Reason for weaning from bottle at 1 yo?

[Truffles]

What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by one
year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from continued use
of bottles?

It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.

I'm in no hurry to wean my twins off of bottles. Nipples are easier to
clean than valves. They take their water in sippy cups and milk in bottles.

Does anyone know?

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[Astromum]

Truffles wrote:
> What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by one
> year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from continued use
> of bottles?

IIRC it has to do with proper positioning of the teeth and the development
of the tongue. Both are important for speech development. Sippy cups require
a different drinking technique which helps the tongue to be more versatile.
But that's just what I've heard, perhaps someone with a more expert opinion
can enlighten us. As for the teeth: it is the same issue over and over,
whether a child sucks thumb, finger, pacifier or nipples: all can influence
the positioning of the front teeth. I don't think this is a bad thing,
dentists often think otherwise.

> It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
> Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.

Ah, the Playtex conspiracy ;)

FWIW DS weaned himself of nipples. Just started to refuse them completely
a little while ago.

--
-- Ilse
mom to Olaf (07/15/2002)
TTC #2
"What's the use of brains if you are a girl?"
Aletta Jacobs, first Dutch woman to receive a PhD

[Truffles]

dejablues wrote:

> Truffles wrote:
>
>>What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by one
>>year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from continued use
>>of bottles?
>>
>>It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
>>Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.
>>
>>I'm in no hurry to wean my twins off of bottles. Nipples are easier to
>>clean than valves. They take their water in sippy cups and milk in
>
> bottles.
>
>>Does anyone know?

> Because, like toilet-training, there is a window of opportunity in
> which a child is more amenable to change.

????? I don't understand the connection?

> If you wait too long, it
> becomes an attachment object , not just a means of getting food, and
> it gets harder to give up.

I can understand this. But a sippy cup can become an attachment object
as well. Also, what is wrong with an attachment object?

> Some parents (me included) just do not care
> for the sight of an older baby with a bottle (or pacifier for that
> matter!)

But that is personal preference and with no disrespect to you, I really
don't care if it bothers other people. I care about the physical and
emotional health of my child. If they were shown to be detrimental,
that's one thing, but if it's just fashion, why the push from the doctors?

> You can't lay down with a sippy cup, either.

Sure you can. Although, mine don't lay down with bottles or sippy cups.

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[Kari]

I was told that it can be bad for their teeth if you put anything other than
water in the bottles. Im sure this can be true for sippy cups as well if
kids are sucking on them all day too. But I think the constant sucking of a
bottle is more likely than a constant sucking of a sippy...if that makes
sense. Also for ear problems, the sucking on a bottle is somewhat more
likely to open up the ear canals - I've heard, Im no expert on this at all.

My daughter was weaned at 11 mos because she refused to drink her formula.
We NEVER give anything but that (or breast milk) in bottles so the bottles
went too. My son was breast fed until 9 mos and he went to a bottle and
loved it but on his 1st b-day we threw them all out. He cried the first
night and that was it. His cousin however was nearly 3.5 before he was
weaned because they didnt try to wean until he was already 2 and you can't
reason too well with a 2 yr old. They did say if they had to do it again
they would not have waited.

Honestly, I dont think there is anything *wrong* with it but we didnt do it
and I would get rid of them by a year again if it was an issue again next
time simply because by 12 mos, they don't need them. And I would rather have
my kids drinking from a cup than a bottle when they are toddlers. Of course,
others would disagree and this is just my opinion. Good luck whatever you
decide!

Kari
mom to Kaylie (7) Noah (4) and #3 due Sept/Oct


"Truffles" > wrote in message
...
> What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by one
> year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from continued use
> of bottles?
>
> It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
> Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.
>
> I'm in no hurry to wean my twins off of bottles. Nipples are easier to
> clean than valves. They take their water in sippy cups and milk in
bottles.
>
> Does anyone know?
>
> --
> Brigitte aa #2145
> edd #3 February 15, 2004
> http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/
>
> "Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
> ~ Harriet Martineau
>

[H Schinske]

>Oh, I agree constant sucking of milk/juice (although mine don't drink
>juice) all day can lead to rotten teeth. I guess because I don't use
>the bottles that way I forgot that other people do. I just give them
>their milk, they sit in their chairs and drink it.

I don't see how the delivery method could possibly matter, if that's all you
do. It is lying around with milk/juice/other sugary stuff against the teeth
that can cause baby bottle mouth. It takes prolonged periods of sucking to
deform teeth and palates and so on.

It is of course also bad for the teeth to constantly be sipping any sugary
drink all day long. I guess the ban on bottles is really a ban on those habits,
which are supposed to be part of the whole bottle "thing." But they aren't
necessarily.

--Helen

[Truffles]

dejablues wrote:
> Ok, so here is the word from the American Academy of Pediatrics website.
> http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm

I still don't see anything there that says it's detrimental.

Also, I guess my twins are "weaned" according to the AAP because I don't
let them wander around with it and suck from it all day. <shrug>

I did get a kick out of the "In the beginning, fill the cup with water
and offer it to him at just one meal a day". Who in their right mind
would offer a baby a full cup of water? LOL! :-D

Thanks for the link.

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[toto]

On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 17:20:09 -0400, "dejablues" >
wrote:

>(I must say that I had one child that only took a bottle for two months, one
>for four, and one for three).

