You're Not My Dad!

[toypup]

I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.

Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a tantruming
child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I would know
something is wrong.

Coupled with my observations, I've yet to hear a story of a child saving
him/herself by yelling, "He's not my dad!" I have, however, heard of
children saving themselves by yelling "Help!" In fact, one story that
stands out in my mind, the child was being hauled from the bathroom out of
the store when he yelled, "Help!" and a woman who was part of the rescue
said she knew he was being abducted, because a child doesn't normally yell
"Help!" when it's his own parent.

So, what do you all think?

[Welches]

"toypup" > wrote in message
t...
>I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
>they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
>recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
>come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
>recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
>recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
>naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.
>
> Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
> being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
> tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a
> tantruming child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I
> would know something is wrong.
>
> Coupled with my observations, I've yet to hear a story of a child saving
> him/herself by yelling, "He's not my dad!" I have, however, heard of
> children saving themselves by yelling "Help!" In fact, one story that
> stands out in my mind, the child was being hauled from the bathroom out of
> the store when he yelled, "Help!" and a woman who was part of the rescue
> said she knew he was being abducted, because a child doesn't normally yell
> "Help!" when it's his own parent.
>
> So, what do you all think?
I have seen a tantuming child shout "help"on a couple of occasions, and in
both cases I knew (by sight) the family, and knew it was a tantrum not a
serious situation. My brother shouted it when my dad was taking him to the
barbers too. I have heard of a child who shouted "you're not my mum" at
their mum too!
I think that generally people are too easy (here) about just letting a child
go. I've several times come across a child who's walked quite a distance
either quietly crying or walking along shouting "mum" at intervals.
So I don't think there's an easy answer.
I think maybe shouting "help" for a start off would get attention, then
switching to "you're not my mum/dad" afterwards.
Debbie

[[email protected]]

toypup wrote:
>
> So, what do you all think?

In terms of strategy alone (not in terms of what it would be easy to
teach to a child necessarily) the best bet would be to teach the child
to appeal to a *specific* person. Even in adults, a broad-based appeal
with a lot of ambiguity is likely to result in a low level of bystander
helping according to all the research - if people aren't sure what's
going on, and they're surrounded by other people who also aren't
helping, they're not likely to help no matter what exact words the
distress call includes. However, I bet it would up the odds if the
child was quick-witted enough to pick someone out of the environment
and say, "Lady in the blue dress, help me!" It would be even better if
the child could break away and actually run to another adult and enlist
their help directly. At that point, the phrase "That's not my dad!"
might be pretty helpful, but probably not before. I'm just not sure
that a terrified child would be able to do any of that.

As a society we tend to believe that parents ought to be left to handle
their own children within broad limits, and many people get quite
belligerent if their parenting is questioned, especially in a
high-emotion situation like a public tantrum. Any helpful stranger may
actually be putting him/herself in some danger by intervening, so
he/she will want to be pretty damn sure that there's geuninely a
problem and that he/she really is responsible for helping. Anything
that would make that more likely would be a good idea.

Beth

[Donna Metler]

I've heard tantrumming kids yell out lots of stuff-my brother would cry
"CHILD ABUSE!" at times when my mother wanted him to do something he didn't
want to do until he actually got the attention of a police officer who,
after figuring out that he wasn't being abused, explained in no uncertain
terms what the consequences of claiming abuse, or filing a false police
report, could be. A relatively calm kid yelling "HELP"-or "YOU'RE NOT MY
DAD" would get my attention, but a kid in a tantrum? Well, I've seen too
many of those to not be aware that a child is perfectly capable of claiming
his parents are members of a terrorist cell if he thinks that will get him
what he wants at that point in time!

