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Define "Custodial Parent"?



 
 
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  #11  
Old September 22nd 07, 07:37 PM posted to alt.child-support
Chris
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,421
Default Define "Custodial Parent"?


"Bob Whiteside" wrote in message
...

"Anon" wrote in message
ups.com...
In California, as in other states, if you substitute "mother" for
"custodial parent," you won't go far wrong. If that doesn't quite fit,
try
"recipient of child support."


Surely there is a legal definition or precident somewhere.

In my situation, if you calculate the actual days of physical custody,
it turns out the dad has the child 51% of the time (mom has 49%). The
father earns substantially more money than the mother, so after
California child support calculations dad (with a slight majority of
custody) pays mom child support. I'm trying to figure out whether the
mother is the CP by virtue of the fact that she gets a check from dad,
OR if Dad is CP because he has more physical custody. There is a
statute that gives a substantial privledge to the CP, I'm just not
sure who that is in this case. How can I find out, or is it at the
judge's discretion?


The CS system has a bunch of different designations for custodial parents
depending upon which area of Family Law you are talking about. Here are a
few examples:

Sole Custodial Parent - A parent with full legal and physical custody of
minor children. Sometimes called residential or placement custody.
Joint Custodial Parent - Typically a parental agreement where legal

custody
is shared and physical custody is awarded to only one parent. Sometimes
called Joint Legal Custody.
Shared Custodial Parent - A parental agreement where both legal and

physical
custody are awarded to both parents. Sometimes called Joint Legal and
Physical Custody.
Custodial Parent - The IRS designation for a never married parent who had
custody of the child for the greater part of a year and meet the

dependency
test.
Custodial Parent - The IRS designation for a divorced or separated parent
who meets the three criteria in the support test.


The above CLEARLY demonstrates the insanity of the government people.
The fact is that one is either a parent or not a parent, with no third
option. No amount of labelling will change such fact.


The payment status of parents you described above usually ignores the

legal
and physical custody status of the parents because the parents are
designated as the obligor and the obligee. Since you pay that makes you

the
obligor even though you have described being a shared parental custody
parent. Since you have more physical custody that means you can meet
probably meet the IRS as a custodial parent using the dependency test

and/or
the support test to take the child as an exemption.

An emerging area of Family Law is the use of Parenting Plans to allow the
parents to create their own agreements on how the details of
post-relationship details are implemented.


As if the mother is going to forfeit the FREE CASH she gets for keeping her
child fatherless. LOL.





  #12  
Old September 27th 07, 08:00 PM posted to alt.child-support
Very Determined!
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 122
Default Define "Custodial Parent"?

On Sep 22, 11:37 am, "Chris" wrote:
"Bob Whiteside" wrote in message

...







"Anon" wrote in message
oups.com...
In California, as in other states, if you substitute "mother" for
"custodial parent," you won't go far wrong. If that doesn't quite fit,
try
"recipient of child support."


Surely there is a legal definition or precident somewhere.


In my situation, if you calculate the actual days of physical custody,
it turns out the dad has the child 51% of the time (mom has 49%). The
father earns substantially more money than the mother, so after
California child support calculations dad (with a slight majority of
custody) pays mom child support. I'm trying to figure out whether the
mother is the CP by virtue of the fact that she gets a check from dad,
OR if Dad is CP because he has more physical custody. There is a
statute that gives a substantial privledge to the CP, I'm just not
sure who that is in this case. How can I find out, or is it at the
judge's discretion?


The CS system has a bunch of different designations for custodial parents
depending upon which area of Family Law you are talking about. Here are a
few examples:


Sole Custodial Parent - A parent with full legal and physical custody of
minor children. Sometimes called residential or placement custody.
Joint Custodial Parent - Typically a parental agreement where legal

custody
is shared and physical custody is awarded to only one parent. Sometimes
called Joint Legal Custody.
Shared Custodial Parent - A parental agreement where both legal and

physical
custody are awarded to both parents. Sometimes called Joint Legal and
Physical Custody.
Custodial Parent - The IRS designation for a never married parent who had
custody of the child for the greater part of a year and meet the

dependency
test.
Custodial Parent - The IRS designation for a divorced or separated parent
who meets the three criteria in the support test.


