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#1
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lap belt question
Is it safe for children out of a booster seat to use a lap-belt only? Dh had
to get a new car, and it's a 5-seater but the middle one in the back has only a lap-belt. I have one child in a booster seat still, but would it be safe for one of the other two to sit in the lap belt? They're 11 and 13, both tall for their ages. I never really thought about it before, because my van is all-shoulder belts and his old car didn't have lap belts, either. Marie |
#2
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lap belt question
"MarieD" wrote in message ... Is it safe for children out of a booster seat to use a lap-belt only? Dh had to get a new car, and it's a 5-seater but the middle one in the back has only a lap-belt. I have one child in a booster seat still, but would it be safe for one of the other two to sit in the lap belt? They're 11 and 13, both tall for their ages. I never really thought about it before, because my van is all-shoulder belts and his old car didn't have lap belts, either. Marie It is if the child can sit properly in the seat - but this goes for any seat. The 'problem' with lap belts isn't the actual belt, for the most part. It's the person sitting in it. Make sure they're sitting in the seat properly. Their backs should be right against the seat, and bottoms should be right in the bend of the seat. There should be no gaps between backs and the car's seat. THIS can be a major safety concern, and actually goes for both lap and shoulder belts. In the event of a collision, shoulder belts are designed to lock in place. If a person isn't sitting properly in the seat (with both back and butt right against the seat) then when the shoulder belt locks, it locks only where it *thinks* the person's body is. Should the seatbelt lock at the wrong place, there then leaves that gap behind the person, which is how a person can be ejected from the seat, even with the seatbelt on. This same idea applies to a lap only belt, which are usually not the retractable type but the type you manually size to fit properly on the lap. Same idea, though, as far as fitting properly, and rather than locking, the lap belt just stays where it is and with that gap, that's where, again, the belt might not serve its purpose. This is actually one of the biggest reasons children are supposed to stay in booster seats after the car seats - to make sure they sit properly in the seat. Most children will scoot their bottoms forward in the car's seat so their knees can bend like they should over the edge. This will almost surely leave that said gap behind them in the seat. The booster will bring them up a bit (which also helps with the shoulder strap being at the proper spot on a smaller child's body) and give them a place to properly bend their knees as feels more comfortable and natural. (Try sitting in a seat where the bend is half way down your calves and you have to keep your feet straight out because they can't bend at the edge of a seat - not comfortable at all!) So, in short, I would say that there's nothing wrong with putting an 11 or 13 year old in the middle seat. Just, of course, assuming they can and will sit properly in the seat, as far back against the seat as possible. By 11 or 13, they should be tall enough to bend their knees over the edge of the seat without scooting their bum out from the back of the seat. I am also willing to bet that the lap belt is far safer to sit in than say the trunk where there's no belts at all If you have to do it, then you have to do it. There's nothing wrong with it. I have 2 brothers, and my parents only had a car when we were younger (or the truck) and all their vehicles seated only 5. All their vehicles (even to this day) have the lap belt in the middle seat. One of us was always in the middle, just because that's the way it had to be. I see nothing wrong with it. |
#3
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lap belt question
Hi -- I didn't realize you could get cars with only lap belts anymore (in any seats). Lap belts are inherently less safe than shoulder + lap belts. They don't restrain the upper body. This means that the upper body can whip into things (like the front seat -- think an angled collision rather than one directly head-on), and also that the upper body can whip forward leading to a snap of the spine at the lap belt, and parapalegia. I'd investigate to see if a shoulder restraint can be added to the car. I wouldn't be surprised if it were possible for a fee. --Beth Kevles -THE-COM-HERE http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html -- a page for the milk-allergic Disclaimer: Nothing in this message should be construed as medical advice. Please consult with your own medical practicioner. NOTE: No email is read at my MIT address. Use the GMAIL one if you would like me to reply. |
#4
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lap belt question
Beth Kevles wrote:
