Inappropriate Teacher's Dress

On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 01:21:20 GMT, Nan wrote:

Well, I agree that clothing suited to physical requirements is a Good
Thing. However, I have to laugh at the number of posts saying part of
the job *requirement* is to get on the floor and play. AFAIK, it's
not a requirement of DD5s preschool teachers *or* the Stay and Play
staff. They *might* decide to crawl around and play outside, but it
certainly isn't "required", and I don't think I ever saw any of the
teachers or DC gals doing so.

It is a requirement in many infant and toddler rooms I have worked in.
Not as much as the kids get older because teachers are doing more
*sedate* activities such as table top games rather than things on the
floor, but we sure did floor puzzles with the kids in my preschool
classes. They may not be on the floor constantly, but they need to
be able to do this *and* to be able to play with the kids outside as
well.


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..

The Outer Limits

On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 23:57:42 -0500, toto
wrote:

It is a requirement in many infant and toddler rooms I have worked in.
Not as much as the kids get older because teachers are doing more
*sedate* activities such as table top games rather than things on the
floor, but we sure did floor puzzles with the kids in my preschool
classes. They may not be on the floor constantly, but they need to
be able to do this *and* to be able to play with the kids outside as
well.

That makes sense. When I think of "preschool" I think of kids above
the age of 3, not infants and toddlers. I've only had my kids in
either "daycare" for infants and toddlers, or "preschool" at the age
of 4. Classes are actually held, and I've never seen any of the
teachers crawl on the floor, but it's not full-time care, either.
It's a 2-1/2 hr. school session 3 days a week.

Nan

"Nan" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 15:07:23 -0400, "bizby40"
wrote:

something as frivolous as dress. I contend that if your DCPs
crossed *your* personal line of what is appropriate, whatever
that might be, that you would then feel that the matter of dress
was more important.

You insult too easily, then.
Because *I* pay more attention to the standard of care, not how
someone is dressed.
If the OP is unhappy with the standard of care, she's not mentioning
it. If the clothing is her only gripe, I do feel that is trivial in
the Big Picture, considering the "teachers" aren't performing ritual
sacrifices naked.

Re-read what I said. The OP probably didn't consider how they
dressed to be important until they crossed the line of her comfort
level. Just because your line is at a different place than hers, does
not mean that she places more emphasis on clothing than on care.
If the staff at your DCP began wearing clothing that for whatever
reason crossed out of *your* comfort zone, then you would
likely complain about that, even if the level of care remained the
same.

Bizby

"Barbara Bomberger" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 15:07:23 -0400, "bizby40"
wrote:



There is a continuum from nudity to full artic gear. Everyone draws
the line at what is acceptable at a different place. The OP felt
these girls were dressed too revealingly. You'd draw the line
at a different place. Fine. But when you said (of your own DCPs)
"they're great with all the kids, and that is what I feel is important,
not how they're dressed." I took that as a rather insulting
statement. As if the OP should be ashamed to have focused on
something as frivolous as dress. I contend that if your DCPs
crossed *your* personal line of what is appropriate, whatever
that might be, that you would then feel that the matter of dress
was more important.

The OP made no mention of the kind of job these gals were doing,
whether her kids liked them, and so on and so forth. So that leaves
us assuming that they are doing a good job, and her kids like them.

Unless my provider were half nude, or wearing slogans that include
swearing, I would be more interested in the kind of care that she
provided to the kids

My kids have over the years had teachers who dressed the style you are
talking about, goth, preppy, and one who was an elizabethan fan who
wore all those period clothing. I also had one that I never saw out of
jeans. This doesnt even begin to discuss their hair styles or
whatever.

As long as they were caring with my kids, had a good relationship, and
got the educational message across, that is all I care about .

If the OP is as concerned about teh kind of dress she is describing,
then she probably wants to move to a place more in line with her
views.

barb

As people are parroting each other to me today, let me just repeat
what I said to Nan:

"The OP probably didn't consider how they
dressed to be important until they crossed the line of her comfort
level. Just because your line is at a different place than hers, does
not mean that she places more emphasis on clothing than on care.
If the staff at your DCP began wearing clothing that for whatever
reason crossed out of *your* comfort zone, then you would
likely complain about that, even if the level of care remained the
same."