--
Donna DeVore Metler
Orff Music Specialist/Kindermusik
Mother to Angel Brian Anthony 1/1/2002, 22 weeks, severe PE/HELLP
And Allison Joy, 11/25/04 (35 weeks, PIH, Pre-term labor)

[[email protected]]

Donna Metler wrote:
> I've heard tantrumming kids yell out lots of stuff-my brother would cry
> "CHILD ABUSE!" at times when my mother wanted him to do something he didn't
> want to do until he actually got the attention of a police officer who,
> after figuring out that he wasn't being abused, explained in no uncertain
> terms what the consequences of claiming abuse, or filing a false police
> report, could be. A relatively calm kid yelling "HELP"-or "YOU'RE NOT MY
> DAD" would get my attention, but a kid in a tantrum? Well, I've seen too
> many of those to not be aware that a child is perfectly capable of claiming
> his parents are members of a terrorist cell if he thinks that will get him
> what he wants at that point in time!

Heh. Yes, a small child of my acquaintance who shall remain nameless
actually *called 911* to report child abuse when his mom, at the
culmination of a tough disciplinary situation, said something to him
like, "For the love of God, if you don't stop badgering me about it I'm
going to smack you." Luckily the responding officer understood that
this was not truly a child abuse situation. The point is, anything one
can teach a child to do in case of a true emergency, the child can then
choose to do when it might throw a monkey wrench into the activities of
benevolent adults who happen to be doing something that the child
doesn't like. It makes it really hard to know what to tell kids to do
if a true kidnapping presents itself.

To be honest, I don't worry about it that much myself, because the
likelihood that this situation will ever present itself - child carried
away by strangers in a public place - is very, very low. Stranger
kidnappings are pretty rare anyway, and then only a subset of them are
going to involve a stranger attempting to snatch a kid by force in a
public place. I am more careful to impress upon my son never to follow
an apparently friendly stranger to a *private* place, but in the end,
there are other safety concerns I worry about more.

Beth

[toypup]

"Donna Metler" > wrote in message
. ..
> I've heard tantrumming kids yell out lots of stuff-my brother would cry
> "CHILD ABUSE!" at times when my mother wanted him to do something he
> didn't
> want to do until he actually got the attention of a police officer who,
> after figuring out that he wasn't being abused, explained in no uncertain
> terms what the consequences of claiming abuse, or filing a false police
> report, could be. A relatively calm kid yelling "HELP"-or "YOU'RE NOT MY
> DAD" would get my attention, but a kid in a tantrum? Well, I've seen too
> many of those to not be aware that a child is perfectly capable of
> claiming
> his parents are members of a terrorist cell if he thinks that will get him
> what he wants at that point in time!

But if a kid were being abducted, why would he be calm? Panicked, kicking
and screaming is more the vision I have, which would likely resemble a
tantrum.

[toypup]

> wrote in message
ps.com...
> To be honest, I don't worry about it that much myself, because the
> likelihood that this situation will ever present itself - child carried
> away by strangers in a public place - is very, very low. Stranger
> kidnappings are pretty rare anyway, and then only a subset of them are
> going to involve a stranger attempting to snatch a kid by force in a
> public place. I am more careful to impress upon my son never to follow
> an apparently friendly stranger to a *private* place, but in the end,
> there are other safety concerns I worry about more.

Actually, DS is 5yo and I've never brought up any conversation regarding
abductions for the same reason.

[Laura Faussone]

toypup wrote:
>
> But if a kid were being abducted, why would he be calm? Panicked, kicking
> and screaming is more the vision I have, which would likely resemble a
> tantrum.
>
>

Don't they usually have a good story to get the kid away, like
"Help me look for my puppy"? If someone's actually going to
abduct a child, the last thing they'd want to do is attract
attention to themselves.

[toypup]

"Laura Faussone" > wrote in message
...
> toypup wrote:
>>
>> But if a kid were being abducted, why would he be calm? Panicked,
>> kicking and screaming is more the vision I have, which would likely
>> resemble a tantrum.
>
> Don't they usually have a good story to get the kid away, like "Help me
> look for my puppy"? If someone's actually going to abduct a child, the
> last thing they'd want to do is attract attention to themselves.