Boy yout children sure weaned early. I can't imagine a child of two
months on neither breast or bottle...

My children were breast fed though they did take bottles for juice
on occasion.. Neither went to a cup so early though - about 6 months
was the beginning of sippy cups. And they weaned to regular cups
by around 2. But my dd was still bfing at bedtime until she was
2 1/2 years old. My son weaned at 13 months when he began walking.


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits

[toto]

On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 17:51:32 -0400, "dejablues" >
wrote:

>Ok, so here is the word from the American Academy of Pediatrics website.
>http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm

While I generally like the advice the aap gives, I don't think that it
has to be followed rigidly.

One thing to note here, if the baby is never propped with a bottle,
but always fed on your lap or if the baby is breastfed with no
bottles, then I don't see that you *have* to wean them to sippy
cups at all - you can go directly to a regular cup, just as we did
before sippy cups were ever around. And usually, that would
not be done until the baby was older and had a bit more
eye-hand coordination. Sippy cups are a convenience for
parents - I used one, but we did NOT have those no spill ones
that are around nowadays either so they weren't something
you could just put an infant down with anyway. They made lovely
things to watch water spill out of when upside down with the lid
on at the time.





--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits

[dejablues]

From http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm

"During this process you may be tempted to put milk or juice in his bottle
to help him go to sleep, but don't do it. If he falls asleep while feeding,
the milk or juice will pool around his teeth, and this can cause his
incoming teeth to decay--a condition known as nursing-bottle syndrome. To
make matters worse, drinking while lying flat on his back can also
contribute to middle-ear infections, since the liquid may actually flow
through the eustachian tube into the middle ear.

There's still one more disadvantage to prolonged bottle feeding: The bottle
can become a security object, particularly if your baby keeps it beyond
about age one. To avoid this, don't let him carry or drink from a bottle
while playing. Restrict the use of a bottle to feedings when he's sitting
down or being held. At all other times, give him a cup. If you never allow
him to take the bottle with him, he won't realize that bringing it along is
even an option. Don't relent once this decision has been made, or it could
prompt him to demand a bottle again long after he has "officially" been
weaned. "



And what about this is not detrimental?


"Truffles" > wrote in message
...
> dejablues wrote:
> > Ok, so here is the word from the American Academy of Pediatrics website.
> > http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm
>
> I still don't see anything there that says it's detrimental.
>
> Also, I guess my twins are "weaned" according to the AAP because I don't
> let them wander around with it and suck from it all day. <shrug>
>
> I did get a kick out of the "In the beginning, fill the cup with water
> and offer it to him at just one meal a day". Who in their right mind
> would offer a baby a full cup of water? LOL! :-D
>
> Thanks for the link.
>
> --
> Brigitte aa #2145
> edd #3 February 15, 2004
> http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/
>
> "Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
> ~ Harriet Martineau
>

[Rosalie B.]

x-no-archive:yes toto > wrote:

>On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 17:20:09 -0400, "dejablues" >
>wrote:
>
>>(I must say that I had one child that only took a bottle for two months, one
>>for four, and one for three).
>
>Boy yout children sure weaned early. I can't imagine a child of two
>months on neither breast or bottle...
>
>My children were breast fed though they did take bottles for juice
>on occasion.. Neither went to a cup so early though - about 6 months
>was the beginning of sippy cups. And they weaned to regular cups
>by around 2. But my dd was still bfing at bedtime until she was
>2 1/2 years old. My son weaned at 13 months when he began walking.

We didn't have sippy cups either. None of mine ever had a bottle for
anything after the first one rejected water bottles vigorously - I
never tried it again. OTOH I did start them on a regular cup at about
6 months IIRC. They were drinking from a small cup at the table by 8
months. child one self weaned except at bedtime by 8 months so I know
she must have been drinking from a cup then. She weaned totally when
she started walking at about a year. I went off on a trip when #2 was
8 months. That's why I think they were drinking from cups by then.
#3 was bf at night until 15 months, and #4 wasn't completely weaned
until age 3. (from bf - as I said - no bottle - bottles weren't as
easy in those days either). They did learn to drink from a straw
sometime before a year.

Given that people don't mind now (most people) having a child bf until
fairly old, I don't see why there should be a need to wean from a
bottle either as long as the child doesn't go to sleep with it in the
mouth.

Doctors are human and have prejudices just like other people, so I
would theorize that some of them have the same dislike of babies older
than a year with a bottle or pacifier as have been stated here, and
because of that might recommend that the baby be weaned or not have a
pacifier after a year whether or not that was really medically
indicated.

My personal take on that is that it is more emotional than anything,
and thus there is real reason to do it if you don't want to.

grandma Rosalie

[toto]

On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 19:25:41 -0400, "dejablues" >
wrote:

>That meant , time on the bottle AFTER exclusively breastfeeding. I never
>could get the hang of pumping, so I had one that breastfed for 10 months,
>one for 6, and one for 7. It was actually a fight to get them to TAKE the
>bottle after nursing, and giving it up at one year was pretty easy. . I
>guess I should have been more clear on that!

That does clear it up.

Mine went directly from breast to cup, though. Never had a bottle
with formula or milk in it. Juice occasionally with my son and not
much with dd since she didn't like bottles much.

Granddaughter won't take one at all and she's been offered one
since she was having trouble nursing at one point. She simply
would NOT suck on a bottle nipple at all.