Bizby

Nan wrote:

Well, I agree that clothing suited to physical requirements is a Good
Thing. However, I have to laugh at the number of posts saying part of
the job *requirement* is to get on the floor and play. AFAIK, it's
not a requirement of DD5s preschool teachers *or* the Stay and Play
staff. They *might* decide to crawl around and play outside, but it
certainly isn't "required", and I don't think I ever saw any of the
teachers or DC gals doing so.

It is *absolutely* a requirement in our preschool. It is
clearly specified in the job description, and it is one of the
questions we ask during interviews. And personally, I would not
accept any less from a preschool teacher.

Best wishes,
Ericka

"enigma" wrote in message
. ..
"bizby40" wrote in
:
I think most of us would have a line that we wouldn't want
our DCPs to cross. Would you object to someone with a
violent t-shirt, or one of those shirts with snakes coming
through the eye sockets of a skull? I would -- I'd be
afraid that the images would be upsetting to my child. How
about profanity? I'd be upset by that as well, even if my
child was too young to read it or know what it meant. What
if they worked in a bikini? Or if they were male and
generally worked without a shirt? That's fine for the
pool, but doesn't seem right for a pre-school environment.
Heck -- what if they were nudists?


so, you want all your daycare providers/teachers dressed like
this?
http://www.plainlydressed.com/

Of course not.

get a grip. no one is advocating *any* of your histronic
scenarios. i just don't see why the dress of these college
students is an issue, unless it actually interferes with thier
job performance.

The histrionic scenarios were merely to point out that
everyone has a line they don't want their DCPs to cross.

The OP seems upset with the sexual nature of the dress of
the Day Care workers. Sure she could change day cares.
But if she's been happy with it otherwise, don't you think
it's appropriate for her to address the situation with the
owner? I do. If the owner refuses to do anything about
it, then the OP needs to decide whether or not it's
something worth switching over.

they're collrge students wearing what kids thier age wear. of
course, mini-skirt is totally subjective... is it mini (mid-
upper thigh) or mini! (thier butt is showing)?

They're college students wearing what *some* kids
their age wear.

And for whoever said that it's too much to expect the
college girls to purchase a professional wardrobe for a
summer job -- I think "professional" in this case really
only means modest. A few t-shirts that cover their bellies
and so forth.

why? are bellies that taboo in society currently?
most summer jobs, especially in childcare, are minimum wage.
yes, in that situation i *do* think it's too much to expect
they should buy special clothes for work. when i was working
summers, it was because i needed that money for next semester,
not to buy clothes. YMMV, i suppose.

If they don't have any appropriate clothing and can't or
won't get any, then they might just have to look for a
more suitable job.

Bizby

"Jeanne" wrote in message
...
bizby40 wrote:
That's
fine for the pool, but doesn't seem right for a pre-school
environment. Heck -- what if they were nudists?


Uhmmm...have you HEARD of nude daycare ??? What's up with these WAY OUT
extreme hypotheticals?

As I've said repeatedly, it was only to point out that pretty
much everyone has a line they wouldn't want their DCPs to
cross.

No. If she's happy with the care of her children, the appearance of the
workers is just that - their appearance. I don't pretend I have that much
control over other people, relative or not.

You're right -- she doesn't have that much control. She can bring
her concerns to the owner (which she's done) and then she can
decide to keep her children there or not.

I suggested switching daycares because that seemed to me a reasonable
solution. If I'm unhappy with the workers for whatever reason (and
inappropriate dress is a valid reason) I don't think an individual
customer should be able to force a dress code. But as an individual
customer I can take my business elsewhere.

I do think that an individual customer should voice their concerns
though. It may be that 5 other individual customers voice the same
concerns and then something is done.

Bizby

Nan wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 23:57:42 -0500, toto
wrote:


It is a requirement in many infant and toddler rooms I have worked in.
Not as much as the kids get older because teachers are doing more
*sedate* activities such as table top games rather than things on the
floor, but we sure did floor puzzles with the kids in my preschool
classes. They may not be on the floor constantly, but they need to
be able to do this *and* to be able to play with the kids outside as
well.