In which case, the kid would normally not be yelling "help!" nor "He's not
my dad!" No, I do not believe it is common for the abductors to be so
brazen. I am just not thinking it's a great idea to teach "He's not my
dad!" which you hear so much about when people talk about what they teach
their kids regarding abduction.

FWIW, I try telling DS not to go with anyone for any reason without asking
me first (or another adult if I'm not there) no matter what, even if I know
that person. So far, it hasn't sunken in, since when I give him different
scenarios, he always gives me the wrong answer or he just gives me the
answer I'm looking for, but I know he doesn't get it. Basically, I think
he'd be duped into going. So far, he's tried leaving school with different
moms, just because he wants to carpool. The moms have to come find me and I
see him tagging along behind.

[Welches]

"toypup" > wrote in message
et...
>
> "<snip>
> FWIW, I try telling DS not to go with anyone for any reason without asking
> me first (or another adult if I'm not there) no matter what, even if I
> know that person. So far, it hasn't sunken in, since when I give him
> different
> scenarios, he always gives me the wrong answer or he just gives me the
> answer I'm looking for, but I know he doesn't get it. Basically, I think
> he'd be duped into going. So far, he's tried leaving school with
> different moms, just because he wants to carpool. The moms have to come
> find me and I see him tagging along behind.
To be honest in this case I would concentrate on teaching him not to go with
anyone without telling you. Including people he knows. That he has to come
and tell you and the other person saying "I've told mum" or "I'll phone mum"
is not good enough.
Try some books with scenarios where the child is offered sweets/lift home/to
see the puppies.
#1 had a good one from the library, but I can't remember what it was called,
but it was about a girl who loved dogs and a man offered to take her to see
some puppies, and as she was going an older child stopped her and said she
had to tell mummy. The man says that he knows mummy and it will be fine, but
the older child stands firm. So the man says he'll phone mummy when they get
to his house, at which point the older child starts yelling for help, and
the man runs off. The girl is really disappointed not to see the puppies,
but they then explain to her that she mustn't go anywhere without telling
mummy.
Debbie

[toypup]

"Welches" > wrote in message
...
>
> "toypup" > wrote in message
> et...
>>
>> "<snip>
>> FWIW, I try telling DS not to go with anyone for any reason without
>> asking me first (or another adult if I'm not there) no matter what, even
>> if I know that person. So far, it hasn't sunken in, since when I give
>> him different
>> scenarios, he always gives me the wrong answer or he just gives me the
>> answer I'm looking for, but I know he doesn't get it. Basically, I think
>> he'd be duped into going. So far, he's tried leaving school with
>> different moms, just because he wants to carpool. The moms have to come
>> find me and I see him tagging along behind.
> To be honest in this case I would concentrate on teaching him not to go
> with anyone without telling you. Including people he knows. That he has to
> come and tell you and the other person saying "I've told mum" or "I'll
> phone mum" is not good enough.

I am working on that. He's just not getting it.

[Welches]

"toypup" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Welches" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "toypup" > wrote in message
>> et...
>>>
>>> "<snip>
>>> FWIW, I try telling DS not to go with anyone for any reason without
>>> asking me first (or another adult if I'm not there) no matter what, even
>>> if I know that person. So far, it hasn't sunken in, since when I give
>>> him different
>>> scenarios, he always gives me the wrong answer or he just gives me the
>>> answer I'm looking for, but I know he doesn't get it. Basically, I
>>> think
>>> he'd be duped into going. So far, he's tried leaving school with
>>> different moms, just because he wants to carpool. The moms have to come
>>> find me and I see him tagging along behind.
>> To be honest in this case I would concentrate on teaching him not to go
>> with anyone without telling you. Including people he knows. That he has
>> to come and tell you and the other person saying "I've told mum" or "I'll
>> phone mum" is not good enough.
>
> I am working on that. He's just not getting it.
Sorry, I didn't mean that you weren't working on that. I meant that I'd
concentrate on that rather than introduce something else at present. I know
if #1 isn't geting something, then introducing another scenario confuses her
further.
Debbie

[[email protected]]

When I taught "little kickers" classes, we taught them to yell,
"Stranger Danger! Stranger Danger!" until someone came to help them.
That way it was somewhat fun to say, so they would remember it, and it
would get the attention of others.