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits

[dejablues]

IMO, bottles are a *sometimes* necessary evil, to be endured rather than
embraced.
I guess I'm somewhat prejudiced having remembered my mom dealing with my
two youngest brothers (preemie twins in 1968, cloth diapers too!) and my
very anti-breast-feeding sis-in-law ("I never felt the urge!" <sigh>) who
had each kid on the bottle til they were 4 years old.
I agree with you Rosalie about the emotionality of the issue. Parents often
make a great deal more of it than the babies do.


"Rosalie B." > wrote in message
...
> x-no-archive:yes toto > wrote:
>
> >On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 17:20:09 -0400, "dejablues" >
> >wrote:
> >
> >>(I must say that I had one child that only took a bottle for two months,
one
> >>for four, and one for three).
> >
> >Boy yout children sure weaned early. I can't imagine a child of two
> >months on neither breast or bottle...
> >
> >My children were breast fed though they did take bottles for juice
> >on occasion.. Neither went to a cup so early though - about 6 months
> >was the beginning of sippy cups. And they weaned to regular cups
> >by around 2. But my dd was still bfing at bedtime until she was
> >2 1/2 years old. My son weaned at 13 months when he began walking.
>
> We didn't have sippy cups either. None of mine ever had a bottle for
> anything after the first one rejected water bottles vigorously - I
> never tried it again. OTOH I did start them on a regular cup at about
> 6 months IIRC. They were drinking from a small cup at the table by 8
> months. child one self weaned except at bedtime by 8 months so I know
> she must have been drinking from a cup then. She weaned totally when
> she started walking at about a year. I went off on a trip when #2 was
> 8 months. That's why I think they were drinking from cups by then.
> #3 was bf at night until 15 months, and #4 wasn't completely weaned
> until age 3. (from bf - as I said - no bottle - bottles weren't as
> easy in those days either). They did learn to drink from a straw
> sometime before a year.
>
> Given that people don't mind now (most people) having a child bf until
> fairly old, I don't see why there should be a need to wean from a
> bottle either as long as the child doesn't go to sleep with it in the
> mouth.
>
> Doctors are human and have prejudices just like other people, so I
> would theorize that some of them have the same dislike of babies older
> than a year with a bottle or pacifier as have been stated here, and
> because of that might recommend that the baby be weaned or not have a
> pacifier after a year whether or not that was really medically
> indicated.
>
> My personal take on that is that it is more emotional than anything,
> and thus there is real reason to do it if you don't want to.
>
> grandma Rosalie

[toto]

On Tue, 8 Jul 2003 19:29:19 -0400, "dejablues" >
wrote:

>From http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm
>
>"During this process you may be tempted to put milk or juice in his bottle
>to help him go to sleep, but don't do it. If he falls asleep while feeding,
>the milk or juice will pool around his teeth, and this can cause his
>incoming teeth to decay--a condition known as nursing-bottle syndrome. To
>make matters worse, drinking while lying flat on his back can also
>contribute to middle-ear infections, since the liquid may actually flow
>through the eustachian tube into the middle ear.
>
If he isn't lying down with the bottle and he doesn't have milk in it
while wandering around, then this is not going to be a problem.
You don;t have to wean him from the bottle not to do this.. You just
have to keep feeding him yourself and not giving him the bottle to
sleep with.

>There's still one more disadvantage to prolonged bottle feeding: The bottle
>can become a security object, particularly if your baby keeps it beyond
>about age one. To avoid this, don't let him carry or drink from a bottle
>while playing. Restrict the use of a bottle to feedings when he's sitting
>down or being held. At all other times, give him a cup. If you never allow
>him to take the bottle with him, he won't realize that bringing it along is
>even an option. Don't relent once this decision has been made, or it could
>prompt him to demand a bottle again long after he has "officially" been
>weaned. "
>
>
>
>And what about this is not detrimental?
>
Frankly I think it's hogwash. Security objects are not detrimental
in fact they are helpful to babies emotional health. If he does get
attached to a bottle so what.. Let him carry around one with water
or an empty one.


--
Dorothy

There is no sound, no cry in all the world
that can be heard unless someone listens ..
Outer Limits

[kereru]

"Truffles" > wrote in message
...
> What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by one
> year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from continued use
> of bottles?
>

I have heard they can be bad for the kids teeth in the long run.


> It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
> Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.
>

True but it's a step in the direction of using a cup. I used on just as a
way to get Hamish used to the idea, he uses a normal cup now.


> I'm in no hurry to wean my twins off of bottles. Nipples are easier to
> clean than valves. They take their water in sippy cups and milk in
bottles.

This is what we did. I think it was the best of both worlds. Hamish got used
to the cup and learned to use a cup properly but there was no rush to get
rid of the bottle. He gave the bottle up himself at about 18 months.

Judy












>
> Does anyone know?
>
> --
> Brigitte aa #2145
> edd #3 February 15, 2004
> http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/
>
> "Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
> ~ Harriet Martineau
>

[Naomi Pardue]

>It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
>Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.
>

While there are lots of reasons given that have varying amounts of validity
(tooth decay, attachment issues, 'window of opportunity', etc.), my guess would
be that it's really just one of those things that has just always been done.
Back when baby feeding first began to become 'scientific' doctors typically
began recommending weaning (from the breast -- few babies were formula fed at
that point), between 9-12 months, because they'd found that babies nursed
longer than that often became anemic. (Keep in mind that there was no mixed
feeding. A bf baby got only breastmilk, so anemia would be likely by one year.)