The above CLEARLY demonstrates the insanity of the government people.
The fact is that one is either a parent or not a parent, with no third
option. No amount of labelling will change such fact.





The payment status of parents you described above usually ignores the

legal
and physical custody status of the parents because the parents are
designated as the obligor and the obligee. Since you pay that makes you

the
obligor even though you have described being a shared parental custody
parent. Since you have more physical custody that means you can meet
probably meet the IRS as a custodial parent using the dependency test

and/or
the support test to take the child as an exemption.


An emerging area of Family Law is the use of Parenting Plans to allow the
parents to create their own agreements on how the details of
post-relationship details are implemented.


As if the mother is going to forfeit the FREE CASH she gets for keeping her
child fatherless. LOL.



- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


touche

  #13  
Old September 27th 07, 08:58 PM posted to alt.child-support
Werebat
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 109
Default Define "Custodial Parent"?

Anon wrote in news:1190339571.665456.8420
@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com:

if legal custody were technically 50/50 each would get 182 1/2 days.


Perhaps that's the case. It may be irrelevant. Given all the
statutes awarding rights to the Custodial Parent, what is the legal
definition of the term? Is it simply the parent with MORE time, or is
some other criteria used? If it's simply a matter of time, then WHO
would be considered the CP if each parent got EXACTLY 262,800 minutes
of custody each year?


Well, *I* have 50/50 joint physical and legal custody of my son, which I
share with his mother. In *MY* case, the effective answer has been --
the mother.

It's POSSIBLE that if I earned less money than her, the effective answer
would be ME, but I'm not sure of that. Certainly "the lower earning
parent" seems less gender biased than "the mother", so it would probably
be what a court official would tell you if you asked him about my case.

When I asked a similar question of my lawyer in my case, his answer was
a question -- "Well, who is paying child support to whom?" There ya go.
I pay her money, she doesn't pay me anything, so CSE has lots of
documents labelling her as "custodial" and myself as "non-custodial".
I'm TOLD that this is "just because we don't have forms saying anything
else" and that I "shouldn't worry about any legal ramifications", but,
heh. Who are they kidding?

- Ron ^*^
  #14  
Old September 27th 07, 09:06 PM posted to alt.child-support
Werebat
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 109
Default Define "Custodial Parent"?

Anon wrote in news:1190357073.328009.51810
@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com:

Interesting questions. The custody order simply states:

"The parents shall share joint legal custody."
"The parents shall share joint physical custody."

Then goes on to state when the child is in the care and custody of the
father and the mother. Essentially it's split evenly, but there are a
few variances which give slightly more time to the father. Since
custody time is so close and the father makes roughly three times what
the mother makes, he must pay her child support. Still, the
California code is full of language like, "if the custodial parent
[blah, blah, blah] the the noncustodial parent [blah, blah, blah]"
What I haven't found anywhere is a definition of "custodial parent".

Years ago, when most of these laws were written, the courts awarded
custody to one parent and visitation to the other, so it all made
sense. Mom had custody, so she was the "custodial parent", dad
didn't, so he was the "noncustodial parent". But these days, the
courts are awarding "joint custody" and "shared custody". So, to
apply these laws the courts would have to first figure out who's the
CP and who's the NCP. In the code each get very different
priveledges. Yet, I haven't found a legal definition for these terms
in the code anywhere.

Can someone let me know what the courts use to determine who's the CP
with "shared custody" arrangements?


My money is on the following: The mother.

It would likely be up to the judge's discretion, which means: the
mother.

In the unlikely event that the overall benefit to the State would be for
the CP to be considered the father, then the judge MIGHT rule that it
was the father.

With laws written as you describe them, there isn't really a straight
answer, or a written legal one, just a "policy" one, which means
"judicial discretion", which likely means the mother will be considered
the CP.

I, too, have a divorce decree stating that neither I not my son's mother
is "custodial", but there are many legal documents out there labelling
her as "custodial" and myself as "non-custodial" because I have to pay
her CS. No doubt if things were to ever come to a head between my ex
and myself, these documents, which every snake-tongued weasel from CSE
that I talk to insists have no legal ramifications, WOULD INDEED be
allowed to carry legal weight in court. I have no doubt that they would
be admitted as having "set a precedent", and the same weasels who tell
me not to worry today would be there nodding their heads in sage
agreement.