Then we'd practice in class with different adults (a parent of one of
the kids, or a student from one of the older Tae Kwon Do classes)
acting as the stranger.

Joan

On Nov 14, 10:26 am, "toypup" > wrote:
> I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
> they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
> recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
> come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
> recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
> recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
> naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.
>
> Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
> being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
> tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a tantruming
> child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I would know
> something is wrong.
>
> Coupled with my observations, I've yet to hear a story of a child saving
> him/herself by yelling, "He's not my dad!" I have, however, heard of
> children saving themselves by yelling "Help!" In fact, one story that
> stands out in my mind, the child was being hauled from the bathroom out of
> the store when he yelled, "Help!" and a woman who was part of the rescue
> said she knew he was being abducted, because a child doesn't normally yell
> "Help!" when it's his own parent.
>
> So, what do you all think?

[Marie]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> When I taught "little kickers" classes, we taught them to yell,
> "Stranger Danger! Stranger Danger!" until someone came to help them.
> That way it was somewhat fun to say, so they would remember it, and it
> would get the attention of others.
>
> Then we'd practice in class with different adults (a parent of one of
> the kids, or a student from one of the older Tae Kwon Do classes)
> acting as the stranger.
>
> Joan
>

Hmm, that's a really good phrase to use.

[toypup]

"Welches" > wrote in message
...

> Sorry, I didn't mean that you weren't working on that. I meant that I'd
> concentrate on that rather than introduce something else at present. I
> know if #1 isn't geting something, then introducing another scenario
> confuses her further.
> Debbie

I'm not actually sending him to a class or even introducing the concept. I
was thinking about it and the thought occurred to me that the phrase didn't
make much sense to even teach, so I was throwing the idea out there to get
opinions. Sorry I wasn't clear.

[toypup]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> When I taught "little kickers" classes, we taught them to yell,
> "Stranger Danger! Stranger Danger!" until someone came to help them.
> That way it was somewhat fun to say, so they would remember it, and it
> would get the attention of others.
>
> Then we'd practice in class with different adults (a parent of one of
> the kids, or a student from one of the older Tae Kwon Do classes)
> acting as the stranger.

I'm thinking it may be even less effective than "You're not my dad!" For
one thing, it's not something they'll get to practice more than in your
class. How long is the session? You see, kids say "help" all the time when
they need help: "Help" when they need their shoes tied, "help" when they
need orange juice, "help" when they need their butts wiped. "Help" is a
natural phrase they use whenever they need help, and it is more likely to
slip out automatically when they need help than a phrase they've only used a
few times in a course. If they learn they must use a special phrase for a
special circumstance, I wonder if they will hit a mental block in the panic
and not remember to say anything.

Second, "Stranger Danger!" sounds like it might be a game or something. If
I heard kids yelling that outside, I may figure they are playing a game
called "Stranger Danger!" It is not something highly publicized that all
adults would know to respond to, unlike "You're not my Dad!" At least that
phrase is taught enough for everyone to understand.

I think one problem with karate class ATM is that DS is over-confident that
he can take anyone down. He's only a white belt.

[Stephanie]

"toypup" > wrote in message
t...
>I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
>they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
>recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
>come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
>recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
>recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
>naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.
>


If it were me, I wonder if I wouldn't teach my child to yell "Fire!" I
remember reading somewhere that if a woman is being raped and needs help
that is what she should yell, since no one is afraid to intervene ... say
call the fire department, where for some reason people won't intervene in a
rape. The same thing seems to apply to children in staged (which is the only
ones I have seen) abductions.

> Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
> being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
> tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a
> tantruming child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I
> would know something is wrong.
>
> Coupled with my observations, I've yet to hear a story of a child saving
> him/herself by yelling, "He's not my dad!"