Hi -- I didn't realize you could get cars with only lap belts anymore (in any seats). If you have a rear seat with 3 belts, how can all of them have a shoulder+lap belt? Clisby Lap belts are inherently less safe than shoulder + lap belts. They don't restrain the upper body. This means that the upper body can whip into things (like the front seat -- think an angled collision rather than one directly head-on), and also that the upper body can whip forward leading to a snap of the spine at the lap belt, and parapalegia. I'd investigate to see if a shoulder restraint can be added to the car. I wouldn't be surprised if it were possible for a fee. --Beth Kevles -THE-COM-HERE http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html -- a page for the milk-allergic Disclaimer: Nothing in this message should be construed as medical advice. Please consult with your own medical practicioner. NOTE: No email is read at my MIT address. Use the GMAIL one if you would like me to reply. |
#5
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lap belt question
Stephanie wrote:
Clisby wrote: Beth Kevles wrote: Hi -- I didn't realize you could get cars with only lap belts anymore (in any seats). If you have a rear seat with 3 belts, how can all of them have a shoulder+lap belt? The center shoulder belt comes down from the ceiling. Our Subaru has it. Oh, OK. I've never seen that. Clisby Clisby Lap belts are inherently less safe than shoulder + lap belts. They don't restrain the upper body. This means that the upper body can whip into things (like the front seat -- think an angled collision rather than one directly head-on), and also that the upper body can whip forward leading to a snap of the spine at the lap belt, and parapalegia. I'd investigate to see if a shoulder restraint can be added to the car. I wouldn't be surprised if it were possible for a fee. --Beth Kevles -THE-COM-HERE http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html -- a page for the milk-allergic Disclaimer: Nothing in this message should be construed as medical advice. Please consult with your own medical practicioner. NOTE: No email is read at my MIT address. Use the GMAIL one if you would like me to reply. |
#6
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lap belt question
Clisby wrote:
Stephanie wrote: Clisby wrote: If you have a rear seat with 3 belts, how can all of them have a shoulder+lap belt? The center shoulder belt comes down from the ceiling. Our Subaru has it. Oh, OK. I've never seen that. Some of them just come over the top of the seat, rather than from the ceiling. Seems like quite a few cars have shoulder belts in all seating positions now. Best wishes, Ericka |
#7
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lap belt question
Stephanie wrote:
MarieD wrote: Is it safe for children out of a booster seat to use a lap-belt only? Dh had to get a new car, and it's a 5-seater but the middle one in the back has only a lap-belt. I have one child in a booster seat still, but would it be safe for one of the other two to sit in the lap belt? They're 11 and 13, both tall for their ages. I never really thought about it before, because my van is all-shoulder belts and his old car didn't have lap belts, either. Marie According to my car seat tech friend, an unequivocable NO. She said something about disembowling kids. I did not ask for the physics behind that. It's pretty much the risk of "submarining" (sliding under the lap belt due to improper positioning) or the risk of no upper body restraint and allowing the abdomen to absorb all the impact from the crash (not to mention allowing the upper body to move all over). That's part of why you're supposed to wear a lap belt very low, but very few folks do that (and it's really tough to get a lap belt to fit properly). Best wishes, Ericka |
#8
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lap belt question
Ericka Kammerer wrote:
Clisby wrote: Stephanie wrote: Clisby wrote: If you have a rear seat with 3 belts, how can all of them have a shoulder+lap belt? The center shoulder belt comes down from the ceiling. Our Subaru has it. Oh, OK. I've never seen that. Some of them just come over the top of the seat, rather than from the ceiling. Seems like quite a few cars have shoulder belts in all seating positions now. Could be. We have 2 cars, a 1995 and a 2004, and neither has it. Clisby Best wishes, Ericka |
#9
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lap belt question
Ericka Kammerer wrote:
Some of them just come over the top of the seat, rather than from the ceiling. Seems like quite a few cars have shoulder belts in all seating positions now. Best wishes, Ericka That is how mine is. The front middle seat is just a lap belt though. |
#10
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lap belt question
"Clisby" wrote in message m... Ericka Kammerer wrote: Clisby wrote: Stephanie wrote: Clisby wrote: If you have a rear seat with 3 belts, how can all of them have a shoulder+lap belt? The center shoulder belt comes down from the ceiling. Our Subaru has it. Oh, OK. I've never seen that. Some of them just come over the top of the seat, rather than from the ceiling. Seems like quite a few cars have shoulder belts in all seating positions now. Could be. We have 2 cars, a 1995 and a 2004, and neither has it. The 2004 car surprises me. Both of our cars have shoulder belts for middle seats. |
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