That makes sense. When I think of "preschool" I think of kids above
the age of 3, not infants and toddlers. I've only had my kids in
either "daycare" for infants and toddlers, or "preschool" at the age
of 4. Classes are actually held, and I've never seen any of the
teachers crawl on the floor, but it's not full-time care, either.
It's a 2-1/2 hr. school session 3 days a week.

While our 2yo teachers spend more time on the floor than
our 3yo or 4yo teachers, all of them are down there occasionally
for circle time, doing floor puzzles, sitting with a child in
their laps, building block towers, and all sorts of other things.
I think one of the hallmarks of a good preschool is teachers who
are down on the children's level, rather than directing from on high.
I seem to recall something in the NAEYC standards describing this
as desirable behavior as well.

Best wishes,
Ericka

Barbara Bomberger wrote:


But the OPs objection was to the style, not to the function. And
wearing a shirt short enough to show a belly button does NOT mean that
when you stretch your hands up, you automatically show everything.

Goodness, if it did, I would be in trouble, as I dress on the "liberal
side" I guess. And I'm an old woman.

Personally, I was more worried about the other end of
the skirt. It is difficult for me to imagine anything I'd call
a mini skirt that would permit a teacher to be down on the floor
playing with kids without being inappropriate.
I also don't get the resistance to the notion that it is
appropriate to have some dress standards for preschool teachers.
The dress code for much of the professional world is *much* more
strict than it is for preschoolers, and believe me, looking at
it from the perspective of *running* a preschool, I'm *quite*
well aware that if we had teachers dressed in mini skirts, not
only would it be an indication that the teachers weren't doing
their job as expected, but we'd be getting plenty of phone calls
from irate parents. For every parent who's cool with midriff
baring tops, low cut pants, and mini skirts, there'll be another
who isn't keen on that role model for her preschool-aged daughter
(or son). I can't afford to run a preschool where half the
parents are ****ed off over teachers' attire.

Best wishes,
Ericka

Barbara Bomberger wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 14:22:45 -0400, Ericka Kammerer
wrote:


Mary wrote:


Have any of you faced a teacher, preschool or otherwise that dressed
inappropriately? Recently, I experienced a situation with "teachers"
(they were actually college students doing a summer intern-job) that
wore low ride, cotton, white, mini skirts, with no slips (do people
still wear slips?). One has a tongue stud. Both wore shirts with their
belly buttons exposed.
It is a delicate situation in that I am related to the owner. I did
say something to the owner, but then let the subject die.
I can say that husband is eager to drive my daughters to the school!

In a previous preschool, the teachers had tattoos, but they covered
them up. I have a tattoo as well, but if I was in a professional
situation, I would cover it up.

Hmm...I'm a little surprised by the responses. I sit on the
board of a preschool. From my perspective, the tongue piercing is
not an issue, as long as it's not being fiddled with all the time.
However, while we do not have a detailed dress code, it doesn't
particularly sound like the above described attire would be acceptable
at our school. We expect the teachers to be in clothes that
they can get down on the floor with the kids, or run and play
with the kids. I don't really see how a mini skirt fits that
bill (as I imagine they're not wearing bloomers ;-) Even college
students helping out in the school would be expected to show up
dressed appropriately--clean, neat, and ready for play. We sometime
have teens or college age folks helping out a bit, and their dress
does tend to be a bit less conservative than the older women
(which is fine), but if you can't sit cross-legged on the floor
or reach your arms over your head without exposing something
you shouldn't, I think our Director would suggest a change of
clothing would be in order.


I bet that the mini skirts were probably shorts or culottes, after
reading the post.

If they were shorts or skorts or culottes, I wouldn't
have a problem with it, assuming they weren't outrageously
short. I wouldn't rush to assume the OP couldn't tell the
difference, though. It's usually quite obvious to me whether
someone is wearing a skirt or a skort.

Best wishes,
Ericka