Soon after this, formula feeding began to be common, and the 'wean 9-12 months'
rule was simply carried over to formula.
Plus, there was lots of concern about encouraging children to become mature and
independent as soon as possible, and getting babies off the bottle would aid
that.
(And, of course, once a baby switched from formula to cows milk, it made
practical sense to switch him to a cup, since the practice of preparing the
formula and sterlizing the bottles went hand in hand.)

Today, I think different doctors have different attitudes. (Just as with
breastfeeding.) Some will push to get baby off the bottle early. Others figure
that baby will wean when he's ready....


Naomi
CAPPA Certified Lactation Educator

(either remove spamblock or change address to to e-mail
reply.)

[dragonlady]

In article
>,
dragonlady > wrote:

> In article >,
> "dejablues" > wrote:
>
> > From http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm
> >
> > "During this process you may be tempted to put milk or juice in his bottle
> > to help him go to sleep, but don't do it. If he falls asleep while feeding,
> > the milk or juice will pool around his teeth, and this can cause his
> > incoming teeth to decay--a condition known as nursing-bottle syndrome. To
> > make matters worse, drinking while lying flat on his back can also
> > contribute to middle-ear infections, since the liquid may actually flow
> > through the eustachian tube into the middle ear.
> >
> > There's still one more disadvantage to prolonged bottle feeding: The bottle
> > can become a security object, particularly if your baby keeps it beyond
> > about age one. To avoid this, don't let him carry or drink from a bottle
> > while playing. Restrict the use of a bottle to feedings when he's sitting
> > down or being held. At all other times, give him a cup. If you never allow
> > him to take the bottle with him, he won't realize that bringing it along is
> > even an option. Don't relent once this decision has been made, or it could
> > prompt him to demand a bottle again long after he has "officially" been
> > weaned. "
> >
> >
> My mother was unable to breastfeed (or at least believed she was unable;
> since I'm 51 and my youngest sister is 33, it's been a while). But she
> absolutly insisted that the BIGGEST advantage to breastfeeding was that
> breastfed babies were never propped: they were always in contact with
> another human being when they were being fed. So, in our house, any
> baby being given a bottle was always also being held. She also never
> let the baby hold the bottle without someone else's hand on it, too.
> (Added bonus was that Mom had a good excuse to get off her feet -- and
> with, at one point, four teenagers and a toddler and a baby, I'm sure
> that came in handy.)
>
> While this is different from the APA's position, it is consistant.

Oh -- and she also never put anything but formula in bottles; water and
juice were drunk out of cups or glasses -- and I don't think she ever
owned a sippy cup.

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

[Banty]

In article >,
dragonlady says...
>
>In article >,
> "dejablues" > wrote:
>
>> From http://www.aap.org/pubserv/weaning.htm
>>
>> "During this process you may be tempted to put milk or juice in his bottle
>> to help him go to sleep, but don't do it. If he falls asleep while feeding,
>> the milk or juice will pool around his teeth, and this can cause his
>> incoming teeth to decay--a condition known as nursing-bottle syndrome. To
>> make matters worse, drinking while lying flat on his back can also
>> contribute to middle-ear infections, since the liquid may actually flow
>> through the eustachian tube into the middle ear.
>>
>> There's still one more disadvantage to prolonged bottle feeding: The bottle
>> can become a security object, particularly if your baby keeps it beyond
>> about age one. To avoid this, don't let him carry or drink from a bottle
>> while playing. Restrict the use of a bottle to feedings when he's sitting
>> down or being held. At all other times, give him a cup. If you never allow
>> him to take the bottle with him, he won't realize that bringing it along is
>> even an option. Don't relent once this decision has been made, or it could
>> prompt him to demand a bottle again long after he has "officially" been
>> weaned. "
>>
>>
>My mother was unable to breastfeed (or at least believed she was unable;
>since I'm 51 and my youngest sister is 33, it's been a while). But she
>absolutly insisted that the BIGGEST advantage to breastfeeding was that
>breastfed babies were never propped: they were always in contact with
>another human being when they were being fed. So, in our house, any
>baby being given a bottle was always also being held. She also never
>let the baby hold the bottle without someone else's hand on it, too.
>(Added bonus was that Mom had a good excuse to get off her feet -- and
>with, at one point, four teenagers and a toddler and a baby, I'm sure
>that came in handy.)
>
>While this is different from the APA's position, it is consistant.

Well, this is one of those medical things where it's good to know the reasoning,
then intellegently apply it to one's own situation.

I let my son have his bottles until he weaned himself off of them at 18 months.
He had been unintersted in an evening bottle for some time - he hung on to his
*morning* bottle, which he'd always toss somewhere when he was done (he never
did much have a lovey of any sort). There was no temptation for me to leave him
to fall asleep with milk in his mouth.

Similar with the rule not to warm up bottles in the microwave. Once I read up
on it and found that it's not a matter of the milk deteriorating or anything
like that, but rather a matter of concern over hot spots in unmixed milk, I went
ahead and heated his bottles up in the microwave. Because I know, with just me
in the house, with a firm habit of shaking the bottle after microwaving, it
wouldn't be a problem.

