression in a wide
variety of arts and crafts. Cultural property is preserved in
paleontological, archaeological, historical, and sacred sites, as well as in
museums, residences, and the daily life of the people. African archaeology
traces the history of human evolution from its very beginning, recording
such significant cultural achievements as the development and use of tools,
the independent invention of agriculture, long distance trade, fine arts as
illustrated by early rock paintings, metalworking, and urban settlements.
Contemporary architecture, paintings, sculptures, textiles, and other
cultural artifacts draw on a rich variety of traditions, many of which are
still an integral part of daily life.

Many thousands of cultural sites have been identified in Africa, often
clustered along coastal areas, river basins, or major transportation axes.
Many others may exist unknown to the outside world. Archaeological studies
conducted as part of project environmental assessments can provide valuable
information concerning the nature and distribution of human activity in the
area in ancient times. Such surveys have been conducted, for example, in the
Volta Basin, in the area to be flooded by the Kafue Dam in Zambia, as part
of the Lesotho Highlands Water Project, and for the Tuli Block Roads Project
in Botswana.

The UNESCO World Heritage Convention has been ratified by 28 African
countries, listed in the handbook. Under the convention, international
assistance can be secured by governments to facilitate the protection of
sites that have been registered as World Heritage Sites. Currently listed
World Cultural Heritage sites in Africa include the royal palaces of Abomey,
Benin; the rock churches of Ethiopia; Ashante traditional buildings in
Ghana; the ancient towns of Djenne and Timbuktu and the cliff of Mandiagara
in Mali; the island of Mozambique, Mozambique; Goree Island in Senegal; the
ruins of Kilwa Kisiwani and Songo Mnara, Tanzania; and Great Zimbabwe and
Khami Ruins National Monuments in Zimbabwe."
--
Be well, Barbara
Mom to Sin (Vernon, 2), Misery (Aurora, 4), and the Rising Son (Julian, 6)

Aurora (in the bathroom with her dad)--"It looks like an elephant, Daddy."
Me (later)--"You should feel flattered."

All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful.
Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its
other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin' for a
fight. -- with apologies to Michael Feldman

"R. Steve Walz" wrote in message
...
Circe wrote:

So what? "High" cultures the world over (and particularly in Europe) had
slavery (and children slaves) for thousands of years. One of the reasons
that the wealthy in the Greek and Roman culture (who produced most of
the
art and literature that we admire today) *were* wealthy was because they
relied on slave labor to produce surplus goods and earn their money for
them. Wow, what a wonderful achievement, eh?
----------------
Actually no, they bred horrible sadness by the thousands of lives.

were you there ?

did you actually see this 'horrible sadness' ???

Those people's labor for themselves would have done such incredible
good that it cannot even be fathomed.

'those people' were illiterate.........they would have subsisted, nothing
more


Instead it fed and clothed and pampered vain plutocrats and sycophants
who made war to steal from all of Europe.

and incidentally kept 'those people' from starving due to their own
inability to do anything more than simply survive under starvation
conditions


Our rich do the same thing today!!!

so move to 'Da Mudda Lann' where everyone is poor

Holger Dansk wrote:

The Greeks had a great civilization. Much greater than the Romans.
They gave us many, many things. Not just some art and some literature.
----------------
Nonsense, they had the money to afford thinkers because they had
slaves once again, but they squandered it and most Athenians wasted
their money on high living, the few thinkers were a tiny minority.
If papyrus had rotted ten percent faster they'd have been unknown!


"The Golden Age of Greek science came in the Hellenistic period, with
the greatest advances in mathematics. The geometry theories published by
Euclid about 300 bc still endure. Archimedes (287-212 bc) calculated the
value of pi (the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter)
-----------
Not very well, the Chinese did it better!


and invented fluid mechanics. Aristarchus, early in the 3rd century bc,
argued that the earth revolved around the sun, while Eratosthenes
accurately calculated the circumference of the earth. Also in the 3rd
century bc, Ctesibius invented machines operated by air and water
pressure; Hero later built a rotating sphere powered by steam. These
inventions did not lead to practical uses because the technology did not
yet exist to produce the pipes, fittings, and screws needed to build
powerful machines. Military technology vaulted ahead with the invention
of huge catapults and wheeled towers to batter down city walls. Finally,
medical scientists made many discoveries, such as the significance of
the pulse and the nervous system."
-----------------
All in the service of warfare against their neighbors!


There was architecture.

"The importance of Greek art and architecture for the history of Western
civilization can hardly be overstated, for the Greeks established many
of the most enduring themes, attitudes, and forms of Western culture.
------------------
You can build neat stuff if you have slaves. Do without slaves and
I'll be impressed. Now the Minoans were impressive!!


Invented agriculture? Heheheheheheheheheh. Really????????? Did they
put a fish in the hole with corn seeds to make it grow better like the
American aborigines?
--------------------
No, by complex hybridization they even had control of the colors and
patterns of kernels on the ears of maize, and used them for messages
with runners!


long distance trade,

How long a distance? About as far as you could hear their drums?
--------------------------
Hundreds of miles at a time.


fine arts as illustrated by early rock paintings,

Were these those paintings inside of caves?

metalworking, and urban settlements.

I don't think they even knew what metal was.
-----------------------------
They were using bronze, lead and simple pewters.


Contemporary architecture,

Was that the mud and straw huts?
------------------------
Try adzed lumber and longhouses made with beams held by mortise and
tenon.


paintings, sculptures, textiles, and other
cultural artifacts draw on a rich variety of traditions, many of which are
still an integral part of daily life.

Let's not bull **** with a lot of meaningless rhetoric. Be specific.
------------------------
Weaving of textiles and of fur strips in fine garments that were
even elastic because of the nature of the knots they used.


Any place that they had a tribal village was a cultural site.
----------------------
You don't even know what the **** you're talking about!


What in the world does a study have to do with what these savages did
other than run around naked raping and pillaging and hunting wildebeest?
----------------------------
You wouldn't know, you're ignorant!.


I know about the ugly fat wooden carvings of figures with big butts,
etc.
Holger
------------------
Now we know what your bumper sticker says!
Steve

Jasper PNL Mfg Co, LTD wrote:

"R. Steve Walz" wrote in message
...
Circe wrote:

So what? "High" cultures the world over (and particularly in Europe) had
slavery (and children slaves) for thousands of years. One of the reasons
that the wealthy in the Greek and Roman culture (who produced most of
the
art and literature that we admire today) *were* wealthy was because they
relied on slave labor to produce surplus goods and earn their money for
them. Wow, what a wonderful achievement, eh?
----------------
Actually no, they bred horrible sadness by the thousands of lives.

were you there ?
-----------------
Sure was.


did you actually see this 'horrible sadness' ???
--------------
Oh yes!


Those people's labor for themselves would have done such incredible
good that it cannot even be fathomed.

'those people' were illiterate.........they would have subsisted, nothing
more
--------------------
They were deprived of their rightful education in that society.
Also, anyway, reading was not much use at that time, a toy, nothing
more.


Instead it fed and clothed and pampered vain plutocrats and sycophants
who made war to steal from all of Europe.

and incidentally kept 'those people' from starving due to their own
inability to do anything more than simply survive under starvation
conditions
-----------------------
Nonsense. The slaves did that themselves.


Our rich do the same thing today!!!

so move to 'Da Mudda Lann' where everyone is poor
---------------------------
Ain't any, you ridiculous lying piece of ****!
Steve