- Ron ^*^
  #15  
Old October 5th 07, 11:24 PM posted to alt.child-support
Werebat
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 109
Default Define "Custodial Parent"?



Anon wrote:
Interesting questions. The custody order simply states:

"The parents shall share joint legal custody."
"The parents shall share joint physical custody."

Then goes on to state when the child is in the care and custody of the
father and the mother. Essentially it's split evenly, but there are a
few variances which give slightly more time to the father. Since
custody time is so close and the father makes roughly three times what
the mother makes, he must pay her child support. Still, the
California code is full of language like, "if the custodial parent
[blah, blah, blah] the the noncustodial parent [blah, blah, blah]"
What I haven't found anywhere is a definition of "custodial parent".

Years ago, when most of these laws were written, the courts awarded
custody to one parent and visitation to the other, so it all made
sense. Mom had custody, so she was the "custodial parent", dad
didn't, so he was the "noncustodial parent". But these days, the
courts are awarding "joint custody" and "shared custody". So, to
apply these laws the courts would have to first figure out who's the
CP and who's the NCP. In the code each get very different
priveledges. Yet, I haven't found a legal definition for these terms
in the code anywhere.

Can someone let me know what the courts use to determine who's the CP
with "shared custody" arrangements?


I'm in a similar situation, where we share equal time, no "custodial"
parent is mentioned, but I pay her CS because I work and she just
collects disability.

Part of me wonders if I would succeed if I tried to get CS from HER, on
the grounds that I have as much right to it as she does (it makes
perfect sense to me -- if SHE was working and I was not, you think
they'd leave me alone?). I don't want to rock the boat right now, but
in the future, after I'm off the CS hook, it may be something to
consider, just for fun.

18+ years of back child support might come in handy, even if it's only
whatever the state can mug off of a disabled woman, eh? :^/

- Ron ^*^

  #16  
Old November 9th 07, 01:38 AM posted to alt.child-support
Rob
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9
Default Define "Custodial Parent"?

It goes strickly by day not dollars!

"Chris" wrote in message
...

"Bob Whiteside" wrote in message
...

"Anon" wrote in message
ups.com...
In California, as in other states, if you substitute "mother" for
"custodial parent," you won't go far wrong. If that doesn't quite
fit,
try
"recipient of child support."

Surely there is a legal definition or precident somewhere.

In my situation, if you calculate the actual days of physical custody,
it turns out the dad has the child 51% of the time (mom has 49%). The
father earns substantially more money than the mother, so after
California child support calculations dad (with a slight majority of
custody) pays mom child support. I'm trying to figure out whether the
mother is the CP by virtue of the fact that she gets a check from dad,
OR if Dad is CP because he has more physical custody. There is a
statute that gives a substantial privledge to the CP, I'm just not
sure who that is in this case. How can I find out, or is it at the
judge's discretion?


The CS system has a bunch of different designations for custodial parents
depending upon which area of Family Law you are talking about. Here are
a
few examples:

Sole Custodial Parent - A parent with full legal and physical custody of
minor children. Sometimes called residential or placement custody.
Joint Custodial Parent - Typically a parental agreement where legal

custody
is shared and physical custody is awarded to only one parent. Sometimes
called Joint Legal Custody.
Shared Custodial Parent - A parental agreement where both legal and

physical
custody are awarded to both parents. Sometimes called Joint Legal and
Physical Custody.
Custodial Parent - The IRS designation for a never married parent who had
custody of the child for the greater part of a year and meet the

dependency
test.
Custodial Parent - The IRS designation for a divorced or separated parent
who meets the three criteria in the support test.


The above CLEARLY demonstrates the insanity of the government people.
The fact is that one is either a parent or not a parent, with no third
option. No amount of labelling will change such fact.


The payment status of parents you described above usually ignores the

legal
and physical custody status of the parents because the parents are
designated as the obligor and the obligee. Since you pay that makes you

the
obligor even though you have described being a shared parental custody
parent. Since you have more physical custody that means you can meet
probably meet the IRS as a custodial parent using the dependency test

and/or
the support test to take the child as an exemption.

An emerging area of Family Law is the use of Parenting Plans to allow the
parents to create their own agreements on how the details of
post-relationship details are implemented.


As if the mother is going to forfeit the FREE CASH she gets for keeping
her
child fatherless. LOL.







 




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