Banty

[Truffles]

Ruth Shear wrote:

> Truffles wrote:
>
>>I'm trying to teach them to drink from an open cup. Right now they sit
>>on a towel and drink from the cup, but half the time they pour out the
>>water to see what happens. LOL! ;-)
>
> Us too. Just make sure you clean up ALL the spills. DS has had several
> nasty spills by stepping in the smallest drop or two of water on the
> floor which send his feet flying up and he falls backwards landing on
> the back of his head first before the rest of his body lands. The last
> time this happened we spent a few hours in hospital getting a CAT scan
> to rule out concussion (because he hit his head the same day that he
> caught a rotavirus so his vomiting was a coincidence).

Alas, we have carpet in our house. :-(

But, thanks for the warning. It might not be very pertinent to us but
I'm sure it is for others.

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[H Schinske]

Dorothy wrote:

>Frankly I think it's hogwash. Security objects are not detrimental
>in fact they are helpful to babies emotional health. If he does get
>attached to a bottle so what.. Let him carry around one with water
>or an empty one.

In fact a different page on the AAP site quoted says exactly this, though not
about bottles as such: "Despite myths to the contrary, transitional objects are
not a sign of weakness or insecurity, and there's no reason to keep your child
from using one. In fact, a transitional object can be so helpful that you may
want to help him choose one and build it into his nighttime ritual."
http://www.aap.org/pubserv/transobj.htm

I found the juxtaposition pretty funny. :-)

--Helen, a Linus fan from way back

[Tai]

Truffles wrote:
> What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by
> one year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from
> continued use
> of bottles?
>
> It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
> Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to
> clean.
>
> I'm in no hurry to wean my twins off of bottles. Nipples are easier to
> clean than valves. They take their water in sippy cups and milk in
> bottles.
>
> Does anyone know?

I'm not sure why there's such a rush to get rid of bottles after 12 months.
My feeling was always that I would at least comfort breastfeed a toddler
into his third year if he wanted it. So it seemed natural to continue bottle
feeding that long for the same reasons. I was able to bf my eldest child
until he weaned himself at around 18 months but my daughter was bottlefed
from 3 - 4 months until 2ish. I think she gave it up when she dropped her
daytime nap and she was then ready to let it go. My youngest is almost 30
months and he has a bottle of cow's milk when going to bed and sometimes
when he's ill or upset.

I am reluctant to stop it just yet just because it is so successful as a
calming agent. Another reason is that he is one of those children who isn't
very interested in food and exists on fruit, yoghurt and vegemite toast.
However, he's starting to drop his daytime nap so I don't think his bottle
will last much longer. He can drink out of a normal cup and bottles are
always given from someone's arms and never left in his cot. None of my
children have had trouble with their teeth or speech, and, though none were
early talkers, the older two had no problems and speak well (13 and 11) and
the youngest is progressing normally.

I think you should do whatever you feel is good for your babies and what
makes your life easiest. Especially with twins!

BTW I've always found straw cups better than sippy cups. When they tip them
over you only get a small amount of spillage from whatever's in the straw at
the time and I found my children could suck on a straw far more effectively
and earlier than they could on a valved sippy cup.

Tai

[Sue]

I weaned two of my children off of the bottle at a year and my oldest off of
the bottle at 15 months. The reason? Well mostly because that's what the
docs said and the baby books AND I wanted them off because if you wait until
a little later when they are toddlers, then it becomes much harder. None of
my kids minded having the bottle taken away at that point. They were
drinking out of sippy cups since six months. My oldest was the only one that
had a hard time and she was 15 months. So the next two, I got them off of it
sooner so I didn't want to miss my window of opportunity.
--
Sue
mom to three girls

Truffles > wrote in message
...
> What is the reasoning behind weaning off of bottles to sippy cups by one
> year? Are there studies showing detrimental effects from continued use
> of bottles?
>
> It just seems to me one year is a little early to wean off a bottle.
> Also, *IMO* a sippy cup is just a glorified bottle that's harder to clean.
>
> I'm in no hurry to wean my twins off of bottles. Nipples are easier to
> clean than valves. They take their water in sippy cups and milk in
bottles.
>
> Does anyone know?
>
> --
> Brigitte aa #2145
> edd #3 February 15, 2004
> http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/
>
> "Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
> ~ Harriet Martineau
>

[Banty]

In article >, Truffles says...
>
>Sue wrote:
>>>dejablues wrote:
>>> > Because, like toilet-training, there is a window of opportunity in
>>> > which a child is more amenable to change.
>>
>>
>>>Truffles > wrote in message
>>>????? I don't understand the connection?
>>
>>
>> What don't you get? You don't understand the window of opportunity?
>>
>> If you don't understand, then there are certain ages and stages that
>> children go through that they are more willing to have something changed.
>> Like introducing solids, weaning from the breast, potty training,
>> introducing a sippy cup. There are certain times in babies when something
>> can be changed and it is much easier to do rather than waiting later.
>
>I've never potty trained a child before. I was under the assumption it
>wasn't about windows of opportunity but about the child being ready for
>the change. That is why I couldn't see the connection between potty
>training and taking away a bottle.

Same here. The potty training *and* the bottle weaning can be child-directed,
unless there is a specifc issue with the bottle feeding.