I saw a news clip that showed that neither help nor your not my Dad did a
whit of good. Something like 10 people walked right on by before some big
burly dudes finally intervened.


> I have, however, heard of children saving themselves by yelling "Help!"
> In fact, one story that stands out in my mind, the child was being hauled
> from the bathroom out of the store when he yelled, "Help!" and a woman who
> was part of the rescue said she knew he was being abducted, because a
> child doesn't normally yell "Help!" when it's his own parent.
>
> So, what do you all think?
>

I may be full of garbage with the fire thing. But that is where my instinct
is.

[Clisby]

Stephanie wrote:
> "toypup" > wrote in message
> t...
>
>>I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
>>they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
>>recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
>>come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
>>recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
>>recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
>>naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.
>>
>
>
>
> If it were me, I wonder if I wouldn't teach my child to yell "Fire!" I
> remember reading somewhere that if a woman is being raped and needs help
> that is what she should yell, since no one is afraid to intervene ... say
> call the fire department, where for some reason people won't intervene in a
> rape. The same thing seems to apply to children in staged (which is the only
> ones I have seen) abductions.
>
>

But I think that was for the case where you heard someone screaming, but
couldn't actually see what was happening. I'm picturing being in a
public place, and seeing an adult hauling away a child, who is
screaming, "Fire!" I can see there's no fire, so I'm certainly not
going to call the fire department. I'm not sure it would occur to me
to think, "Abduction!" as opposed to "Brat!"

Clisby



>>Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
>>being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
>>tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a
>>tantruming child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I
>>would know something is wrong.
>>
>>Coupled with my observations, I've yet to hear a story of a child saving
>>him/herself by yelling, "He's not my dad!"
>
>
>
>
> I saw a news clip that showed that neither help nor your not my Dad did a
> whit of good. Something like 10 people walked right on by before some big
> burly dudes finally intervened.
>
>
>
>> I have, however, heard of children saving themselves by yelling "Help!"
>>In fact, one story that stands out in my mind, the child was being hauled
>>from the bathroom out of the store when he yelled, "Help!" and a woman who
>>was part of the rescue said she knew he was being abducted, because a
>>child doesn't normally yell "Help!" when it's his own parent.
>>
>>So, what do you all think?
>>
>
>
> I may be full of garbage with the fire thing. But that is where my instinct
> is.
>
>

[Cathy Weeks]

toypup wrote:

> Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
> being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
> tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a tantruming
> child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I would know
> something is wrong.

My daughter has screamed "help!" when she was tantruming. Now, it was
at home, and once at the neighbor's, and not in "public" when it
happened, so it was no big deal, but I'm not so sure "Help!" would make
me do more than pay extra careful attention.

Cathy Weeks

[Rosalie B.]

"Cathy Weeks" > wrote:

>toypup wrote:
>
>> Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
>> being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
>> tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a tantruming
>> child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I would know
>> something is wrong.
>
>My daughter has screamed "help!" when she was tantruming. Now, it was
>at home, and once at the neighbor's, and not in "public" when it
>happened, so it was no big deal, but I'm not so sure "Help!" would make
>me do more than pay extra careful attention.
>
When I saw the reenactment of the abduction where the child was
screaming and passersby kept passing by until two young men intervened
- my own reaction was that she wasn't really afraid - while she was
screaming and struggling, there was no terror in her voice, and so I
wouldn't have done anything either.