There may be a window of opportunity for early potty-training when 2 year olds
are eager enough to please parents to overcome other limitations (and advocates
that all potty training should happen at that point), but the bottle weaning
recommendataion as I understand it is based on needs for formula vs. teeth
appearing, etc., not a trainable "window of opporunity" concern.

Banty

[Truffles]

Sue wrote:

> Oh gotcha, lol. Well imo, everything has a window of opportunity to it, even
> potty training. If the child is ready to be potty trained and the
> opportunity is missed, then it gets harder. Potty training is harder window
> because lots of 2 year olds start showing an interest in sitting on the
> potty and parents mistaken it for that they are ready, but usually they are
> not ready until they can make the connection of having to go and getting to
> the potty on time. Potty training probably wasn't a good example.

Yes. I have heard of that interest misconception. Katerina is
interested when I use the washroom but I know she is far from ready
because she doesn't get the "connection".

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[dragonlady]

In article >,
Banty > wrote:

> In article >, Truffles says...
> >
> >Sue wrote:
> >>>dejablues wrote:
> >>> > Because, like toilet-training, there is a window of opportunity in
> >>> > which a child is more amenable to change.
> >>
> >>
> >>>Truffles > wrote in message
> >>>????? I don't understand the connection?
> >>
> >>
> >> What don't you get? You don't understand the window of opportunity?
> >>
> >> If you don't understand, then there are certain ages and stages that
> >> children go through that they are more willing to have something changed.
> >> Like introducing solids, weaning from the breast, potty training,
> >> introducing a sippy cup. There are certain times in babies when something
> >> can be changed and it is much easier to do rather than waiting later.
> >
> >I've never potty trained a child before. I was under the assumption it
> >wasn't about windows of opportunity but about the child being ready for
> >the change. That is why I couldn't see the connection between potty
> >training and taking away a bottle.
>
> Same here. The potty training *and* the bottle weaning can be
> child-directed,
> unless there is a specifc issue with the bottle feeding.
>
> There may be a window of opportunity for early potty-training when 2 year
> olds
> are eager enough to please parents to overcome other limitations (and
> advocates
> that all potty training should happen at that point), but the bottle weaning
> recommendataion as I understand it is based on needs for formula vs. teeth
> appearing, etc., not a trainable "window of opporunity" concern.
>
> Banty
>

I'm not so sure that there isn't a "widow of opportunity" for weaning,
too.

When my twins were between 1 and 1-1/2, they both went through phases
where they seemed basically uninterested in nursing, except at bedtime.
I think it would have been easy to wean them at that point -- except
they didn't both go through that phase at the same time, and, for each
of them, seeing the other nurse seemed to trigger a reminder of some
sort that maybe THEY wanted to nurse, too.

Of course, this is purely anecdotal, but I did know quite a number of
nursing moms who weaned during that period pretty painlessly; if they
didn't, it tended to wait until the babies were over about 2-1/2.

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

[Sue]

Oh gotcha, lol. Well imo, everything has a window of opportunity to it, even
potty training. If the child is ready to be potty trained and the
opportunity is missed, then it gets harder. Potty training is harder window
because lots of 2 year olds start showing an interest in sitting on the
potty and parents mistaken it for that they are ready, but usually they are
not ready until they can make the connection of having to go and getting to
the potty on time. Potty training probably wasn't a good example.
--
Sue
mom to three girls

Truffles > wrote in message
...
> Sue wrote:
> >>dejablues wrote:
> >> > Because, like toilet-training, there is a window of opportunity in
> >> > which a child is more amenable to change.
> >
> >
> >>Truffles > wrote in message
> >>????? I don't understand the connection?
> >
> >
> > What don't you get? You don't understand the window of opportunity?
> >
> > If you don't understand, then there are certain ages and stages that
> > children go through that they are more willing to have something
changed.
> > Like introducing solids, weaning from the breast, potty training,
> > introducing a sippy cup. There are certain times in babies when
something
> > can be changed and it is much easier to do rather than waiting later.
>
> I've never potty trained a child before. I was under the assumption it
> wasn't about windows of opportunity but about the child being ready for
> the change. That is why I couldn't see the connection between potty
> training and taking away a bottle.
>
> --
> Brigitte aa #2145
> edd #3 February 15, 2004
> http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/
>
> "Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
> ~ Harriet Martineau
>

[==Daye==]

On Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:49:40 -0700, "Sue"
> wrote:

>I didn't have any problems cleaning the sippy cups. Put them in the
>dishwasher and your done.

You are assuming that *everyone* has a dishwasher. Not everyone
does... me included.

--
==Daye==
E-mail: brendana AT labyrinth DOT net DOT au

[Banty]

In article >, "Sue" says...
>
>> On Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:49:40 -0700, "Sue"
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >I didn't have any problems cleaning the sippy cups. Put them in the
>> >dishwasher and your done.
>
>> ==Daye== > wrote in message
>> You are assuming that *everyone* has a dishwasher. Not everyone
>> does... me included.
>> ==Daye==
>
>Yeah, what's funny about that is I don't have a dishwasher either. I figured
>I was the only one living in the dark ages ;o)

I rented a cabin in Wisconsin for a week for vacation. Actually, it was one of
their apartment units. It had a nice sunny eat-in kitchen with a stove, full
size refrigerator, double sink, large microwave, Formica counter, and tons of
cabinet space.

The owner at one point made a small apology for the "outdated kitchen". I think
I just frowned in puzzlement. It was some time before it occurred to me that
the only thing tht might ordinarily be in a kitchen that wasn't there was a
dishwasher.

I don't have a dishwasher at home either!

Banty

[Naomi Pardue]

>Yeah, what's funny about that is I don't have a dishwasher either. I figured
>I was the only one living in the dark ages ;o)
>--

We don't have one either.

Anyone else absolultely HATE that commercial for, I think, Chinette paper
plates where the gist of it is that the act of actually scraping a few plates
and putting them in the dishwasher is SOOO time consuming and tiring that if
you are really a loving and caring mother, you will use paper plates instead so
you can spend more quality time with your family? (Presumably the family has
also eaten take-out, since if they had actually cooked a meal, there would
STILL be pots to put in the dishwasher....)


Naomi
CAPPA Certified Lactation Educator

(either remove spamblock or change address to to e-mail
reply.)

[Sue]

> On Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:49:40 -0700, "Sue"
> > wrote:
>
> >I didn't have any problems cleaning the sippy cups. Put them in the
> >dishwasher and your done.

> ==Daye== > wrote in message
> You are assuming that *everyone* has a dishwasher. Not everyone
> does... me included.
> ==Daye==

Yeah, what's funny about that is I don't have a dishwasher either. I figured
I was the only one living in the dark ages ;o)
--
Sue
mom to three girls

[Truffles]

==Daye== wrote:

> On Wed, 9 Jul 2003 06:49:40 -0700, "Sue"
> > wrote:
>
>
>>I didn't have any problems cleaning the sippy cups. Put them in the
>>dishwasher and your done.
>
>
> You are assuming that *everyone* has a dishwasher. Not everyone
> does... me included.

Actually, I do have a dishwasher but I don't like to put the bottles,
rings, and nipples in it. I find the bottles don't work as well after
they've been in there. I also found the nipples deteriorate quicker.

As for sippy cups in the dishwasher, maybe it's the type I have but I
find they just don't get as clean as if I hand wash them. And with all
the nooks and crannies of the valves and lids to the sippy cups, I find
rinse water pooled in them. Yuck.

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[Lynne M.]

Truffles > wrote in message >...
> Sue wrote:
> >>dejablues wrote:
> >> > Because, like toilet-training, there is a window of opportunity in
> >> > which a child is more amenable to change.
> >
> >
> >>Truffles > wrote in message
> >>????? I don't understand the connection?
> >
> >
> > What don't you get? You don't understand the window of opportunity?
> >
> > If you don't understand, then there are certain ages and stages that
> > children go through that they are more willing to have something changed.
> > Like introducing solids, weaning from the breast, potty training,
> > introducing a sippy cup. There are certain times in babies when something
> > can be changed and it is much easier to do rather than waiting later.
>
> I've never potty trained a child before. I was under the assumption it
> wasn't about windows of opportunity but about the child being ready for
> the change. That is why I couldn't see the connection between potty
> training and taking away a bottle.

I think the windows of opportunity are variable and depend more
on the particular child's development than a calendar. Like
everything else that they give you charts and approximate ages
for, individual children don't necessarily fit into the mold. Some
children are talking clearly at 18 months; others not until 3 -- and
they are all normal. Same with walking, talking, cutting teeth,
toilet training, and anything else you can think of. For a child who
has good/early fine motor skills and is already eating quite a bit of
table
food by a year, maybe weaning off the bottle is appropriate at
that time. Other children may still be almost exclusively
breastfeeding or bottle feeding at the same age. Deciding
that *they* need a cup at that time might not be so good for that
particular child's developmental timetable. I think it's good to
note the general "guidelines" and then see if they seem appropriate
for your own child. Some folks also have strong personal preferences
for certain things, like no pacifiers and whatnot, and others take
a more laissez faire approach. In the long run, I doubt that it
makes a great deal of difference.

Lynne
an arbitrary age

[dragonlady]

In article >,
(Naomi Pardue) wrote:

> >Yeah, what's funny about that is I don't have a dishwasher either. I figured
> >I was the only one living in the dark ages ;o)
> >--
>
> We don't have one either.
>
> Anyone else absolultely HATE that commercial for, I think, Chinette paper
> plates where the gist of it is that the act of actually scraping a few plates
> and putting them in the dishwasher is SOOO time consuming and tiring that if
> you are really a loving and caring mother, you will use paper plates instead
> so
> you can spend more quality time with your family? (Presumably the family has
> also eaten take-out, since if they had actually cooked a meal, there would
> STILL be pots to put in the dishwasher....)
>
>
> Naomi
> CAPPA Certified Lactation Educator
>
> (either remove spamblock or change address to to e-mail
> reply.)

Then there's the fact that she could have more time with her family if
THEY HELPED WITH THE DISHES! Why on earth is she alone in the kitchen
while DH and children play in the other room? (To say nothing of all of
the other benefits of having everyone working together.)