[Welches]

"toypup" > wrote in message
t...
>I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
>they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
>recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
>come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
>recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
>recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
>naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.
>
> Now, I understand the reason for, "Your're not my dad!" A child who is
> being dragged screaming out of a store may look like s/he's throwing a
> tantrum. But "help!" would work much better. I've yet to see a
> tantruming child yell "Help!" It would definitely get my attention and I
> would know something is wrong.
>
> Coupled with my observations, I've yet to hear a story of a child saving
> him/herself by yelling, "He's not my dad!" I have, however, heard of
> children saving themselves by yelling "Help!" In fact, one story that
> stands out in my mind, the child was being hauled from the bathroom out of
> the store when he yelled, "Help!" and a woman who was part of the rescue
> said she knew he was being abducted, because a child doesn't normally yell
> "Help!" when it's his own parent.
>
> So, what do you all think?
I was thinking about this last night when there was an incident outside our
house.
I could hear a (guess) teenage girl screaming something along the lines of
"get off". Actually this sort of thing (particularly Friday/Saturday) is
reasonably common, and when you look out it's something like a group of
"youth" messing around-obviously friendly. I looked out of the window and
could see a group behind the bus stop, but couldn't see what they were
doing. As there was still screaming going on (saying the same thing) I
reached for the phone to call 999, but then someone came round got into a
car and drove off, and the screaming stopped.
On the basis that all then looked calm I didn't phone, but judging from the
police presence half an hour later, something had happened.
I was trying to work out what would have got my attention enough to get me
immediately phoning for the police. "Help" certainly wouldn't have-I guess I
hear that frequently enough not to react. Nor would just the cry of "police"
as again, the teenagers that hang out round there use that frequently.
"He's got a knife" was the most likely for me to react I decided, although
that may be because I've been in a situation where that was used for real.
"Someone get the police" would get more reaction from me than just "police"
I think.
Certainly what the person was screaming was ambiguous enough to be put with
just fooling around.
So really you need to find something that an adult would react to quickly.
Part of the problem with "get off" was it didn't sound important enough to
phone the police without seeing what was happening.
Debbie

[toypup]

"Clisby" > wrote in message
nk.net...
>
>
> Stephanie wrote:
>> "toypup" > wrote in message
>> t...
>>
>>>I was thinking of having DS take a safety course, but I'm pretty sure
>>>they'll teach this phrase. I just don't think it is a very good
>>>recommendation. When I'm in a panic, I lose my voice. It's hard to even
>>>come up with a sound, much less an entire sentence. I propose that the
>>>recommendation be "Help!" It's so simple. I wonder why that wasn't the
>>>recommended phrase to begin with. If there was anything that would come
>>>naturally for a child to scream, it would be that.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If it were me, I wonder if I wouldn't teach my child to yell "Fire!" I
>> remember reading somewhere that if a woman is being raped and needs help
>> that is what she should yell, since no one is afraid to intervene ... say
>> call the fire department, where for some reason people won't intervene in
>> a rape. The same thing seems to apply to children in staged (which is the
>> only ones I have seen) abductions.
>>
>>
>
> But I think that was for the case where you heard someone screaming, but
> couldn't actually see what was happening. I'm picturing being in a public
> place, and seeing an adult hauling away a child, who is screaming, "Fire!"
> I can see there's no fire, so I'm certainly not going to call the fire
> department. I'm not sure it would occur to me to think, "Abduction!" as
> opposed to "Brat!"

True.

[toypup]

"Welches" > wrote in message
...
> On the basis that all then looked calm I didn't phone, but judging from
> the police presence half an hour later, something had happened.
> I was trying to work out what would have got my attention enough to get me
> immediately phoning for the police. "Help" certainly wouldn't have-I guess
> I hear that frequently enough not to react. Nor would just the cry of
> "police" as again, the teenagers that hang out round there use that
> frequently.
> "He's got a knife" was the most likely for me to react I decided, although
> that may be because I've been in a situation where that was used for real.
> "Someone get the police" would get more reaction from me than just
> "police" I think.
> Certainly what the person was screaming was ambiguous enough to be put
> with just fooling around.
> So really you need to find something that an adult would react to quickly.
> Part of the problem with "get off" was it didn't sound important enough to
> phone the police without seeing what was happening.
> Debbie

I've called for help for people on a number of occasions. Tone of voice
works for me, but I've called when I wasn't sure but it was possibly
serious. Better safe than sorry.