If even three people work on it, dinner dishes for most meals can be
done in little more than 10 minutes. Even without a dishwasher, it
doesn't take all that long. (Ours has been broken for about two months;
it will be another month or so before we can get it fixed. We're
surviving, though I don't much like it.)

meh
--
Children won't care how much you know until they know how much you care

[==Daye==]

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 05:55:46 -0700, "Sue"
> wrote:

>Yeah, what's funny about that is I don't have a dishwasher either. I figured
>I was the only one living in the dark ages ;o)

LOL! Okay... We live in a rented house. No dishwasher was here
when we moved in. No place to put a dishwasher as the kitchen is
REALLY, REALLY small. Handwashing is for the birds. Yep, there
are heaps of us living in the dark ages!

--
==Daye==
E-mail: brendana AT labyrinth DOT net DOT au

[Naomi Pardue]

>Handwashing is for the birds. Yep, there

I've never had a dishwasher. (That's actually not true. THe apartment I lived
in for a couple of years had one, but it was so old and crappy that you had to
literally prewash the dishes before you put them in it, so it wasn't worth the
effort to even use it.)
While I'll admit that I do tend to let the dishes pile up, it's more a matter
of not liking to do housework in general than any particular dislike of washing
dishes. I really don't mind washing them. (I'd much rather wash dishes than
vacuum the floor or wash the windows or clean up cat puke or ... sigh.... pick
up the ceiling that is all over the living room floor right now. [DH decided to
replace part of the roof yesterday. After he removed it, he quit for the day.
Then it started to rain. Hard. Part of the ceiling is now on the floor. What
fun. [ANd yes, we were both up most of the night last night trying to protect
the furniture and book shevles and everything else from the rain pouring
in.]]])


Naomi
CAPPA Certified Lactation Educator

(either remove spamblock or change address to to e-mail
reply.)

[Karen G]

It isn't necessary to wean off of bottles to sippy cups (with valves).
I have weaned two of my children and am in the process of weaning my 9
month old over to what I call "drippy cups." These cups just have a
smaller opening. I think they require a bit more fine motor control,
but that isn't a bad thing. From there, more conservative experts
suggest switching to an open cup at 18 months.

Karen

[HollyLewis]

>So if the child is breastfed, and still nursing at say 16 months, it makes
>sense that while their mom is at work the baby will still want its milk from
>a bottle, as the baby is not weaning.

Except that a nursing toddler is MUCH less likely to develop any emotional
attachment to a bottle, and his/her mother is more likely to have stopped
offering a bottle. The only bottle-toting toddlers I've ever known or heard of
are those who *did* wean from the breast early or were switched to formula
before 1 year. The ones who are still breastfeeding at 16 months generally
aren't using bottles, because Mom has stopped pumping!

That was certainly the case for mine, anyway -- we never put anything other
than breastmilk in the bottles (and ebm was provided only in bottles). I
stopped pumping when DS was barely 13 months old (after a long, gradual process
of reducing the amount of ebm he got during the day) and he never had another
bottle. Didn't upset him in the slightest, and he was *not* drinking cows'
milk at the time either.

He shares his nanny with a FF girl -- same age, still getting some bottles
(though I don't know if they're formula or cows' milk). Now every time he sees
a bottle he identifies it as belonging to or being like those belonging to his
friend.

Holly
Mom to Camden, 2 yrs

[Cathy Weeks]

Truffles > wrote in message >...

> Actually, I do have a dishwasher but I don't like to put the bottles,
> rings, and nipples in it. I find the bottles don't work as well after
> they've been in there. I also found the nipples deteriorate quicker.
>
> As for sippy cups in the dishwasher, maybe it's the type I have but I
> find they just don't get as clean as if I hand wash them. And with all
> the nooks and crannies of the valves and lids to the sippy cups, I find
> rinse water pooled in them. Yuck.

Yeah, we have the avent bottles and sippy cups, and the valves are
MUCH harder to get clean than the nipples. The nipples just go in the
top of the bottle basket. The valves, which work GREAT, have to be
taken apart to get clean. The valve must be removed from the spout,
and the valve itself should be taken apart (hard plastic disk and
silicon layer come apart) to get clean. I've not had trouble getting
either to work after being in dishwasher, so I've got no complaints.

Cathy Weeks
Mommy to Kivi Alexis 12/01

[Truffles]

HollyLewis wrote:

>>So if the child is breastfed, and still nursing at say 16 months, it makes
>>sense that while their mom is at work the baby will still want its milk from
>>a bottle, as the baby is not weaning.
>
>
> Except that a nursing toddler is MUCH less likely to develop any emotional
> attachment to a bottle, and his/her mother is more likely to have stopped
> offering a bottle. The only bottle-toting toddlers I've ever known or heard of
> are those who *did* wean from the breast early or were switched to formula
> before 1 year.

Mine have cow's milk in their bottles, they nursed a little past one
year, but they have no emotional attachment to their bottles because
they don't cart them around. They sit, drink, and then hand them to me
when done. So, I think it is possible to have weaned early and still
not develop an attachment to bottles.

--
Brigitte aa #2145
edd #3 February 15, 2004
http://www.babiesonline.com/babies/j/joshuaandkaterina/

"Readers are plentiful; thinkers are rare."
~ Harriet Martineau

[HollyLewis]

> So, I think it is possible to have weaned early and still
>not develop an attachment to bottles.

Oh, I didn't mean to imply otherwise. I said that all the bottle-toting
toddlers I've known have weaned or been weaned early, not that all early
weaners become bottle-toting toddlers. :-)

Holly
Mom to Camden, 2 yrs