[Welches]

"toypup" > wrote in message
m...
>
> "Welches" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On the basis that all then looked calm I didn't phone, but judging from
>> the police presence half an hour later, something had happened.
>> I was trying to work out what would have got my attention enough to get
>> me immediately phoning for the police. "Help" certainly wouldn't have-I
>> guess I hear that frequently enough not to react. Nor would just the cry
>> of "police" as again, the teenagers that hang out round there use that
>> frequently.
>> "He's got a knife" was the most likely for me to react I decided,
>> although that may be because I've been in a situation where that was used
>> for real. "Someone get the police" would get more reaction from me than
>> just "police" I think.
>> Certainly what the person was screaming was ambiguous enough to be put
>> with just fooling around.
>> So really you need to find something that an adult would react to
>> quickly. Part of the problem with "get off" was it didn't sound important
>> enough to phone the police without seeing what was happening.
>> Debbie
>
> I've called for help for people on a number of occasions. Tone of voice
> works for me, but I've called when I wasn't sure but it was possibly
> serious. Better safe than sorry.
Yes, but if I called every time I heard a teenager sreaming by the bus stop
then I'd probably call on average more than once a week. This is the first
time (in 6 years) that I haven't called and it looked like maybe I should
have.
Debbie

[Sarah Vaughan]

Clisby wrote:
>
>
> Stephanie wrote:

>> If it were me, I wonder if I wouldn't teach my child to yell "Fire!" I
>> remember reading somewhere that if a woman is being raped and needs
>> help that is what she should yell, since no one is afraid to intervene
>> ... say call the fire department, where for some reason people won't
>> intervene in a rape. The same thing seems to apply to children in
>> staged (which is the only ones I have seen) abductions.
>>
>>
>
> But I think that was for the case where you heard someone screaming, but
> couldn't actually see what was happening. I'm picturing being in a
> public place, and seeing an adult hauling away a child, who is
> screaming, "Fire!" I can see there's no fire, so I'm certainly not
> going to call the fire department. I'm not sure it would occur to me
> to think, "Abduction!" as opposed to "Brat!"

Also, how would it help if you did call the fire department? By the
time they arrive, the abductor is going to have dragged the kid away if
that's what they're doing. What you want is something that would get
people to come in and help immediately (and, no, I don't have any
brilliant ideas either!).


--
http://www.goodenoughmummy.typepad.com

"That which can be destroyed by the truth, should be" - P. C. Hodgell

[Stephanie]

"Sarah Vaughan" > wrote in message
...
> Clisby wrote:
>>
>>
>> Stephanie wrote:
>
>>> If it were me, I wonder if I wouldn't teach my child to yell "Fire!" I
>>> remember reading somewhere that if a woman is being raped and needs help
>>> that is what she should yell, since no one is afraid to intervene ...
>>> say call the fire department, where for some reason people won't
>>> intervene in a rape. The same thing seems to apply to children in staged
>>> (which is the only ones I have seen) abductions.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> But I think that was for the case where you heard someone screaming, but
>> couldn't actually see what was happening. I'm picturing being in a
>> public place, and seeing an adult hauling away a child, who is screaming,
>> "Fire!" I can see there's no fire, so I'm certainly not going to call
>> the fire department. I'm not sure it would occur to me to think,
>> "Abduction!" as opposed to "Brat!"
>
> Also, how would it help if you did call the fire department? By the time
> they arrive, the abductor is going to have dragged the kid away if that's
> what they're doing. What you want is something that would get people to
> come in and help immediately (and, no, I don't have any brilliant ideas
> either!).
>

I guess for some reason having something going on other than what is
expected might trigger an actual thought in the on-looker rather than the
filters through which we apply things? I know it was a wacky thought. Which
is why I used words like wonder and such. In the world I live in, abduction
is such a small risk compared to other things.

>
> --
> http://www.goodenoughmummy.typepad.com
>
> "That which can be destroyed by the truth, should be" - P. C. Hodgell
>